You only want Sym as a support because she has always been one

General Discussion
41

Im applauding the OP here. Awesome thread. To be support she would need to be able to match how important consistent healing is.

42

But your acting like symmetra’s ultimate is bad BECAUSE it gets countered by tracer. You said it was unbalanced because of that which isn’t true

The definition of being balanced is being “not too strong or too weak”

43

Can you please quote where I said Symmetra’s ultimate is bad because it gets countered by Tracer? You can just copy and paste or use the quote feature on the site.

44

Well maybe if they would revert some of her nerfs she could.

45

You said it was unbalanced because if the team doesn’t find it then they have less of a chance of winning but if they have a hero that counters it (like tracer) then it’s easy to destroy it. That’s not really unbalanced that’s just a counter

46

Once again can you find the quote where I said the ultimate was “bad”. As you can see I am quoting you saying that I said the ultimate is “bad”. So please unless you don’t understand what the word “unbalanced” is, you can find where I said it was bad.

47

I’m trying to say that’s the Ultimate is not unbalanced like you think it is. It’s perfectly balanced. When I mean “bad” I mean “not a well thought out ability” and I think her ult 's a well thought out ability.

48

I disagree completely. When the game first came around we only had Mercy, Zen, and Symm. They had originally intended on having more utility supports but people only ever wanted more healing so here we are.

Symm has four supportive aspects to her kit which is more than any other character in the entire game. She has her teleport, shield gen, protective barrier and speed debuffs. As far as the defensive part of her kit she only has her turrets. When compared to torb he only has his little 75 armor packs and everything else is intended for defence. Same goes for 76 yes he has his healing field but that is the only ability in his kit.

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49

I remember a lot of people saying “Sombra is really a support” for a long time.

50

When pro teams ran Sombra (with health pack ult), guess what role they usually swap out for her?

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51

Yeah I agree and I think it’s somewhat annoying that Zarya got the real shielding ability and that probably the reason for symmetra not to have it is just to avoid overlap

Hopefully her rework will still be utility based since they mentioned they tried moving her to another role but it feeling highly out of place, they probably tried making her “defense” (as Widow’s “defense”) and it just didn’t work out

52

Most of the tanks (besides roadhog) have some way to protect have someway to protect their allies. Orisa winston and Reinhardt have barriers, dva has defense matrix and zarya has her bubbles. I guess it is kinda weird to give symmetra a barrier since she’s a support but the shield itself has much lower health unlike rein’s winston’s, and orisa. Brigitte also has a shield but it only has 600 health which it why they felt like it was okay to put it on her.

53

The reason for the 1 HP on the turrets is because not only the slow but the damage stacks.

And at 180 combined DPS in the carwash the only thing that can get through it is a tank with an auto aim cleave.

If you wanted to give them health you would need to basically eliminate for the most part the carwash capabilities.

54

I don’t care what she’s called because she doesn’t fill any role well right now. She doesn’t have the support to be that 2nd support slot in most ranks. If there’s no reason to take her as a support then there’s even less reason to take her in a DPS slot. Why take someone who has no reliable form of damage when an enemy is outside 10 meters, has many counters, and has to set up to be any good. Especially when you could take Soldier who can do the same or more damage from further away, have less counters, be useful on every map and against every enemy, while also having basic mobility and sustain.

When your “niche” hero isn’t necessarily better in their niche than a jack of all trades, then we have a problem. No matter what role the devs say she gets to fill, her kit needs to be reworked either way. Her turrets and barrier are both too weak. Honestly, I like Sym’s weapon, but I can realistically see that changing, a lot and in many ways, because that thing has no reliable way to deal damage outside of a few meters. For something that takes up half her kit power, that’s pretty bad.

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55

if you build your team like she is a defense hero you will struggle, if you build like she is an off support, you have the best chance at succeeding.

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56

I hope they just buff her turrets and weapon. It’s so satisfying to kill a genji trying to use deflect to escape with it. If they had to remove an ability then I’d choose her proton barrier because even though like it all her other abilities seem more important to her

57

I’d love it if they did that, but realistically I don’t think they can. If they buff her weapon without changing how some part of it works, then it’s either going to be OP or not solve the problems the weapon has to begin with. Although, I’m pretty sure it’ll keep the beam quality (and therefore counter Genji), because they seem to want to keep Sym’s hard light aspect in her kit.

Sym’s weapon is one of the reasons that she’s not very good at higher ranks and is oppressive in the lowest tiers. However, I think that her weapon would be fine if the rest of her kit was less niche. But in order for Sym to be used in comp some part of her kit has to be more active than it currently is; either her weapon or her utility; (and no, that doesn’t mean it requires aim.) It just means that half of Sym’s kit can’t be spent waiting 1/2 the match for the enemy to be in just the right position.

58

Yeah, because of the power budget dumped into it, I’ve been saying this repeatedly like everywhere. But shifting it to a minor means we can shove that power elsewhere, so its not as polarized. Idk why your quoting at me, it having to much power budget is why it’s problematic. Shifting it to a minor means shaving that power away and given to something else.

I keep pointing to the Hanzo rework, but it is a perfect example of this situation. Too much of his power budget was placed in his scatter arrow, so they shaved power away from elsewhere; the design however was very polarizing, it worked and killed someone or did nothing. By shaving power out of its instant capability and bounce, they were able to pump up the rest of his kit. He now is getting a mobility ability and faster fire rate (both new ability and actual charge up).

What should happen is the same here, frees up budget, shaves polarizing, opens potential design space, and allows her other stuff to be buffed.

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59

Great points!

The reason I want her to remain support is because of the lack of supports in the game. Granted that’s getting better, but sym creates a new play style for those in support.

Likewise, if she is placed in defense, she will be taking a dps slot in people’s standard 2-2-2. Making her more likely to be unused.

Not only that but 2 defensive turret characters? I fear with this that sym or torb will always be picked over another.

It seems more efficient to create a dynamic support defense crossover than to rework her to a dps.

I also would prefer that they just gave up at this point and made her heal :confused:

60

Honestly, yeah I concur with this. I’m a support player, always have been. If they give Symmetra heals, I’d be glad to have her stay support. But if not, then it just doesn’t fit to me.