That really only sounds reasonable to believe in circumstances that aren’t ordinary (extreme ends of the ladder, grouping with someone that has a large variance, off peak times where people aren’t queueing, etc.).
In order for that to happen, it would require a significant divergence in MMR to exist in a match, and I don’t think we have solid grounds to simply assume that’s ‘normal’.
You’re right, it wouldn’t happen “100% of the time.” I edited my last post to clarify.
It might sound like an extreme scenario, but it might be a lot more common than you think. And we see shades of it in every match.
Without seeing the MMR, it’s hard to pinpoint it exactly, but I could pretty easily see having the next 4-5 lowest in most of the games where I see players stacking with people far lower than them. That, on its own, takes it from being “very rare” and simply puts it in an “uncommon” territory, 'cause I see stacks quite a bit that I don’t necessarily think she be allowed to play together (Diamonds grouped with Golds, for example).
On the flip-side, I don’t know that you could reasonably blame the system and label it as handicapping at that point. The higher ranked person that is grouping with the lower ranked person should already know they’ll be forced to carry the lower ranked person, and thus are willingly accepting the challenge. The higher ranked person couldn’t reasonably complain they had weaker players on their team, as they’re the one that is actually signing up for it to happen.
Because I’ve climbed from Bronze to almost Diamond, and there is the tendency of Golds trying more to win, while Plats tend to refuse to form a proper comp or switch.
If you have been in Diamond from the start, then good for you.
I don’t know about Diamond and above, but from what everyone is saying, from what I’ve seen from youtubers, the matches are more tolerable.
My goal is to climb as a support. The DPS I’m getting are terrible, and I would argue – worse than those of the enemy team. Not every single game, but in many games. As a support, It’s hard to play around that.
It also appears, that I’m performing worse and worse throughout the seasons. I’ve dropped from high plat to mid gold in my effort to climb as a support. For some reason, it simply doesn’t work.
Also, saying “pick DPS and carry” wont solve my problem, as it would defeat the purpose of climbing as a support.
I’ll keep on playing, I’ll keep on picking support, and see if I drop even further for whatever reason.
It should be like you say in theory. However, I no longer believe that to be the case. Unfortunately, there is no replay system and MMR is not visible. Neither I, nor you have any data to prove or disprove this hypothesis of mine. And honestly, your confidence in the system despite zero data to back it up almost reminds me of religion.
Unfortunately, until I am able to compare my gameplay to that of allies and enemies, so there is some human analysis of performance instead of numbers deprived of nuance, Blizzard’s system cannot be proven to be faulty. Doesn’t mean, that it isn’t, but I don’t see what we can do to verify one way or another.
Higher ranks as Orisa. Team use my barriers. I get heals. Dps finish off kills I am too static to follow up. My dps kill off halted enemies. Dps pump out enough damage to stop enemy Mcree just walking straight through my shield and hammering me to death.
Lower ranks as Orisa. Team just merrily walks through my barriers all day long and get put down like dogs. Sporadic healing as my supports are off pocketing their duo partner dps. No follow up on halted targets. No follow up on enemies I’ve got down to 10health before they’re able to hide from my Los.
Enemies just merrily waltz up to me and kill me as the dps are all on mad flanks or admiring the scenery.
Similar issue with Rein. I recall a game where Rein and I (Moira) went left to point. Our 4 elite dps went right, lost the 4v6 as they then encountered the entire enemy team. I mean, what’s so hard about actually following your shield tank?
Sure, if you’re a dps, or can otherwise frag out then lower ELO is easier. But if you’re trying to play a more team dependent hero then lower ELO can really hurt as the stupid is strong down there…
I’ve literally experienced the opposite. I’d even go so far as to say that plat is where the “real” competitive mode starts. Everything below that is just a mess.
I’d argue that your DPS players always seem worse because they aren’t being supported properly.
Fortunately, we can just use common sense, that says, “this game is NOT out to make you and ONLY YOU lose games.”
Suuuure…
I don’t know on what rating you are, but if you have an account in Plat, feel free to add me and test me.
I’m not looking for a boost though. If you are 3K+ player, I don’t wanna do comp, but I’m willing to do a Custom Game.
I have no desire to “test” you. I’m just pointing out that it’s less likely that your DPS players are “always worse,” and more likely that you simply aren’t supporting them well.
I understand what you’re saying on theory, but in reality I do everything that I can. We’re not talking being a DPS Moira here, that ignores her team.
Even platinum seems like a mess to me. I’ve heard that Match Making Rating goes into effect (used for handicapping) at Platinum and below.
whoever gets last place in the NFL gets first round draft pick the next year. the title of this post needs reworded.
In my experience, MMR is used in tiers above platinum too tbh.
Also I would agree with the above poster that plat is where “real” competitive starts - there’s a noticeable increase in teamwork and game knowledge when compared to lower tiers, but it still feels like a mess because it’s just the start
Well, given that this is the Competitive Overwatch forum, I think it’s clear we aren’t talking about other forms of competitive play. There are bigger hurdles to players’ understanding of this problem.
The biggest problem is that Blizzard has never fully defined Match Making Rating for Overwatch players. They have been extremely glib about how it works, and it’s not even represented in the game’s user interface. But the fact is that Competitive Play is handicapped, and Blizzard has done what they can to keep players ignorant of that fact.
this is how you make your arguments in the original post…
If the sky is blue and trees are green, that means cows go meow.
If Jupiter is further from the Sun than Mars, we can conclude that shoes are something that people wear on their hands.
you write like this:
fact
fact
fact
wild accusation
just wanted to get that out their while I had you on the line
Participants must be privy to what they are participating in. Bottom line.
If you find holes in my argument, they are the holes from our many gaps in knowledge about MMR. And if you do I’d like to hear what those are, rather than false equivalencies.
When someone concludes that cows go meow because trees are green, you can’t beat that person in an argument.
You’re not commenting on anything that I have actually said. That means we are not having an argument right now. This isn’t even a conversation.
Use direct quotes if you mean to challenge me on something. You’re the lazy writer, not me.
this is the lease productive match
Why do you say that? Such a match would likely result in relatively bad players ranking down, and relatively good players ranking up. And if they had all been placed on their teams randomly, the match is perfectly fair. That is why I say it’s the most productive match possible; because it increases the accuracy of every player’s ranking.
would you be willing to talk over voice comms?
I’d love to have a discussion about this. I dread writing and reading about it ![:slight_smile:](https://d74zh8edaijub.cloudfront.net/en/overwatch/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")