The matchmaker isn’t trying to force 50% winrates. If you climb you get put against better players and lose. If you drop too far you get matched against worse players and win. If your winrate is 50% you are exactly where you should be.
Yes it is, you just actually have to improve to do so
Ya like, in all that “experience”, never actually trying to understand the game and instead spouting off absolutely incorrect nonsense.
Season 2 was an absolute cluster in plat because there were a ton of people who should have been higher and a ton of people who should have been lower leading to wildly inconsistent games. I was between 2900-2999 season 2. I was 3600+ the rest of the seasons after.
And that new account is going to end up exactly where your old account is
The thing is, the matchmaker almost never finds players similar to your skill level so it throws at you either too strong or too weak opponents just to keep you at the 50%. That is not good matchmaking if the quality of the match doesn’t offer you a fair fight.
That is not however how a good ranking system should work. It gives you no initiative to play beyond the placement matches. Once you finish them, you spot is secure and you don’t have to do a thing.
A good system should be climbable though playing more consistently. Ofc that doesn’t mean everyone should be able to farm it, if you play bad, you will still go down. This is also why most games have rank reset after a season so your spot is not secure and you will have to prove yourself again.
The whole point of comp is to find the level you belong at and play with similar opponents. Realistically, you shouldn’t be constantly climbing, and should just play for the sake of it.
Most people like to believe they’re above average and should be able to climb to the top because of it, but obviously that’s impossible. Accepting that truth is unfortunately a part of comp.
I agree that there’s little incentive to keep playing once you realize you are where you belong, but how would you suggest actually fixing this?
Extending decay down to the bottom of Bronze so people have to constantly play and maintain their rank?
lol WHAT? “The only way to climb is to improve so that gives you no incentive to improve” that statements makes absolutely zero sense.
If someone only ever did their placements then they would never actually find their SR. Placements are only 10 games. That not enough to lock in your SR. You actually need placements+ about 15 games for your SR to even stabilize at the beginning of a season. Let alone show improvement or degradation in your skill.
No. That is a BAD system. If I can hit anything above silver just by “playing a lot” then that is a bad system. That is a system that has absolutely no bearing on my skill as a player compared to the rest of the playerbase. All that shows is how much time I get to dedicate.
But here’s the thing. If you a playing the game and actually playing, not playing like a bot or potato, then you’ll climb anyway just by playing more already. You just need to be constantly improving. Always look for your mistakes and ways to correct them.
I swear, this community wants to all be plat while still being able to play like a bronze. I’m sorry the system just does not, and should not, ever work that way.
No, they don’t. OW doesn’t even care about your SR when making a match. The only time it takes that into account is it finds people with a similar MMR at your SR to match you with, but otherwise? The MMR is used to create the matches, not the SR. The SR is a simplified visual display of your MMR (if you play enough competitive) that can give you a rough idea, but if you only ever play your placements and don’t touch comp again until the next season then your MMR and SR will be significantly different.
Then what is even the point of playing comp once when you get to the rank where you belong (not to mention it is not the case most of the time considering you will see very good and very bad ppl in the same rank)
As I said, do it like in other games: climbable ladder with season rank reset. Hearthstone uses that and it works much better. idk why the OW team is so stubborn and don’t want to admit that their ranking system is a failure.
That’s what already happens. At the start of new season you have to do placements again. Rank reset.
If you’re asking for an MMR reset, that’s completely different. That would be an absolute train wreck. You would have GM players playing with bronze. You’d have Silver and Diamonds in the same game. It would be absolute chaos for at least a month until things settled down and then everyone would pretty much be back to where they are now and nothing would change.
The system we have no is not nearly as broken as you think it is. You just don’t understand it. (Not saying this to be rude). Check out Kawuumba’s post about how ranked MMR, SR, gains and losses and the accuracy of the system ties together. He also includes references to developer responses where appropriate. Nothing is guesswork except where explicitly mentioned.
Also, I have never heard of a single game that did a complete reset of a ladder at the start of a new season. Even Hearthstone doesn’t appear to do that. It takes your previous rank and then drops you down a bit at the start of a new season.
That’s both an easier system to program AND to feel like you’re climbing, but it’s also deceptive because Hearthstone is played 1 on 1 and not 6 on 6. A system like Hearthstone wouldn’t work as well in Overwatch because there are 12 people playing at once rather than 2.
It doesn’t look like League does any kind of reset between seasons. I could be wrong here but a quick look leads me to think otherwise.
HoTS ranked system include a similar reset to OW but the placement matches are weighed more heavily than they are here as the matchmaking restrictions are looser for ‘unranked’ players.
I haven’t bothered to look into Dota 2 or CSGO or anything else as of yet but if you can point me toward a game that does a ‘hard reset’ between each season I would be interested in seeing that as, like I said, I have never seen a game do that before.
Isn’t it kind of insane though to say that you’re definitely a bronze player on ALL characters, rather than realizing that person got ranked Gold or Plat on, idk, Reaper, but after they continue to play and play a variety of characters the game ends up middling their performance down to bronze?
I mean, I think we’re all waking up to the concept that not all players are going to be interchangeably good at things. Just because you’re a Diamond Mercy doesn’t mean you’re a Diamond Widowmaker, right?
It’s kind of nuts that we have ONE ranking for all these skills needed. I can play a pretty great Junkrat but I’m absolutely useless on Rein, but it’d slot me into the same team regardless of who I pick y’know?
Thank you. I thought that everyone was just going to keep going on about how “they just want to be in a higher rank than they deserve” and whatnot. That’s really not it. Heck, I want to reset mine because it placed me way too high one season. It became way too stressful, and I stopped playing as a result. I would like to reset mine so that I can get back into he rank I do deserve… Probably plat-diamond.
I still really want them to add role-based MMR/SR or something oops
So how would a RESET solve that? You’re right, people play different characters at different levels. I have three accounts, one for each role, and even those are different (my tank for example, is about 400 SR lower than my other two).
There’s no perfect system unless we were to actually have SR based off of each character, which would just be insane. A role based SR would be the closest we could get but even that wouldn’t be perfect.
Of course, if you’re a plat ranked player but a bronze widowmaker… you shouldn’t really be playing widowmaker in the first place, now should you? Even the T500 and OWL pros specialize in a handful of characters rather than trying to be the best at every single character of the cast.
I’m not saying that a reset would fix it, I’m just pointing out a pretty glaring flaw in the system of having only one rank that’s tied to an account rather than realizing that everyone is going to perform differently based on what hero they’re playing and how good they are with that specific hero.
Edit: Also, saying that just because you’re not good at a character means you can never play them is sorta crappy. Like I get it, no one wants that bad widow on their team, I don’t either - but also to then turn around and say “Hey buddy, I know this is your favorite character and it’s what you’d enjoy playing, but you’re just not allowed to play them, k?” is sorta… bad.
It clearly doesn’t. You continue from where you have left it the last season. Placement matches are just regular matches that you gain and lose sr from.
That’s a different discussion entirely and one I would agree whole heartedly on. But with the system we have in place now, anyone who expects to be able to play a “variety” of characters and still maintain their rank is delusional.
The most you should ever learn are 6 characters. One main tank, one off tank, one projectile DPS one hitscan DPS, one main support one off support. Beyond that you are just hurting your ability to improve and climb.
What? So you want Overwatch to artificially drop your SR for absolutely no reason just to give you the warm and fuzzies of constantly climbing? (Read: Wasting your time just to get back to where you were at the end of the last season)
That’s an even worse system. If anything you should be arguing for the removal of placement matches in general, but the primary reason they exist isn’t for the people that play every single season, it’s for the people that take a few seasons off from playing and then try to come back to the game. Letting them jump right back into the action exactly where they left off would be more harmful than not. Placement matches gatekeep you from that happening.
But for all intents and purposes, the current system IS a rank reset. The season ends, your rank is removed. When you do your placements, the game decides if you are good enough to maintain that rank and…viola. Your rank ‘hasn’t changed’ because of the ‘useless’ placement matches.
But if you were a plat player and took 8 seasons off and try to jump back in, you’ll lose a lot of your placement matches or not do very well and will drop significantly.
If, somehow, you were to improve between seasons then the inverse would happen. I managed to place about 120 SR higher this season than I ended last season. A surprise, but a pleasant one. A lot of times I’ve been right about where I was (which made sense, because I didn’t improve or degrade) or have placed slightly under.
I don’t see the issue with a reset after every season. Lots of people on the forums seem to have a religious belief in the perfection of the MMR system, so what difference would it make? If the MMR system placed you at, say, 2500 then surely it’d be impossible to get placed beyond a ballpark range of that after a reset since it already accurately places you at your true skill level.
Because a true reset would cause the top 500 players to play against the bottom 500 players. It would be taking the entire range of skill and saying “You can all play together now” and the matches would be absolutely chaotic until a month or two passed and everyone ended right back where they are now.
It is not a rank reset. Please go play some other games before talking nonsense.
Why even have placement matches between seasons if they are just regular matches?
Did… did you not read what I just said? I literally just explained why we have placement matches despite them being pretty much akin to regular matches.
I do play other games. I ALSO linked the wikipedia page for Hearthstone (which you brought up yourself) that mentioned how they handle rank reset, which isn’t even a real reset. It just drops your rank a bit.
I also looked at both HoTS and League and neither of those do a real reset either. I then challenged you to show me a game where they do a true reset, but you conveniently ignored that as well.
If you can prove me wrong, I am more than happy to admit it but I have never seen a game with a respectable ladder system that does a hard, full reset between each season.
The primary reason we were given for ranks NOT to reset each season is that it would be unfair for low MMR players to play against high MMR players for a few games at the start of each season.
The reality today is that Bronze is infested with smurfs and trolls. So what are we really protecting Bronze players from?
The answer is that it isn’t to protect low MMR players. It’s to keep high MMR players on top with minimal requirements to maintain their prestigious ranks. This idea that you only have to climb once is absurd, especially as much of a big deal that these players make out of how easy it is to climb to the rank they deserve. If it’s that easy, you should have no problem doing that each season.
