While the PTR is live, please try to test these changes

One assumes this yes, yet if you look at the rest of the game… Point is, you said she “feels good on PTR” A) having not played her, and B) ignoring the fact that all her many glaring issues makes it so saying she “Feels good on PTR” is an outright lie. She doesn’t feel good on PTR, she feels like a buggy, poorly animated mess, with a bad ult, dreadfully weak turrets and a knock off zarya gun.

Excusing them and praising them go hand in hand here; you, many other forum posters, many youtubers and overwatch personalities, all jump to defend every change put to PTR without actually looking at them, so many people think “well they’re the Devs, so they know best” and just blindly accept every change as perfect. They spent months on these changes, like minimum 2-3 but very likely closer to the 6 mark, they dedicated time and resources to designing and coding this. They didn’t throw it together in half a morning - which is exactly what the copious bugs, poor hitboxes and shabby animations imply - They spent a great deal of time making this, but it isn’t as good as it could be. Saying “The sym changes feel good” when they are fraught with problems is like watching your dog pee on the carpet and saying “What a good boy to not pee on the sofa”, you can’t only praise what they did right you have to admit to the glaring issues and point them out and call them out on them. “I’m glad the dog didn’t pee on the sofa this time, but outside would still be way better than on the carpet”, ya feel?

And to answer these together, i tested, and tested, and tested some more and there is no way, without a shadow of a doubt, that the new turrets are in anyway close, to being as strong as the old six. As far as I can tell, their damage is 30dps per turret totalling 90. The old 6 turrets did I believe 2̶5̶ ̶d̶p̶s̶?̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶a̶ ̶t̶o̶t̶a̶l̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶w̶h̶a̶t̶,̶ ̶1̶5̶0̶?̶ (Edit: decided to double check and wow, current turrets do 30, not 25, so they haven’t buffed them at all.) So no, they are not “similar if not more” damage to the old turrets, they are not “amazing now” they’re shallow imitations, they’re desperately underpowered, and she needs, 6.

Never said they had more power just said they are amazing and they are i was standing on a chandler launching turrets at a rein to make him turn around then pelting him with flying rasenshurikens

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Ana’s reload is not her biggest issue. Her biggest issue is that there’s no reason to play her over Mercy and Zen.

Giving her ultimate some form of speed boost back is the best way to give it relevance again since damage boost is often enough to let dps ultimates break certain thresholds (ohkoing Tracer, blading through Transcendence).

Sym’s M2 is borked. I filed a bug in the PTR Bug Report forums here: BUG: Symmetra M2 damage is wrong if orb is held

It would be nice to see it get a bit more attention.

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what are you talking about? She has been a great pick for the enemy team and for my team as well! I lot of Symmetra mains say that she feels good, different but good, but 100% not weak. She has been on the ptr for 3 days, give her time.

She’s been a great pick before! On the PTR people aren’t saying “ugh a sym guess I’ll throw too hahaha” and they’re actually working with her and trying, if people had put the same effort into playing with a sym instead of against her for the last 8 months, she wouldn’t be getting reworked right now.

And if you’d open you eyes for 2 seconds you’d see that there’re a lot of Sym mains saying she doesn’t feel good. There are a lot more non-sym players saying this is a good rework than actual sym players, because they’ve all jumped on the band wagon of “well she has to aim now, so this rework is obviously good!” and they’re drowning out the actual people who play her saying that she’s lost far more than just her lock on.

People like you are the problem, people who say

and Ignore the fact that we’ve known this was coming for 2 months, that we were told exactly what she’d be like ages ago and that we’ve spent those two months fighting to have it not be this bad.
She’s been on PTR for 3 days, and she’s been this new sym for 2 months, and 1 day on PTR is all you need to see her bugs, many of which will go to live un-fixed, to see her bad animations, none of which will be changed or addressed, to try her lazy stitched on zarya gun and know it feels bad to use, to use her Ult and see that it has nowhere near the usefulness of her old ults.

Yes she has only been on the PTR for 3 days, but before the changes hit PTR everyone said “it’s not on PTR yet don’t knock the changes till you try them”, and before that they said “We don’t know how they’re changing sym, don’t complain before the devs tell us something”. And when she’s been on PTR for a month? will it have been enough time then to say she has problems? or will we have to wait till she’s on live? on live for a month? in comp? in comp for a month?

We Know the changes, we can See the changes, we can Play the changes. We Know the problems, we can See the bugs, we can Play this worse version of Sym. We have given her time, months of it, months of fighting the devs, pushing back, trying to get them to concede something, and people like you have been there every step of the way saying give her time. No. They had time, now we want them to fix their damn mistakes.

If you really think the new Sym is worse then i have only one thing to say to you… such a lack of imagination :3

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If you really think she doesn’t need any fixes, buffs and further changes, then i only have one thing to say…

What… interesting ways your mind works

Corse she needs tweaking shes as fresh as Will Smith she could use another turret, make it so her animation works like moira and bends to the middle and fix it so her tp don’t suicide itself other than that shes puuuuuuuuuuuurfect

So many good ideas on this thread!

Here are my ideas for Reaper:


Shadowstep:

  • Removed

Wraith Form:

  • While active, Reaper gains the ability to fly for the duration of the ability.

This allows reaper to have some vertical mobility with the removal of Shadow Step. This idea is not mine by the way, I was unable to find the source.

New Ability: Grenade Shots

  • 4 second ability that converts Reaper’s shotguns to shoot small impact grenades, like in the first cinematic.

  • Grenades do 80 damage on a direct impact, with a small explosion radius and minimum damage of 15 per shot if you are only just inside the explosion radius.

  • Grenades have a very severe drop and a very slow travel time, and have a bit of damage falloff if used at longer ranges.

  • Unable to use Hellfire Shotguns while this ability is active, it cannot be canceled.


If this has already been suggested I will delete my post, I didn’t see it mentioned though.

Those are good starts, all the bare minimum she needs before hitting live, but actually going back to 6 turrets, lowing their absurdly long cooldown, and allowing for more choice for binding the TP activation button are the steps she needs after that to go from “playable” to “good”

Yer no her turrets are fine 4 would be nice simply cause symmetry putting weight on them was one of her biggest problems before the hero itself should be doing the lions share of the work not the lil balls they create, they slow down a target making them easy for her to bombard with her rasenshurikens putting 2 much emphasis on something you cant directly control is bad that’s one of the things that held her back and its whats holding Torby back hence his impending rework 2.

You… you can directly control them. you directly control where they are and how they are used. the point in 6 over 3 or 4 is that you have the choice to make a security grid. Also, now that i’m not in a game so i can finish this thought, She’s a builder, she builds things, the character is meant to in part rely on the constructs. She doesn’t need 6 because of the damage they offer, she needs 6 because of the tactical value having 6 gives, she can place them all over to tell where enemies are and where they are going. 6 turrets with low damage, medium slow, and good health is what she needs far more than these pathetic watered down things she has now. period

That’s because people did put in the work…for the last two years.

Look, I’m more than willing to give any hero a fair shake, and live Sym does have things that she’s good at.

Unfortunately, they’re too few and too far between for her to ever be viable in her current state. There is no amount of number tweaking that can make her live configuration viable without breaking her in some heinous way due to her strategic and tactical limitations.

You could balance her the way she is, but nobody but the sym players would enjoy a moment of it because she would have to be unfair.

The rework is a better direction.

Strongly, strongly disagree with everything here.

I have played sym everywhere, I have won with sym, everywhere. she is not limited to certain maps, to only defence on certain maps, she is limited by having teammates who refuse to work with her and see her value. Every comp game I go into, if I think sym is the right choice, I turn off chat, pick her, and dominate. and every time I turn chat back on at the end, scroll up and watch as “Not sym!!!” Switch!!!" changes to “Group up with us!! wow!”, because Sym is a good hero who can be used everywhere if you just let her.

What held her back was her numbers, they needed to adjust her damage ramp so it felt better to play against (I’ve suggested multiple ways to do this over the last year on these and the old forums) and lower all her absurd cooldowns, photon barrier to 8, turrets to 6, then buff the hp of her SG and TP (by 100) while making them visible to allies through walls. These changes would have, without making her Op, made her far more comfortable to play and easier to play with/around. But they never even tried that, they just slapped this hodge-podge rework onto her without a second thought.

Going further, they could have lessened the lock on effects range so it was easier to break free from, keeping the lock on and making it fairer to play against, They never tried that either, they could have given her old turrets longer deployment range without changing the amount, or given them some health and lowered their damage, never tired those things, they could have speed up all of her building animations and her secondary fire charge rate/travel speed to instantly fix her slow, some called it clunky, feel, but they never even tried that!

Sym’s issues were plain to see, all of her problems were small, simple things that the devs could have fixed easily without making her overpowered, they didn’t even need to do them all at once, they could have done what they’re doing with Doomfist, and slowly fixed one problem at a time over the last year and a half and she’d be great right now, but instead they spent a year and half sitting on their hands then threw us this lousy excuse for a rework.

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I think that it is pretty powerful, becaus you will oneshot all 200 hp heroes (140*2 = 280), also Reaper will destroy all tanks in 2.5 seconds…
So I can see it only that way:
Reaper’s alternative fire - 0.5 seconds after “click” sound Reaper use both shotguns at the same time, double the dmg. Cooldown = 4 seconds.

Keep the ideas up! I would update the thread tomorrow morning.

for meis walls to have a slippery surface for all players when climbing and walking on. for bastion to be able to cancel his ult or something to make it more reliable. for brigettes shield to regen health the same speed as reins, but her healing also heals her shield. make junkrat damaged slightly be his own bombs (not mines) so that he has to play more carefully. make syms (new) ult be clear for the team that used it, and more opaque (not to the point to where they cant see) so that the other team has to play more carefully when around it.

I use to play on the PTR and post a lot of feedback as well as bugs but they fell on deaf ears. I have stopped using the PTR for this now. I will only quickly login, see what a hero changes are like in the target range then log out.

I won’t waste time making long post. This happens to almost everyone else as well. Nothing will be adjusted or fixed till several months after it’s gone live if at all.

If others want to play on the PTR and give feedback then go ahead, I’m not telling you not to. Just be prepared for silence.

There is always a chance

cannot be done, it’s a transformation ultimate. Sorry bud