It works for Tf2’s design and character limitations. Charge isn’t as good as Doomfist combos but it does the job pretty well.
Doomfist dies a lot too, its something else they have in common. [quote=“Maxy-6374, post:16, topic:504428”]
Due in part to map design, rp jump and the way that slam lets you change direction the number of ways he can come at you is extremely high (Demo ain’t coming at you from above). Also unlike RP, his slam is mostly noiseless making it hard to work out where he’s coming from if you don’t happen to see his initial rp jump (though this isn’t limited to just doom, even footsteps have been stuffed for ages).
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For sure but I think thats just neccessary for the playstyle to work in Overwatch because Overwatch heroes are stronger than Tf2 classes.[quote=“Maxy-6374, post:16, topic:504428”]
I’d call it an exaggeration… I may be misremembering but I thought the ttk of the entire combo that would kill a squishy was still under a second
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It was as if the Doomfists were getting hit by flashbang mid combo. It looked and played like a stun had been built into his kit and it interfered with everything he would try to do besides spam rocket punch.
But Demoknight one shots too. The counterplay is outranging the Doomfist, he’s supposed to have a huge advantage in melee range because we get to shoot at him from afar and he can’t fight back until he gets to you. Its about teamwork and smarts, not traditional dueling.
Yeah but everyone expects it and just kills you out of range, and if you hit it you still need to get lucky. Plus, Demoknight can pack on somewhere close to 300 hp.
No, crits in tf2 are based on a system where you earn them, but they are still random, and certain mercs end up storing that luck because of how their kits work. This ends up giving Medic a really high crit chance.
So at its highest it was 0.5 seconds, I dunno if that’s particularly insane seeing as whoever you’ve caught is almost guaranteed death… =\
[quote=“Rocktopus-11683, post:18, topic:504428”]
But Demoknight one shots too. The counterplay is outranging the Doomfist [/quote]
Right, but he severely lacks the “range” that Doomfist has as I mentioned earlier. Tf2 is closer to a battlefront that becomes a no mans lands for anyone behind enemy lines. Demoknight isn’t really flanking the more vulnerable enemies that Doom takes out. He doesn’t really catch you by surprise. You see him charging at you from the front. I mean, occasionally he might behind enemy lines by hiding but this is the exception rather than the rule.
If you’re playing medic you’re relying on the team taking De
mo out, but you can also just stop him reaching you at all by playing around ledges but you can still heal/shoot/taunt. With Doom, there’s not really any cover you can take, you just have to hope your team saves you.
Also there’s no shields, barriers, long ranged healing to support the demoknight. Shields and other ranged healing abilities and natural cover/flanking paths mean Doom doesn’t have to deal with ranged damage until he’s close enough for the rp into upper combo
While I’m not completely opposed to this sorta thing I think the ttk is just too low to save people and supposed shortcomings of being a melee hero (and having a huge advantage in melee) aren’t an issue because of the map design and other the heroes that can support him. This is also where I think that the Demoknight comparison falls flat and why nobody really cares about Demoknight and people do complain about Doomfist.
I think I mentioned it above, but I think the biggest problem with Doom (and many one shot heroes) is how easily he can make it a 5v6. Also in the way he (like many flankers) kinda just ignores thousands of shield hp and (other than Hog) tanks. I like the Zarya-Doom match up though, but it feels far too easy to just wait out bubble being used then strike due to how crucial it is for Zarya to get/maintain damage to be relevant. Before they nerfed the DM range Dva also kinda worked out…
You must not have seen footage of it from ptr, it literally looked like an invisible Flash Bang hit Doomfist. You can’t play Doom when one of his abilities inflicts hard cc on the user. They actually kept the nerf too, but lessened it to a far less debilitating degree.
Doomfist is pretty vulnerable when he is exposed. He can take on players head on like that through luck or skill but usually its a lot more like Demoknight.
I’ve never used that trick and i’ve managed just fine, plus, their are positions you can take that make it hard for Doom to get you too, but not impossible.
This game also has repair packs and Zarya bubbles to save would-be Doomfist victims, it goes both ways.
But Overwatch has protections and healing to save allies that Tf2 doesn’t have, and much more cc which counters the Doomfist playstyle. Tf2 doesn’t have a Mei or Brigitte, and Moira can just Fade away. The heroes in this game are as well equiped to fight Doomfist as he is to carry out his playstyle and as his team is to support him. Its Demoknight, but adapted into Overwatch. There are some differences but I think the biggest reason supports hate Doomfist is because they are not used to having such a disadvantage in a duel, while in Tf2 that is the standard for Medic.
The holding slam in mid air til it’s available changed literally nothing as no doomfist will ever do that because you can’t shoot while you’re holding it down.
The push enemies forward thing is good but it still sometimes doesn’t work.
Third change only happens in the perfect situation for it, so I guess it helps for when it comes to it.
I hope to god he’s not getting more nerfs. It honestly would just show how little they know of this character and just cater to the lower elos who complain about him.
I thought he always had a delay, but it was just 0.1s or something But yeh, for something that more or less guarantees death when caught, having some opportunity to save your ally isn’t a bad thing
Well I guess that’s my point, he’s never really exposed like demoknight due to the array of support/tank abilities as well as greater verticality and multiple alternate routes (cept for mighty choke point of Paris).
Some are still navigable, especially with the tide turner >_>
Brig can’t save anyone anymore, but Zarya is a fun match up!
That’s true, though due to the incredibly low ttk saving people with them is… tricky. I’ve saved people with Bap cos I happened to be staring at the person that got uppercut and I hit them mid air with a nade (well, I think I saved them…). It’s just that many of these mechanisms aren’t viable unless you happen to be staring at the person who get knocked up and everyone’s using chat (properly… >_>).
While true, it does have a sentry that poses a threat rather the pea shooter Torb makes. Also I’d much prefer someone saving a character rather than simply having their own save.
To each their own I suppose. We can agree to disagree rather than keep going in circles.
Well, as none of the Supports have the advantage in fights with any Damage or Tank and nobody cares about Demoknight versus Doom… I think that the reason why he’s disliked by not only Supports but Damage and Tank is because all his moves send you flying around, unless you play heroes with self saves (like Moira/Reaper) you’re dead to rights if caught in the combo and the range of said combo is quite large (both in terms of the distance he can cover as well as changing directions after using rp jump). Couple that with the snowbally mechanic of his shield health…
You have plenty of opportunity to land a zarya bubble. Again, it was functionally a stun. Imagine if Tracer could not move or use abilities after using Recall, or Sombra after Hacking. It was really bad and you don’t seem to understand.
I don’t think tank and support abilities help Doomfist out that much, he doesn’t get a lot of benefit from barriers unless he’s charging a rocket punch. Medic’s Overheal probably does a better job of supporting Demoknight than anything in Overwatch.
Brig is good, just whipshot the Doomfist away. Personally, I prefer using Lucio for that (oh, the memories of Airblast)
Well, teams have 2 supports and 2 tanks, ya’ll should be able to manage.
Beeps in Bastion
I think people complaining about his cc, but also saying he one-shots, are contradictory. Either taking long enough to kill that the cc matters, or its an instant death. And while he’s comboing you, you still can kill him.