Meh, I’m just getting cranky.
Hopefully I can be less salty on Tuesday
Not gonna happen, my friend. We try our best but in the end of the day we will always have difficulty trying to explain ourselves to other peoe.
eh, kinda, I do well when I get around to it.
You fight the good fight. You’re right on many fundamental points, like match making being a tot sh show, but this forum is more of an emotional venting blog than it is a discussion for anything. So even given our best efforts, were all just screaming into the void.
Behold, devs forewarned us of this way back in 2019
when they acknowledged how snipers (and oneshotters) might perform in a 1 tank environment with way less shields/barriers around…
I think I’m having a bit of an effect, given how many people are grumbling about the idea of “They need to buff Supports” on Twitter.
And how “Support is fine, Support is the most OP role, they don’t need buffs”.
Yup, it’s been known.
Sad bc I remember a time when devs actually literally posted on here and talked back to us, not in prerecorded vids or blogs
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So… make tanks even stronger while making it worse for every other hero who can still die in one shot, and now takes an extra 5 damage on body shot. How does this solve anything?
Mental gymnastics.
It makes it so they can do things like remove 15% of the health off a Tank after they do the Support buffs, and give everybody a Regen Passive.
If they aren’t so vulnerable to burst damage, then they can be made more vulnerable to sustain damage.
They arent vulnerable to burst damage, though. Most tanks have armor that has a 30% damage reduction. At full health a fully charged headshot barely even does 1/3 of your health on most tanks, and that assumes you arent behind a barrier, using other damage mitigation (TaB, fortify, bubble), or have temp health like hammond. Widow is pretty much a non-issue for tanks. She’s a problem for everyone else.
Also they definitely are not going to buff supports and give everyone a regen passive. Supports are already very impactful. The issue is a lack of variety and they’re simply not as fun as the other roles. I know your magic solution to queue times has always just been “massively buff the role until it evens out” but that has never been and never will be a good idea, and they’re not going to do that.
Wait, don’t you guys think that there should be some counters to tanks? I’d argue your explanation means damage boost is MORE healthy than we thought. I can already see it: mercy loses damage boost, and people will unironically say “OMG, tanks never die! Why are they so tanky!? I know, lets nerf them next!” instead of using the tools we have now to beat tanks.
You say that, but I haven’t seen a compelling argument for that in the last 4 years.
Beyond something that basically means “It’s bad design because it’s bad design”. Which just comes off as cluelessness about game design beyond a rule-of-thumb surface level thinking.
I think they should de-escalate the outliers on Tank counters, so they can then overall lower Tank defences.
Kinda similar to how they removed a bunch of stuns and then nerfed flankers.
They shouldn’t need to design Tanks around 390 burst damage from across the map.
Discord makes me shred as tank no matter what the enemy is running; widow and hanzo are only shredding me if the enemy is running widow and hanzo.
The longer I play (I started a few weeks ago) the more I dislike Discord. It is basically an ability to force the enemy to move out of sight. Zen puts it on you. You either take the increased damage (which is deadly if you have low hitpoints) or you move out of LOS to get this thing off of you. In both ways Zen profit.
A debuff that just stays on is completely dumb. First: It should have longer CDs. If you put it on an enemy, he breaks LOS, then Discord should go on a CD. So you cannot just place it constantly one someone. And this debuff needs a timer. 10s or something max, then it should drop and go on CD. Playing a tank into Zen has become a joke lately. A tank should block for his team, so he cannot ocnstantly break LOS to Zen. In a fight with a Zen team this means: The tank is basically debuffed the whole time.
Those damage buffs should be rethought completely. Why not add a damage debuff? Like the one that has Discord on him does x% less damage? Or lower healing output? Or lower healing received (not 100% but 20% less) or whatever.
It’s bad design because you’re sacrificing balance in the name of quicker games. It’s fairly self evident.
Think of it this way, perhaps: A hero being stronger is equivalent to the same weaker hero being played by a more skilled player, and people already complain that the matchmaking sacrifices fairness in the name of speed. Do you really think people will be happy with faster queues that just put them into miserable matches?
That’s the thing, you probably can’t even describe what “balance” is. Specifically.
Plenty of jargon and rules-of-thumb thrown around, but no indication of an actual understanding of their true meaning, context and semantic limitations of the analogy, and what the exceptions and logic behind the phrase is.
It’s like somebody uttering the phrase “power creep” and expecting that the be a conclusive argument that actually means something.
“Balance” is not an objective fact. So no, of course you can’t do so specifically.
But in generaly a balanced game can be described as one where all characters feel evenly matched and fair to play against. As an obvious example, giving Ana 1000HP - not balanced. You can use common sense to tell when something is obviously under or over powered. Individual mechanics can certainly be up for debate, but I’m fairly certain if you just gave all supports 250hp, you’re smart enough to realize how broken that would be.
It’s giving players as many interesting/novel choices in a game, that are also worthwhile choices.
Now, could you explain to me how buffing the entire Support Role reduces the worthwhile/novel hero choices in the Support Role?