The patch went back live again

Hey, I’m back with some feedback specifically regarding the change made to Hanzo’s Storm Arrows.

I was initially very concerned about this change and it is proving to be as much as I feared. I don’t quite understand why Scatter Arrow was removed as an ability if it would be basically reimplemented into an inherently stronger ability, and he keeps Lunge (which as you know was added with the Scatter to Storm rework). Hanzo is beginning to feel too versatile with his high burst and vertical mobility, as well as a wallhacks cooldown.

I think he could keep this new change, if perhaps he loses an arrow or two while using Storm Arrows. Thanks for reading, if you’ve had time for it.

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Except it won’t. There were 0 changes to meta defining heroes such as Brig or Bap. None of the core issues in the game were addressed here at ALL. Literally just stupid changes that didn’t need to happen like a gimmicky oneshot mechanic on rein’s shatter or this cringe McCree buff that the devs are absolutely determined to force into this game, no matter how many times it’s been shot down by everybody.

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It’s awesome, thank you so much :heart_eyes:
hopefully we can see an HoT revert (so we can make more use of “The Cooler Super Jump” :sunglasses: while knowing our buddies have 3-4 secs of delicious moira heals)

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Moira’s fade is busted for sure but then again… it’s just Moira, it feels… fair, good direction for her for sure

Hanzo is just really fun, hitting one of those ricochet arrow doesn’t happen in my rank lol so unless the Hanzo is very experienced (impossible since this has been up for a day) I don’t think it’s oppresive or even relevant tbh, it does give storm arrow a niche function though so that’s appreciated

Cass, yeah you can roll out of knockups but you’re still vulnerable after, it’s a fair change but Fan the hammer seems to still be problematic

Wrecking ball… man, you guys overdid this one, he needs at least a visual/audio cue for the timer and the cooldown is way too long after, the direction is right though but you guys need to rein it back just a tad

Torb… what?

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Measured feedback?
I’m guessing the previous feedback i gave ended up in the trash heap.

Without hyperbole (I am LIIIIIIVID…)
Tanking is incredibly frustrating. I’d like to be able to stand in the fight with my teammates.
Provide them with some cover rather than working the corners of the map and running back to spawn to fully heal since the support healing per second is woefully insufficient. Elaborating further on this, tanking in season 2 with Dva is what comes to mind.
Getting tossed up into the air by junkrat mine then stunned by brig, then slept by Ana THEN anti-healed usually sends me into a fit of rage. (as i’m sure it does others)

TLDR: Tanking sucks. Terribly. Surprise changes like this especially to tanks end up ticking off the community. In case you hadn’t noticed. It occurs to me that IF balancing the game is such an issue perhaps you should have the OWL version and public versions seperate. Those that want to play the OWL version should have an opt-in through a menu. The game is just VERY VERY VERY frustrating to play.

Also feedback from earlier in the day:
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/overwatch/t/let-me-lay-it-out-as-clearly-as-possible

This is about the 20th post i do about the topic.
So again to summarize,
The matchmaking is horrendous and tanking is rage inducing/painful.

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It doesn’t really shake up the meta when you don’t address the problems head-on, the problems being Baps lamp and Brig as a whole.

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Been sick for a week straight and possibly just succumbed to nausea by means of expelling stomach contents. Delirious and now in want of tacos.

My thoughts are as follows: Cree roll in air buff has been tried and stated on multiple occasions now to be something he both doesn’t need and makes him too capable of counter play in scenarios he should be punished.
Everything else is whatever but rein 200 damage will be funni to see flats abuse.

Can we please have actual updates after this?

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Just get rid of it :roll_eyes: it’s thematic an all but I don’t think it’s really good for a character that’s sposed to be a crack shot. I dunno what would be a good replacement… a lasso that applies cripple like effect? An ADS like Ashe?

Moira having something more is nice, she is far to simple in her design and needs something more than just number tweeks.

Mcree change is pretty dumb, not sure why you guys are so set on him having air roll. Not being able to air roll is what sets it appart from hanzo air dash.

Hanzo storm arrows being able to reflect is a great change, brings his vision more in light to previous hanzo of seeing through walls and reflecting off walls to kill people. Great change.

Wrecking ball is easily the worst change of the bunch, why in all that is holy did you think it was a good idea to put a max duration to the spin? Spinning on the point to stall is some of the most fun I’ve had in this game and its made for some great laugh between friends. Stop ruining everything fun and unique about this game.

Solid patch. I like all the changes except the ball one. He didn’t need any nerfs and several of the last nerfs he received just reduce the fun factor of playing him. Overall, fun factor in the game is increased so it’s a good patch.

Blizzard’s management needs to just take their hands off of OW’s balance directly, IMHO. The past couple of “attempts” to balance the game have received largely negative feedback and it seems like they refuse to actually listen to the playerbase for feedback. The fact that this latest patch went through with 1) a massive bug, 2) no experimental phase and 3) putting it back up despite largely negative feedback is enough reason for any player to become fed up with Blizzard. What happened to last experimental, when you promised that management received player feedback? Did that get thrown out the window? Does Blizzard think their consumerbase is stupid?

The reception might be better if the players were actually treated with respect. It’s not a difficult concept.

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that won’t happen because they just saw McCree/Rein/Hanzo buffed and got angry

I’m just kind of confused about how further buffing cassidy and hanzo will shake up the meta when they were both already decent, and a lot of people have been expressing frustration with cassidy for a while now. Some insight on why they chose to give buffs to these two dps specifically, and not more underpowered dps, would be nice…

Otherwise, I think the torb, moira, and ball buffs are fair. Not sure about rein yet.

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So Geoff doesn’t play this game and still blindly makes balancing decisions? Why is it our responsibility to play test these (live) patches, put time in to creating summarized, concise, constructive feedback on why stuff didn’t work, have it ignored, then get blamed for “whining”? If he knew this would “drive a lot of conversation” then why was it not pushed it to the experimental card where it belongs? That’s the entire point of the card is to create a space for gathering feedback on changes that would “drive a lot of conversation”.

I’ve played this game for thousands of hours over the past 6 years and to hear that the decision-making devs don’t even play their own game has finally pushed me to uninstall. Thanks for trying to bridge the gap, unfortunately the messages you are supplying are falling on deaf ears. I truly appreciate your efforts, obviously none of this is your fault, it’s just disheartening that the devs chose to build more walls rather than create a more direct feedback system.

P.S. When was the last time Geoff checked the forums? Jeff K. loved to check it every day.

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Okay, so as a Ball player…

If you’re going to keep this change, you NEED a visual indicator of when his grapple is about to let go. Sort of like how Echo ult shows you when it’s going to expire. If not, I get these moments of terror that I’ve grappled something for too long, because 2 seconds can feel like 6 in the middle of a fight. This is 100% something we need, it’s not something I will ever get used to on timing wise, and frankly, I shouldn’t have to count to six in my head every time I use the ability.

There’s a lot of people saying that this change only messes with Balls who Spin2Win. I disagree, to some extent. There are a few instances where hanging in a specific spot can allow you to sneak by enemies and gain access to their backline, it’s somewhat sad that was taken away.

There are also other interactions that are affected. In a few maps, Ball could grapple moving platforms while he was behind cover. If you let go RIGHT when the platform moved out of range, it would fireball him straight into the air, allowing for some unique entries. Still possible, but the timing is a lot more awkward now.

There are a few Ball rollouts that actually rely on you being grappled to a surface for a while to swing up to the right spot. I’ve noticed only 1 of the longer ones will disconnect me in the middle, the rest won’t.

Aside from the severe issue of me doubting how long I’ve been holding that hook (Please, for the love of all that’s holy, give it a visual indicator) it isn’t TOO much of an issue, but honestly, as a Ball player, I have to tell you I feel a bit salty. So many of his recent changes make him feel worse to play.

Not being able to displace as much was a huge hit, and he lost a lot of appeal then for (what seems like) not very much of an actual nerf to what makes him good for pro players. The falloff changes also hurt, and then the entry grapple changes didn’t actually make him feel much weaker, but it makes it feel clunkier. Even still, my instinct is to grapple out of spawn, and when it’s on CD every time, there’s this moment of annoyance.

Honestly kind of feels like Ball is getting punished and made to feel worse for a strategy that isn’t even good, which… isn’t the best feeling for me as a player.

It does start to feel like favoritism to see Rein, who is currently dominating lower ranks and in most of my games, get buffed, and Ball, who is much weaker in lower ranks, get nerfed (on something that is primarily targetted at lower ranks). It does start to feel like favoritism to me, which leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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Can anyone confirm how the new Hanzo buff works?

Is it like you can aim at a wall like Moira orbs then fire it at the wall and bounces off in the direction? or how does it work

many thanks (not in game right now which is why I’m asking here)

Ditto for me.

Your changes are circus-tier. There is no planet in which benevolent devs said “ok lets buff Cassidy and Hanzo.” There is NO planet in which these 2 needed buffs. I have to chalk this up to malevolence. The game is either being sabotaged, or your team is abandoning all pretense of not being wildly biased in favour of which heroes should be “allowed” to be good, or the team are literally buffoons. That or this was a PR stunt. Either way it’s bad. VERY bad.

These changes do not target the meta in any way. If they did you’d be nerfing Tracer, Echo, Brigitte, Baptiste, Zen, Double shield, etc. OR if you HAD to buff things, you’d buff weak heroes. You know, weak heroes.

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His post doesn’t say that geoff doesn’t play the game.

Brigitte is not OP in the slighest, she is UP.

We don’t balance around the ranks in which she is UP. And in fact, she’s not really UP in any rank - people play her poorly.

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