Winston is simple but his mobility and health pool is what counters those two.
You could argue Hammond is more effective of a dive tank than Winston. I think he is. Hammond is definitely harder than Winston and it would be an issue if Hammond was less effective at the shared job of Winston while requiring more mechanical skill and game sense.
I believe they should both be viable and do their job but Hammond should be more effective when both are learned to the highest level
Okay, so then what would Winstonās new ājobā be?
You donāt have to answer that. My point is that if there comes a point that NO ONE can answer that, then Winston is going into the trash bin.
Like take McCree versus Widow. If one of them is meta, then the other usually isnāt. When McCree was buffed so that he could kill ALMOST as well long-distance as Widow could, Widow fell into F Tier. And vice-versa during every meta in which Widow has been dominant. These characters both have utility and abilities that do not overlap (vertical mobility and wall hacks for Widow; CC and rate of ire for McCree) but didnāt matter, because the meta only needed the one thing both of them could offer: long range DPS.
Meta play, based on winning as efficiently as possible, is always going to settle into the hero that is considered an overall safer pick. If two heroes overlap in the same job, and the one that exceeds at the job happens to be REALLY strong, there is no reason for the other character.
They did not. Winston had either to counter those or be on the first line diving and pushing for his team. Nerfed DVa had to babysit the back line, because āshe was oppressiveā to the enemy teamās back lines. McCree was never a counter to Tracer or Genji. Genji still has deflect the size of a truck and even if by a miracle McCree managed to bait a bad Genji at using his deflect early, Genji could still escape due to other bugs the flash grenade had plus his dash, wallclimb and triple jump (letās not forget ledge boost). In other words if he was near a wall, then that was 99% an escape for Genji.
As for Tracer, McCree had one chance to pin her down and if he did he had to make sure to be super close to her so that FotH does not miss (cause what better thing to have at an e-sport game than rng spread and recoil) and also had to make sure she did not have recall. If he got her and she had recall it was again an easy escape for her.
Widow was kind of a counter for Genji, back at the early days of Season 1, when she could ramp up the damage of her rifle way faster and she could quick scope. Later she was super low tier (damage wise) and the time for her rifle to amp up the damage was insane. Couple that with a buggy (then) hook, a mine that did damage to you, a longer cooldown on hook, an ultimate that offered nothing more than Hanzoās sonic arrow, and tripple jump genji and you can see she was only a viable counter to both those when played at the highest tiers of the game (masters and grandmasters- taimou).
So basically we are left with Meiā¦ Which was a troll pick because of low mobility, slow time to get her beam to freeze targets etc.
They never really tried to counter them with something that had equal difficulty to use and required equal skill to use.
Allowing 2 characters to have the same amount of impact, when one requires drastically more skill to master, makes the game less competitive
DreamHack Winter 2016, triple tank prime.
Meh Iām done arguing with gold people about the game on these forums. They always know everything better is it, adapting, tactics, counterpicking, grouping up skill floors/ceilings, how to balance and design character.
About the main topic, if you play casual quick play then you donāt bother with āskillā, you just wanna pewpew a little bit and have some fun.
If you play ranked then ofc itās about skill. Thatās why we play it, to improve and prove our skill.
This part right here contradicts the rest of your response. Like I said, McCree was supposed to be the āanti-flankerā character. As was Roadhog. All either of them needed to do was headshot her once, or land their CC ability on her once.
Blizzard also seemed to buff Sombra for the main purpose of being able to consistently hack Tracer. All three of these characters are relatively high skillāRoadhog more debatably so, but he still needs to have good aim to do it.
But, the problem was that it was still too hard to catch Tracer with McCree and Roadhog, and Sombraās buff made pros feel Tanks were āunplayableā. And all three of these characters are ones that, when buffed previously, immediately jumped into āgod tierā.
What about it? Quad Tank continued to be the dominant meta until Year of the Rooster in 2017, and Triple Tank continued for longer than that.
Okay, bye.
Thatās the problem though. You get much less demanding heroes that take up spots from the more demanding ones. Why play and learn the harder hero when the easier one does the job better
Like I said before, thatās the contradiction between a rock-paper-scissors countering system and skill balancing. If hero A is meta, both hero X and Y counter hero A, but hero Y is flat out superior, why would you EVER use hero X under any circumstance?
So trying to make the game as accessible as possible ruined the games base mechanics
Not really.
Who was it āruinedā for? Aside from Mercy and arguably D.Va, there hasnāt been a mechanically accessible character that broke the game at the highest level, ever. And Mercy was a fluke, because of a poorly thought-out rework. (EDIT: Forgot about Beyblade. Thereās nothing that demanding about Reaper, and that was another fluke.)
As much as people hate Brigitte, she hasnāt really been that dominant in pro play yet. Weāll see in the future, though, because I see her being used more consistently in the WC and Contenders, but even then, it doesnāt seem sheās overused in relation to the other supports.
But if this about Brigitte in ladder play, then weāre back to balancing the game for lower-level players instead of the top level.
If you need a low skill hero crutch to keep up with someone who can use mechanical skill, then maybe you should drop in MMR until you are playing against people at your level. Thatās what the system is for.
Competitive games are usually about skill.
Yeah too bad Brigitte fked Winston over making him less of a widow counter. Oh, she is being dived? Guess what, Brig is there to instant armor and bodyguard her. Brig is not there? Well, we still have Hanzo.
And we donāt need that video of the gold guy getting to master. I got a fking 200win every season hardstuck plat guy in my team that one tricked brigitte and got to grandmaster. fk off with that sh1t.
Every hero takes some form of skill, I am sorry but how good do you do if your awareness and map sense are crap and you do nothing but die, knowing where to position yourself, when to execute a certain ability/ult etc. there is more to skill than aim.
Most of those people mean āaimā when they say skill. Which is completely wrong. I popped off as widow on my rank and in qp beated master widows, but i still didnāt felt nearly as skillfull with widow than the times when my positioning on zen was perfect in one match.
All characters are accessible. You might end up at bronze rank with themā¦but still accessible
If itās Brig specfically then you can add tanks for certain.
That being said, people keep touting just how darn good they are and yet they canāt figure out a way to approach Brig to defeat her, even overtuned. Part of the problem too is people think they are far better than they are which contributes to the problemā¦ Brig and a few others show weaknesses in their play style and they refuse to acknowledge it.
That being said, I do think Blizz needs to reduce her armor to 50, and her health to 100, or reduce her self-heal down a bit.
Accessible for everyone? Yes.
Top tier competitive regardless of skill level? No way.
Thatās the problem so many people struggle to realize. Itās ok to have easy heroes, but if you want to compete against really good players you should be good yourself and not demand better crutches.
Overwatch was meant to be for all levels. Meaning less skilled players played against other less skilled played. Not that heroās are horrifically un balanced.