Yeah, about that: Don’t you find it a bit imbalanced that tanks are so much more important than dps?
I called that this will be a problem before roleQ. People saying that just because dps are picked just as much as tanks, that they are balanced, even though the class is underpowered.
Well what do you suggest changes then?
No because the game flat out asks people to stand out in the open for long periods of time if they want to win.
Of course the characters who can actually do that are more important.
Funnily enough, in 3v3 lockout elimination it is not uncommon to run comps with zero tanks… because wins usually happen because everybody on a team died. Which class is great at murdering people? DPS… so 2 DPS, 1 Support is really common.
Or… in 6v6 CTF… no one would ever run full goats because then you have maybe 1 good flag runner and zero people who are good at chasing down the enemy’s flag carrier. Goats would fall flat in CTF.
Change the rules for victory, change what comp is ideal. Easiest way to get several metas going at the same time is to not have 6v6 Comp only ever be the game modes that are like “Stand here for X seconds and you win.”
It’s a skill just like any other skill.
I don’t need to have teaching skills to excel. Teaching skills can be where another person excels.
Almost like you can have different things to succeed. And tbh, generally, you need more than one.
Oh boi, that’d be a very long discussion… But basically tanks and supports need a combination of nerfs, the healing and shield creep reduced, damage lowered a bit etc, and/or dps heroes damage AND health buffs, because their internal balance isn’t too bad, with the exception of Doomfist, that just needs to be redesigned from ground up anyway…
They also do a lot of other things, because “they need to threaten dps to not be ignored”, or whatever the excuse is exactly.
4 tanks 2 supports. That was the actual ctf meta 2 years ago. So not last Chinese new year, but before that.
Yet another thinly veiled “nerf moira she doesn’t need to aim”- thread. And oozing the aim elitism that nothing else is skillful but aiming. It’s like players like Miro with his Winston that redefined winston’s whole gameplay never even existed because those players were never skillful due to “no aim requirement”.
Otherwise I might have a bit more input on the topic.
Well, let me see if I can help you understand.
If you are attacking a team, going after the damage sponge last is a good idea. Then when you do finally start chipping at them, you don’t have to worry about their high damage teammates destroying you while you are distracted or their healers making the damage sponge even spongier.
However, the damage sponge is kinda useless if they don’t have a way to kind of force the attackers to attack them. Various games have pulled this off in various ways. Most MMOs do it with aggro tools and taunts. Some do it with CC. A Taunt in an FPS would feel super weird, and lots of people hate CC.
So… what’s left? How else is the damage sponge going to try to get people to care about what they’re doing? How else is the damage sponge going to make their enemies to think its a good idea to kill them first?
Well, the answer Overwatch came up with for a lot of their Tanks is giving them scary but very very situational damage. No Squishy wants to be hit by Rein’s hammer, but because of its small range, 80% of the match… they won’t be. However, they steer clear of him and do want to take him down sooner rather than later because they know that if he does get close they are going to die horribly!
That philosophy kinda fell apart in Goats though because stacking 3 tanks and 3 healers worth of survivability and utility made it so the tanks would get to the range/energy/whatever they needed to get scary.
Was that the one with the ruleset where you had to sit, undamaged on the flag for ~1-2 seconds and using mobility skills dropped the flag?
If so, then of course tanks would be stupid important because they actually have abilities that can pause incoming fire long enough to pick up the flag and the health pools and DR to hopefully survive walking back.
Skill is rewarded though?
Widowmaker is the 5th most picked DPS in GM, in Double Barrier, with a 55% winrate
Heck even Hanzo who is 4th has 53%
SnIpErS aRe BaLaNcEd
I don’t think anyone ever denied that aiming is an important skill??? Of course you have to have a specific level of aiming to be good in this game, but it’s not the most important one.
You can learn aiming pretty fast, way faster than getting good gamesense. It takes a lot longer until you can perfectly predict enemy ultimates, their strategy based on how they’re moving or what they’re doing and overall tell what’s going on.
If you can click heads, that’s good! Continue to do so, you probably worked hard for it. But everyone that worked hard for perfecting their game sense on their heroes deserves to be called skilled as well.
Aim is not the only skill, but all those other skills are still needed by aim heroes. Aim heroes have to worry about them ON TOP of aim. In that sense, having hero that can skip aim, is the reason why aim is regarded as the only skill. It’s because it’s the only skill in the game that seperates high skill heroes and low skill ones.
Take for example McCree vs Moira. People like to preach about how low skill heroes require “game sense” and “positioning”, but the truth is, McCree has a much bigger hitbox than Moira, has no escape potential, is generally very limited in impact if there is nothing to shoot at (enemies behind barriers), and has to put himself at a LoS of the enemy to do his role when Moira can stay behind a corner and heal her teammates away from danger.
McCree requires MORE game sense and positioning than Moira, while STILL requiring much more accuracy. This is why aim based heroes are labeled as high skill, and non aim ones are low skill.
They made the overpowered.
And there are a whole bunch of ranged tanks without the Reinhardt hammer limitations.
And there are really short range dps heroes too, so this whole thing falls apart…
No, that was the one before that.
The one I’m talking about had the exact same rule set, except Reaper didn’t have 50% life steal, and… Honestly I’m not sure what was the meta in the last Chinese new year event, even though I got to top 500. I think I played Reaper and Ashe, then there was Roadhog Orisa, and Lucio is obviously a must pick.
Well, they did. Explicitly. It was something along the lines of “is jus muscle memory”
Even if I grant you all of this, the point is mute, because aim based heroes have to have those other skills too.
more like we need to acknowledge that there are other skills other than aiming and killing COUGHDAMAGECOUGH
Pretty much the answer to end the thread right here.
Players like OP need to acknowledge that more things than aim are skills, and also it’s time they come to terms with the fact that Overwatch has never been “Aim above all.” Ever. And it won’t ever be. People like OP demand that aim trump everything but never want to acknowledge that positioning, timing, etc. are just as important here, so they get killed because they weren’t paying attention to the Reaper in their flanks.
very well however you elitists need to also acknowledge that aim isn’t the ONLY skill.
Aim is the easiest skill to posess in this game, if you can aim well then you’re nothing special. I’m a god damn no-brain anchor tank main and I can track and aim well when I play dps, it’s not at all difficult and I would hardly call it a skill.
Then there is nothing harmful to add aim on all heroes in the game with no compensation buffs whatsoever 
all of what your saying indicates that Moira inherently is bad character design.
Im not Anti moira, but if people are angry when shes meta then its bad character design
Yeah aiming is a skill. That’s why I’m a shicey DPS lol. But luckily I don’t play DPS anyway. My gamesense and keen eye for strategy is what’s helped me climb throughout the seasons.
Did a moira just wreck you OP? Is that why you posted this thread?
But Darth, Adam also thinks D.Va is an easy mode skill-free character. So ofc what we use to play her properly doesn’t matter to them.