🤨 Part 2.5: Why Do You Think Torb's Rework was more Well Done, then Sym's?

Sym gained a massive mobility buff which torb still has none of aside from a slight movement speed increase, also her turrets got stronger and more versatile, and I’d argue her ult is more impactful than molten core although molten core does have some great uses and combos. Torbs turret only got weaker aside from being able to throw it which does allow for some unique turret positioning but doesn’t mean much as its uptime is significantly less, the nice buff to the turret is the focus targeting which I admit isn’t something to scoff at but again that’s if the turret is being kept up usually by being behind a shield or if the enemy team is “lol forehead” and ignoring it. I’m mainly pointing this out because your post doesn’t give the whole picture and ignoring key buffs/nerfs they both got, yeah sym doesn’t have the survivability that torb has, but torb doesn’t have the mobility and utility that sym has.

Sym got some awesome buffs just for what ever reason people still find her trash, I personally disagree and am more inclined to say the comp she fits best in is garbage (bunker). What I will agree with is torb is more versatile in the game and not necessarily because his kit is better, but because sym’s kit requires her team to utilize it to get the most value while torbs does not. Take a look at the ults even, I guarantee you people are going to disagree with my comment earlier that sym’s ult is more impactful and come at me with “the enemy team can just walk through it” ignoring the fact that shield dancing exist and it’s a big advantage sym can give to her team… If they utilize it.

A lot of people will disagree with me, and they have every right to their opinion as always I can be wrong, as long as we’re sivil. A lot of people were toxic and wanted to kill me for saying the new Sombra is actually great and a strong pick, and we can see how that turned out.

The thing is, Torb can just drop a turret when the fight starts. Either you have to kill that thing immediately, drawing focus away from Torb and basically let him attack you uncontested for a few seconds, or you ignore it and attack him, letting it damage you for free once it’s built. And yeah Sym can do the same, but her turrets have a lot less health.

because he’s more instantly impactful, and his support doesn’t rely on his team.

symmetra currently is a dps with a long ramp up weapon and her main support (teleport) requires her team to all work with her. it isn’t even very useful except on like 2 maps. it’s just bad in my opinion

True, but her turrets can also fly a lot farther than his and she also can drop the teleporter as Ye Old Distraction. Either way, their playstyles aren’t wholly heterogeneous anymore and I guess I don’t like that. Sym also requires a lot more setup time even in midfight which doesn’t work for a game where the time to kill is, like, instant.

i see you didnt understood what i said, keep same rate, and damage as regular torb, just remove the arc it was just a comparaison to other weapons.
the best is just you try it in arcade in low gravity so the gun has almost no arc, youll see it is very satisfying.

Honestly it’s really the reticle that I think throws people off. I changed mine like 8 times before it got to a setting I liked.

Though I was able to change to Hanzo’s that could save me more trouble with the Arc stuff.

that is an interesting idea🤔

no thanks if anything i want them to put more arch back into his gun. they already removed alot of his drop-off

browsed the internet and yea torb has the wrong crosshair ! yea could be possible if it had junkrat or hanzo style one.

Torbs is good Syms is bad, Torbs turret was the star now he is the star, before Sym was the star now her turrets are the star, Torb still has his core concept of a defensive dps area controlling engineer while Sym lost her core concept of a light bending shield and barrier based support. Torb needs tweks but his is miles better than Syms

I honestly enjoy the Torb rework and made me start to use Torb more often. Syms… 3.0 is not bad but 2.0 was better for me.

The torbjorn rework kept his primary and secondary fire intact while also improving them and he’s a bit better on attack but on the other hand he’s too vulnerable without his armor packs, after he uses overload that’s 12 seconds of vulnerability.

That and because of how is turret cooldown works he’s weaker on defense.

The key difference between the torb and sym rework is that they didn’t replace torbjorn’s entire kit and he does feel more fluid to use despite the downsides.

that has nothing to do with the literal projectile motion changes they made. no one worth their salt uses default reticals XD

with torb they had no problem fixing what was wrong.
Clunky primary fire and weirdly timed alt fire. They addressed the time it takes to set up a turret and his low survivability.
They fixed his head hitbox (not by much, but now it’s not his whole boy anymore).
They did exactly what he needed and traded off what he didn’t.
Now he has more survivability, is more in the fray and can be a competent brawler and anti-tank.

But more importantly, he’s more CONSISTENT

In this game, consistency is much better than potential.
And that’s the problem with sym rework.
Beside the rework being MUCH more in depth (sym literally changed class), the real, main problem of sym 3.0 is her lack of consistency.
The tp is hard to place in a pinch.
Secondary fire is too slow to be used reliably
Primary fir-AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAH
And, unlike torb, she had some serious trade-offs with the new kit.
Torb only really lost the armor giving ability, but that really wasn’t that impactful or central to his gameplay.
Sym lost her old photon barrier and her shield generator, leading to her survivability plummeting.
And i’d be fine with low survivability if she had something to keep the nemy at bay, but she doesn’t.
Jokes aside, 99% of her problems rest in her primary fire.
From the maddeningly punishing tickrate, to the inexplicable need to have 100% perfect tracking for 3.2 seconds (a massive time in ow), her primary fire just fails to be reliable.
And it’s not like it does that much damage even at level 3. It still is limited by a short range and a tickrate that makes it useless against armor AND makes it harder to hit than it should (tickrate isn’t just damage, it is also how lenient aim is).

tl;dr

  • the reason why torb worked and sym didn’t is because torb didn’t really had any tradeoff and was made more consistent.
  • sym instead became far less consistent, to the point that even if she has potential and can be strong, she is too risky to play.
  • literally, the one thing that sym needs is CONSISTENCY. If she was to be mad more consistent, she’d see far more play.

I like sym 3.0.
I feel her kit is much more engaging and not as passive as how she used to be. But she has problems, problems that can be fixed, unlike 2.0, where she was doomed to not get buffs lest she became too oppressive at low ranks.

How would i fix her?
Do away with the ramp up mechanic. It’s an old relic of something that was designed to balance a lock-on beam, not a beam you have to aim.

  • Give the beam a fixed dps (maybe 180 would be too much, but i don’t know what number would be balanced).
  • if you don’t want to do away with ramp up, make it so the levels are 120-150-180, instead of 60-120-180, so that she can at least start with a competent damage. And please, make it very fast, why did you increase it from when it was lock-on? It should have stayed 1 sec per level. And please, make it so she loses charge slower.

I don’t think they were far off with sym rework at all. All she needs is tweaks to her tele and she’ll be great. It’s just too slow and she needs to be able to use it for escaping and using tricky plays.

I kinda agree the primary fire from Auto lock to pin point accuracy was a bad move. A cone shaped beam like Winston or something like Moira would have been more logical.

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Very bad move here…
Lots of new player just don’t mess with those settings… And overwatch was showed as first fps experience after all…
Don’t consider what you do like a generalities…

torbs rework was well done. symmetras hasnt yet, so if she ever gets another actually good rework, then the phrase: “torb’s rework was well done, then symmetra’s” will be true.

As a damage hero, not enough of syms kit is about killing people.
The wall and tp are cool but if blizz want sym to be a damage character they have to give her a damage ult or provide more in her base kit for her to be able to be aggressive.
Sure you can get gold damage pretty easily spamming orbs and turrets but you’re not able to focus someone down and confirm kills unless the red team allow you to by over exposing themselves.

Syms kit is too slow for her to be a damage character, she’s been relabelled as a damage hero while losing almost as much as she has gained to become one and simultaneously has kept all the niche ‘defense’ gimmicks that stop her being proactive.

  • You have to charge up your M1 otherwise its entirely useless, this wastes time in which every other dps is already getting picks. Once you get it charged up you can’t stay within reach of your enemy because you’re now a basically a reaper without the mobility that makes his playstyle viable so you’re forced to let it wind down back to zero while you heal up and wait for the enemy team to allow you to approach them, because using teleporter tells your enemies exactly what you’re doing and where you’re going.

  • Teleporter, the most telegraphed mobility in the game which both clearly marks the users starting point and destination, can be preaimed for an instant headshot and easily destroyed leaving teleportees stranded and most likely dead. More importantly, it has a painfully long cast time that prevents TP from enabling a healthy balance of offensive and defensive play.
    It also forces syms to play by their nose, you have to be able to smell trouble before it starts and pre-emptively place a tp for escape or mobility. It’s the same with her ultimate, a late wall can be walked through an early wall ignored.

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