Paris first choke


#1

After playing the map for a bit, it seems to me, that the first choke is too hard. There is literally only that choke to pass through and one building next to it to jump over. Seeing that on defender side (very close actually) is some high ground with cover, the choke seems very unfavorable for attackers.
I suggest adding a flanking route. The choke as it is right now is very narrow with almost no cover for attackers. The high ground on defending side is so close that defenders can just spam the choke to death without any attackers getting through.

Just my opinion, it feels very unbalanced as it is rn.


#2

Probably just because it’s new. I’m sure people will get used to it eventually.


#3

Its like Anubis choke A you edge forward then go right to take the side route with the least visability.
You can take cover on the left but the right side is ideal to prevent the enemy from knowing where you are.
Now if this were a problem that OW wants to change a secondary entrance to the shop would be reasonable as you can see into the store from the defenders POV but have more space to move from the choke.


#4

Its not worse than Hanamura. And i feel its very favored for attackers, if they decide to play dive.


#5

I assumed it was there will be a discussion about the first choke. Also i would agree on the fact that it might not be the worst possible Choke we had in history, but it definitely is a very very bad one compared to most of the updated or reworked ones on live.

I heard Hanamura. Hanamura is a decent chock since you can actually pick with widow or other sharpshooters because of the window on right side and the upper area before the choke. Also its better to flank with flankers which balances it out a bit. In Paris you have no secondary way on getting behind the choke without going through the enemies ( as tracer for example.) . Not to say it is impossible in the chaos the choke creates but if you have somewhat of a decent game sense no flanker will get through there.

the roof on the left side of the choke is basically your only opportunity to get behind enemy lines (but that means only with phara, sombra, widow maybe and probably doom-fist if you know how.

it kinda reminds a bit of the way on Eichenwalde. Now again in eichenwalde you it helps if you get over that since it can turn around enemies and sharpshooters can pick through the choke since there is a great line of sight.
In Paris you dont have that line of sight becaus the houses are blocking 90% of the view. The first time you see the choke you are probably already in the middle of the fight which is horrible.

Yet i have only played like a few matches on atk. and in most cases sprinting through with sombra and try capturing the point helped get your team come through, but only with a rein. All games without a rein on Paris basically were lost either on def or on atk.

But to be fair if one gets a team wipe on atk (how ever possible) you basically have the point captured if the spawn wont change in the live version. IT appears a bit to far away. So strong choke that punishes the team 100% if you lose it … now maybe that is a point you can say its balanced, but it doesnt feel to great on either side.

also second point appears a bit widely spread with an insane run back on defenders side… like 2 picks on def side vs 2 picks on atk side, now on def you basically lost the point and on atk you can easily get another tick.

of course you cant say clearly how it works out on live since the player match up on ptr is kinda … well awful. But if i would try to predict how a decent matchup would work out on live, lets say with 2 identically strong teams… there is almost no way to get to first point through choke. (that is in elos from silver - plat. It can probably work out with well organized teams in masters and GMasters, if they have an insane phara player who doesnt have to go against a widow.


#6

This choke is garbage. Of course, blizzard never listens to us when we say these types of things.


#7

Thank you Manix, you said just the right thing.
Didn’t know how I should phrase it but you did it perfectly


#8

I find the first choke really easy to go through.
There’s at least 4 ways to pass through it, let’s imagine the defense is on the high ground facing the choke:

  • you can use a mobile hero and jump over the roof on the left, then you’ve got a road to go to the point on the left.
  • you can go through the Boulangerie, can also be a good spot for snipers (as well as the window above the choke) or flankers (who can use the road on the left to take the high ground after the piano)
  • you can go on the right by the police station and then choose to take the big flank or to directly go against the team on the high ground (fast&close comp like GOATS would be good with this road)
  • you can go forward, by the road and forces the enemy team to get down

For real, it’s really similar to Anubis point A


#9

The thing that bothers me is the sightlines. On defense you can see every move. There is like nothing that gets through unseen putting attackers on a disadvantage. On Anubis you have way more cover as attacker, than on Paris