Move on from Mass Rez


#383

No. The mercy posters are responsible for their own actions. There will be AT NO POINT, where that will not be the case. No. I am not going to treat people like retarded children who are not capable of making decisions. Every single bit of hostility that accumulated against these incredibly toxic mercy posts, are the fault of the posters who made them. Torb is finally getting a rework after being objectively garbage forever. He was only ever good if you had a team willing to build around you, and then you could just go bastion, who did the same thing but better. Torbs don’t have this reputation of lighting up the forums. And honestly even then, Mercy has always been more viable than Torb in terms of play-ability. Its ridiculous.

Allright, well, if yall just want to sit with a full diaper, don’t be upset when no one wants to be around the stench.


#384

Hmm interesting enough the rework was based upon Mass Rez being unfun to play against. Don’t be a hypocrite and say that a character being unfun to play as isn’t justifiable for a change.


#385

LOL. Adorable. Blizz can literally say, “Mercy has a dog face, so we are adjusting her healing to 100 heals/s” If you want to convince others, “fun” isn’t an argument. And others are what you need if you want to push people to the side of your argument. Which I said, I guess you were too busy raging to read that bit. Go ahead and spin your tires in the mud. It’s just to get to the point where its going to be a meme that people use to beat you over the head with. Listening to me is going to help you, or you could just keep doing what you are doing, annoy people, and constantly turn people off from listening to you. When it comes down to it, I am fine with where mercy is at. And the way yall are going about it, you won’t be the instrument of change you seem to think you will come out as.


#386

I’m not listening to your advice whatsoever. I don’t need to sit here and take abuse from the anti-Mercy forumers.

I mean something being unfun to play against can invoke change something being unfun to play as can invoke change as well. You are barking at the wrong tree buddy. I’ve been fighting the fight for over a year now and I’m not stopping because you are telling me that I should listen to you and give in.


#387

Glad to know that you are incapable of changing you approach that is working so well lol. Have a good one.


#388

Interesting how that works… or rather not how that works:

Why I Have Yet to Not Despise Mercy's Current State

That’s the most popular thread of all time with nearly 1.5 times the popularity of the second most popular thread of all time.

Realistically, we don’t need any more support. Our ideas are already mainstream. The only thing left is for the developers to get off their butts and do something to solve Mercy’s problems.


#389

I’ve heard the argument “Mass Rez has no counters” and “Mercy was unfun to play against”. Here’s the thing. That’s your opinion. For one, I haven’t enjoyed playing Mercy competitively through all nerfs, especially this one. When you say Mercy wasn’t fun pre-rework, that statement does not represent every single player’s feelings towards the hero.

She’s no longer fun nor impactful, and I think that is a terrible place for her to be in.

Mercy was reworked for a biased reason. The developers seem to not be the most competent when it comes to balancing. If you wanted to make their game as enjoyable as they possibly can, this mess of a rework would never have started.

I’m not giving it a rest. If you’re a non-Mercy players who strongly disliked Mass Rez, that’s your problem.
The game does not need to be changed to fit your personal spectrum of fun.

See how easy it is to reverse the roles ?


#390

I like how you ignored that I pointed out a very vast majority of Mercys were clumped together into the same target of the toxicity by non-Mercys, yet you refuse to acknowledge their behavior and their influence on the situation.

Your refusal to acknowledge it and refusal to take my statement as a whole but rather take one part and rake it through the mud is almost like you have a fundamental lack of ability to comprehend cause and effect, or to objectively apply the same standards to others as you apply to Mercys.

Also, your post was quite toxic. You should take responsibility and own up to your actions, otherwise you’re just being hypocritical in demanding that Mercys do something that you don’t expect yourself or others to do.


#391

I did? me differentiating between mercys who make toxic posts and those with unique ideas for a character concept arent good enough for you? Mkay lmfao


#392

You are fighting a losing battle, my friend. Trust me, I’ve been where you are and gave up.

You can’t reason with unreasonable people.


#393

Yes, you did. Let me make it short and simple so you can’t strawman it.


#394

I guess you were right about one thing. He most definitely is losing the argument.


#395

There is no argument. There is just people doubling down on their toxic behavior and getting upset when people offer them alternatives. All these people are trying to act like some mugger came by after they left a theater and shot mercy in front of them as a child, making them what they are now. Get real.


#399

Let me give some exact context to the statement then.

Developer Update (August 24, 2017)
From the PlayOverwatch channel.
https://youtu.be/vDlCqJ1tD3M
Transcription
Time Trascription
00:38 And I think it’s important for me to start with: Why are we changing Mercy in the first place?
00:45 So, one of the problems we see with Mercy right now is there’s a weird behavior that’s
00:50 encouraged by the core, fundamental design of the hero, which is that, if you are a Mercy
00:57 player and you’re healing your team and your ultimate is up or close to being up, you have
01:02 this weird moment where you stop healing your team, you go into hiding, and you start to
01:08 tell your team: "Everybody die together!
01:10 Die on the point.
01:11 Die on the point.
01:12 I have rez."
01:13 There are people who might not be listening to you on your team, who are now yelling at
01:18 you: "Why aren’t you healing?
01:19 Why aren’t you healing?"
01:20 They go off and die somewhere else.
01:22 Anyway, the team eventually wipes and then Mercy swoops in and does her big Resurrect.
01:30 There’s a couple things we really don’t like about this.
01:33 One, we think it’s wrong to tell a main healing character to go off and hide somewhere and
01:40 stop healing for some period of time.
01:42 The other thing is, that on the receiving end, like, let’s say you’re on a team that
01:49 puts a lot of effort into getting a full team wipe.
01:52 You use a Zarya Graviton Surge and maybe have Pharah rain justice from above on top of that.
02:00 You wipe out the entire enemy team.
02:02 It’s pretty disheartening to have Mercy just erase that moment with a full team rez.
02:07 So, we felt like her Resurrect was something that needed to be addressed.

Followed by this…

Time Trascription
03:42 So, Mercy will be getting an ultimate that’s called Valkyrie.
03:46 And Valkyrie does a lot of things, so let me walk you through all of them.
03:51 First and foremost, when Mercy activates Valkyrie …she can fly.
03:58 And I don’t mean she can Pharah boost in the air briefly.
04:01 I mean she can fly.
04:04 And it’s super fun.
04:05 You have complete control of your character.
04:08 After all, Mercy has those wings, we might as well put them to real use.
04:11 I mean, Guardian Angel is pretty good, but imagine flying with Mercy, how much fun it could be.
04:18 The other cool thing about Mercy when she’s in Valkyrie is that everything she does is
04:24 basically better.
04:25 So, Guardian Angel now goes much farther than it did before, so she can reach targets much easier.
04:35 Her beams now go farther, both healing and damage boost beams can reach much farther
04:41 than they could.
04:42 The coolest part about the beams is now they chain to multiple targets.
04:47 So, if you have multiple teammates who are in need of healing and they’re grouped up
04:52 the beam will hit all of them and they’ll all be getting healed or they’re all be getting
04:57 damage boosted.
04:58 Also, for those of you Battle Mercys out there, and I know you exist, her gun is now better
05:06 when she’s in Valkyrie mode.
05:08 She can shoot faster and it does more damage, which is basically, like, me saying in two
05:13 ways: “She can do more damage.”
05:14 I think the thing that you’ll like about it the most is the ability to fly.
05:20 I think the flying really opens up those moments for Mercy where she’s getting attacked,
05:25 her teammates aren’t really helping her out, she needs a chance to get away, and really just
05:31 sort of flying…
05:32 The other thing you can do is swoop in and save people at the right time.
05:35 And, by the way, your Resurrect refreshes right when you use the ultimate ability.
05:42 Now, on the PTR we’re going to be experimenting with different versions of the Resurrect and
05:47 how it works with Valkyrie.
05:49 Right out the gate, you’ll see that she can use Resurrect even faster when she’s in Valkyrie.
05:55 So, in a lot of ways, you now have Battle Mercy, flies to the air, sees her teammates
06:02 in trouble all around the battlefield, and then flies to them, either heals them or,
06:06 if they happen to die, she’s gonna, you know, resurrect different ones of them.
06:11 We feel like Mercy will feel a lot more engaging to play than standing around the corner, hiding,
06:18 waiting for that moment to press the ultimate.
06:21 So, we really hope that you respond well to these changes to Mercy.
06:26 We know that she is a character that’s played almost second-to-none, so we think we’re going
06:32 to get a ton of feedback from you.
06:34 And we’re really eager to hear…we want to hear what the Mercy players have to say and
06:38 we want to hear what people who have played on the receiving end of that team-wide resurrect
06:43 feel and how they feel about Valkyrie.
06:46 How do you feel like the balance is?
06:48 Is it fun to play against?
06:50 Do you understand what’s going on?
06:52 So, we think this will be a good, healthy change for the game overall, so we look forward
06:58 to what you have to say there.

Namely the issues are from these sections:

It’s pretty disheartening to have Mercy just erase that moment with a full team rez.

Now, on the PTR we’re going to be experimenting with different versions of the Resurrect and how it works with Valkyrie.

We feel like Mercy will feel a lot more engaging to play than standing around the corner, hiding, waiting for that moment to press the ultimate. So, we really hope that you respond well to these changes to Mercy.

We know that she is a character that’s played almost second-to-none, so we think we’re going to get a ton of feedback from you. And we’re really eager to hear…we want to hear what the Mercy players have to say and we want to hear what people who have played on the receiving end of that team-wide resurrect feel and how they feel about Valkyrie.

How do you feel like the balance is?
Is it fun to play against?

It’s disheartening to be killed by a lot of things that feel like BS. Like for many how it feels to get hit by Tire or DVa bomb. Those don’t get changed though. Feels terrible for an ult to get nomed by DVa’s DM or reflected by Genji. That doesn’t get changed though. The reason it feels like garbo to have Mass Rez wipe your effort was because you let her do what she naturally does and you know you goofed big time; just like it hurts when those other situations occur. For the most part, it was just as easy to deny value from Mass Rez as it was to deny Trans.

Kill :clap: the :clap: supports :clap: first. :clap: ESPECIALLY :clap: if :clap: it’s :clap: Mercy.

Super easy strat, but clearly it was too hard for a lot of people. So I guess target priority is too elite of strats for this game. Mind you, Resurrection was almost only buffed and not even that often either ever since the game launched and until invulnerability was added to the ult, it was so trash tier that Mercy and using Rez was considered throwing in most contexts. Then came the SR exploit and all of a sudden people are using hide and Rez EVERYWHERE and getting stupid amounts of SR for playing horribly. It’s almost like the problem was the ranking system and putting invulnerability, and that the rework could have largely or entirely been avoided if they fixed the SR exploit when it was reported instead of waiting a couple months, add limits that make it much harder/impossible to hide and rez, and/or removed invulnerability and put in something like damage reduction or healing for improved survivability without removing the risk of the ability.

As far as “trying out different versions of Resurrect on PTR”, they tried 1. Just 1. People would have been stoked if they’d tried out different versions of Mercy in general, but they really didn’t. Unless you read “PTR” as “live” in which case, yes they did try out multiple versions and tried out at least 10 iterations of Mercy causing a year of balance turmoil that could have been avoided if they just did what they had said they would.

As far as the feedback goes, well… that’s self explanatory if you watched the feedback thread while the changes were happening. People gave a lot of feedback. Then Jeff in his next interview gave a summary of the feedback he was getting which was completely different from what was in the feedback thread.

Of course there is dramatization everywhere about exact syntax of how things played out, but the core of that still remains undeniably true. Well, I guess it’s deniable if you’re delusional or don’t subscribe to the notion of facts being facts.


#402

So putting Mercy in f tier would count as a “fix”?


#403

Literally 90% of this forum are just Mercy mains begging for a change Jeff said isn’t going to happen.

Lmfao.


#404

Someone has to be at the bottom. Mercy was for a very long time, and most Mercys didn’t care. Besides, she’s literally at the bottom now as far as stats go, so not really sure why it’s OK if she’s there now, but not OK if she’s there before the rework?

Personally, I’d have taken F tier if it meant NOT completely taking a heaping dump on the game’s balance for a year and avoiding forcing people to play her that didn’t want to. I think a lot of Mercys and non-Mercys would have preferred this as well while they tested some stuff on PTR to see what worked better, and it’s interesting that when Bastion (damage reduction) and DVa (armor increase) was doing this to the game’s balance they rolled it back pretty quickly, but they let Mercy sit and soak up insane amounts of community hate while saying everything was fine.


#405

Bastions would like a word with you.

Bastion’s and D.va’s changes were never actually reverted.


#406

Eh. I gave it a go.

Hard for some people to accept.

Yet they haven’t given up. I hope we go for a rework opposed to revert.

I believe the most popular tends to be the Bastion megathreads; notably a hero that has been left in the basement for substantially longer than Mercy.


#407

Using Overbuff (because although inaccurate, nothing else is really that much better and the trend is the same).
Mercy’s on fire is 1.8%, Bastions is 15.9%
Mercy’s win rate is 48.43%, Bastions is 49.61%
Bastion’s pick rate is trash, but comparatively it’s not any higher or lower than it was in the past. Mercy’s pick rate is tanking.

I could go into the implications of those, but that’d blow the length of this up significantly. Bastion needs some love badly. To use that to discard the state of others, even if it IS Mercy is just disingenuous.