Did you read my post to you?
It is insanely difficult to judge the impact that Valkyrie and E Resurrect is having on the game. Mass Resurrect? Not so much.
i did read it sorry i responded in a reply to someone else…
impact is still subjective though…the only impact i ever got out of it was feeling like it was cheap…yeah you could reward the team by staying alive…you could also have no part whatsoever in the fight if a team killed you first and you just happened to run out in time to get everyone else up…yay…rewarded for dying
its whatever…i felt way better at the end of the match when i didnt have to rez anyone…which, if you want to talk valkyrie, satisfy that desire…
Well yeah. Pretty much.
The new Mercy is a shell of what was “sold” to us. It was all about the fluidity of her kit. Rez is annoying but hey, if you hide you can use it. Valk is completely gutted, sluggish and weird. If they removed the AOE effect and infinite ammo - and gave me back the speed of flight I would be much happier… Hell, they could instead make it an empowered beam.
So basically you just didn’t/don’t value Resurrect… at all…
I mean that’s fair I guess. I will say that I don’t see why you would have even played Mercy if that was the case. Especially not Old Mercy… Her Mass Resurrect basically was her selling point.
Thing is though… while you may not understand it, surely you must know that there are people who valued Mass Resurrect. How is it fair that those people lost part of the game they loved for silly reasons?
Objectively? Lol what?
Arguably. Why? Supercharger is a larger damage boost, but it can be destroyed more easily than Mercy. Mercy is mobile, usually high above ground, and rapidly regenerating. Supercharger sits in one place and can take damage.
Like, this is ridiculous. At least try to be objective here.
oh it had value…it also felt cheap many times
and i play everybody…not just mercy…though i liked her then…and i like her now
again the part i struggle with is where the people are drawing the line between fun/unfun seeing as how (imo) shes the same character…people on here keep acting like she was soooooooo different…every single time i play her now…i treat her like i treated the 1.0 version…with the exception being i keep my team alive now instead of bringing them back to life…
That is entirely true, however the word of someone who mains a character and has significant playtime on that character should be valued more in balancing discussions than someone who’s only used that hero in mystery heroes or QP for an hour or two.
Like you I have adjusted to Valk and use it well, however I don’t think it’s on the same level of usefulness as mass res and it certainly doesn’t involve the same level of strategy as mass res did. If Valk allowed me to shield\heal through an enemy ult like Zen’s trancendence does then I’d wholeheartedly agree with your statement. At this point in time Valk is on the same level as Orisa’s damage boost ult for me.
2 Likes
I think it is. Mass rez saved your team, but Valkyrie saves you. It’s more selfish in that way, but it also keeps you alive - with some added bonuses - and it lets you still participate and help the team. Mass rez pre invulnerability was basically a death sentence. You could bring your team back, but there was always a good chance it’d cost your life. Valkyrie is the opposite, you save your life to keep helping your team.
It is true that her moment to moment game play is largely unchanged… but the thing is that Ultimate are kind of positioned as the climax of a character’s kit. Mercy’s got drastically changed.
If you did that to any sort of book or movie… would it still be the same book/movie? I would argue that no… no it isn’t.
To illustraite, there’s one movie I can think of off the top of my head that actually did exactly that. I Am Legend.
---------SPOILER ALERT-----------
For the majority of the movie it plays out kind of like your normal zombie movie. Then in the directors cut… near the end of the climax the movie reveals that the infected humans are actually still sentient. In the theatrical version, that reveal doesn’t happen.
That one change to the climax of the movie shifts it from being a fairly normal zombie movie to one where the protagonist is actually more akin to the monster under the bed, because he’s been capturing infected humans to experiment on them to try to cure them… usually killing them in the process.
----------END SPOILER-------------
I hope that helped.
See I don’t find that Valk is sluggish or weird. Maybe I just enjoy Mercy as a whole and not so much focused on what I can’t change about her because ultimately it’s up to Blizzard what they do with her.
I too dont care if they removed the AoE effect and the infinite ammo. Bringing back the speed change would be nice but I’ve adjusted to the speed now and it’s really not all that bad.
You’re simply incorrect.
If the team is split apart that necessarily means someone is out of position?
You’re wrong.
If that’s the case when you flank you have to be “in the wrong spot” even if your flank won the team-fight.
So this point does not stand up to scrutiny at all.
So, because you won’t do it that means all Bastions don’t? Your points are laughably terrible man.
Bastion can shot an ulting Mercy easily if they are not worrying about their position.
If you say otherwise you are, again, simply incorrect.
He can hit you while you’re resurrecting pretty easily and can hit you in a graviton.
And you say “HA.” like it’s supposed to be a coherent argument. Adorable.
And often times still gets killed because Genji has insane mobility and can eat through her auto-heal.
You’ll give me half? Your arrogance is surpassed only by your ignorance.
Not 1.5. By my tally it’s 5 ultimate abilities out of the 6 that can kill or destroy her when she’s not worried about her positioning.
Valk =/= being airborne. There are many times you don’t want to be in the air. And, if you’re on the ground trying to dodge a high-noon or something, Mei’s ultimate can and will wreck you if you get hit by it.
You need to play more Mercy then. Your personal experience is completely and wholly insufficient to base anything off of.
Remember that this is all assuming that the Mercy isn’t worrying about her positioning because she doesn’t need to with Valk. It can be hard to land these ultimates, but if Mercy isn’t paying attention to her position then it’s a lot easier.
Again completely incorrect. If the Mercy is worried about her positioning then she will not get hit by it typically.
But, and here is the kicker, if the Mercy is not worried about her positioning it’s a lot easier to get hit by it. Reaper can get high-ground BTW.
Actually we’re on 9. Possibly 8 or 7 if I give you Reaper and Mei, but I’m not comfortable doing that.
First claim is simply wrong right off the bat.
Torbjorn has a gun and can shoot at you and hit you. Especially if you’re not paying attention to your position.
There is that unwarranted, unearned arrogance again. You’ll give me half? Hilarious.
We’re not at 3.5, by my (more rational) tally it’s actually closer to 8, 9, or 10.
Laughable. That’s your argument? It’s an ultimate that sticks to heroes and one shots Mercy. If Mercy is not paying attention to her position then you can time it to kill her when she GA or resurrects at least.
But allows everyone to see where she is at all times so that it’s very easy to keep tabs on her and focus her.
This is the only one I’d give a .5 to.
So that leaves me at 9.5 to 11.5.
9.5/15 or 11.5/15 is very much “most DPS ults destroy you”.
Next time try to actually argue the topic.
The topic wasn’t “how hard is it to kill Mercy with this ultimate”
It was:
Which you yourself quoted. Please argue the point next time. You have no excuse.
The ultimates completely destroy you if you’re hit by them. You will be hit by them more if you’re not worried about positioning.
The fact that you want to argue against that is quite telling.
That’s not a reason, even if it was true, to not worry about dying. A Zenyatta ulting still needs to worry about dying, and he’s invincible.
Not just that one instance.
If widow is in the game you have to make sure you can get out of her sight even if you’re ulting.
If Soldier is in the game you need to make sure you can get away if he does tactical visor.
There are others. If you’d think about it for a second it would be very clear to you. I hope at least.
“Truth” lol.
“Truth” isn’t easily and logically shown to be fallacious like I’ve done with most of your points. “Truth” isn’t ignoring the actual context of the conversation and then using the result of that straw-man.
I suggest you work on reading comprehension and basic logic. I’m not trying to be inflammatory, honestly, the post was just completely lacking in intelligence.
I probably won’t bother replying, although I will read any response, since my time is worth more than this.
Thanks, see ya later.
Look at the stats:
50% x 60 > 30% x 5
25m radius > 10m
Supercharger is objectively better.
What??? You aren’t even taking into account that supercharger is a destroyable construct that can’t move? Or that Mercy has additional survivability, mobility, and enhanced abilities/unlimited ammo? I don’t understand how anyone can look at Supercharger and say that it’s objectively better. I really don’t get it.
And you’re ignoring the fact that Valkyrie literally takes Mercy out of the team fight.
So basically your argument is that if the Valking Mercy is laughably incompetent all the DPS ults can wreck her?
I was operating under the assumption that Mercy would be at least 10m in the air and floating semi randomly with wasd and space like any even remotely competent Mercy would. Under those circumstances… most DPS ults don’t do squat to Mercy.
And no, doing that isn’t worrying about your position because you generally don’t care what bit of sky you are in.
Though, I will give you Dragon Blade. Since posting that I have learned that Blading a Valking Mercy out of the air is a thing that people can pull off. That’s still only 4 out of 15 though.
But… let’s step through… shall we?
You know who people usually take to deal with flying opponents? Widow… Soldier… McCree… all hitscan. You know who they don’t take? Junkrat. Bastion has 2 weapon options for hitscan damage and 1 that shoots arching projectiles. WHY WOULD HE EVER use the arching projectile to shoot at a airborn Valking Mercy?
Without Gravaton, Dragon Strike is the ult that can be countered by walking. Valking Mercy “walks” faster than normal ergo Valkryie can easily avoid Dragon Strike. Also with the assumption that Mercy is above 10m, Grav has a pull range of 8m and usually lands on the floor. She’s not getting pulled in.
Also why are you rezzing during Valk? Valk hangs a GIANT NEON SIGN on you. You generally don’t want that when you can barely move.
HA indicates that I felt that that line of reasoning was blindingly obvious but apparently it wasn’t.
Yeah gave you this one. So… 1.
See the lovely part about humanity is that they are lazy. Add in that JR doesn’t want his tire to get exploded… that means that generally JR will send his tire to the first easy target. That will almost never be a Valking Mercy. It can happen though so… yeah. Half.
2.5.
Unless you have a good reason to not be airborne while in Valk… you are and are therefore out of reach of Blizzard. Also there aren’t THAT many times where you don’t want to be in the air… basically just High Noon and Tac Visor.
Seriously you just seem to have gone hard on me saying “Mercy doesn’t need to pay attention to her positioning” means she’s ON THE GROUND.
That’s not what it means. It’s just a fact of the game AoE Explosive Projectiles with a TON of spread is probably the last weapon you’d use on an airborne target. Half or more of it would miss and do nothing. An ult like that is better to use on ground based targets like… 9/10 times.
He can get to high ground but will gravity take him out of range of the Valking Mery before he kills her? That I don’t know, depends on whether he can get above her or not.
What I do know is that I never said that this theoretical Mercy wouldn’t react to obvious threats. Reaper is pretty dang obvious.
Again… everyone knows that using an arching projectile to kill an airborne target is not a brilliant idea. That’s exactly what Torb’s gun is… AND that assumes he even decides to go after Mercy when he could get far greater results by using his move speed boost to charge and shotgun/hammer grounded fools in the face.
A Torbjorn in the middle of Molten Core who understands his guns isn’t going to waste his time trying to shoot down a Valking Mercy.
It’s staying at half. I would maybe give you a little more for the Turret’s rockets… but you didn’t even talk about that.
Yes that’s my argument. She throws it maybe a max of 3 meters. If Mercy is in the air… which she generally will be… she’s not getting stuck.
… which doesn’t help in the slightest unless Mercy is behind a wall. I could maybe give you like… .25 on this.
So… 4.25. Maybe 4.35 with Torb’s turret missles. Still not most.
That… is a GIANT if in the case of a Valking Mercy. That’s what I was getting at. Most DPS ults don’t wreck a Valking Mercy because they WILL NOT HIT HER. Even if she’s just kinda floating when they push Q.
Pharah doesn’t get wrecked by that many ults either for the EXACT same reason. I’m not saying it’ll never happen. I’ve gotten shattered as Pharah… it’s kind of embarassing. But that’s not the norm.
What??? No??? She’s still in the fight?
None of this makes any sense.
Playe her on max range around corners. You will quickly realise that this is the most effective way to play with Val.
Lol. I love people who do the typical “so your argument is…” and then proceed to misrepresent the argument.
Love it.
This isn’t what we were talking about, obviously. We were talking about a Mercy who IS NOT WORRYING ABOUT THEIR POSITION!
Next time stay on topic. I’m done here. You’ve shown that this is, in fact, a waste of time.
That’s exactly what I was talking about this whole time. Once Mercy gets to that position, for the remaining ~13 seconds of Valk she generally won’t need to worry about her position outside of continuing to float semi randomly… which is also easy.
Non Valking Mercy can’t do that cause she can’t float forever.
good mercy players didnt die 90% of the time when ressing btw. bad players deserve to die.