And pushing the frontline back and letting the enemy team’s frontline move forward is not a good idea that comes with heavy risks to it lmao
Really depends? Let them have the space if you and the team have no need for it. Who cares if it ends with your team wiping them all?
Rotating is the key word here. Something plat and higher should know.
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Except most of the time it’ll end with your team being wiped so
Then Doom murders Orisa DPS & Supports with a massive juicy 4 man emp punch
So no, what a lot of top 500 and pro players will tell you. Is that your team is very self efficient these days.
Supports and dps can kill, escape, and CC other supports and DPS. And can position around the enemy tank. Having to wiggle around some cover and or using a blink/TP/roll/Sleep is fine and expected. that’s what their supposed to do. And you can’t capture or move a point till the enemy is off of it anyway. And you being dead will not achieve anything.
Also like your a dive tank player no? Like cycling is pre backed into your basic roll out. Even prior to Doom becoming a tank, he was very in and out as a character.
Like try to kill something, escape, reset cooldowns, repeat. Is the way of the D.va, the Winton, thee Fist of the doomer.
What they will actually tell you is that if your tank is in a position where they have to give up space, they are either going to die immediately or have given the enemy tank free space.
I play more than just dive. Doom doesn’t stick to a frontline. I’m more than aware that he’s always been an in and out character.
For starters the tank isn’t the only hero that can hold space, walking face first into a sleep, mei ult/wall trap, cassidy ult/flash, discord, and more. under four damage sources. Isn’t exactly easy to do now.
That a tank that is cycling will come back in play. your are not removed from the fight and the enemy “has” to stil play around where you can push. And because a lot maps let you just pop out or drop down directly into the side of behind the enemy.
their going to space themselves out for that play or get punished by tank poping out two from their supports.
As always you think of fights in way to binary fashion.
oh wait he cycles who knew? Thanks for contradicting yourself.
If 1 tank can get away with it, all tanks can my guy. Doing a little flank loop especially one where you pushing back into your own supports does a lot for you.
If you feel too pressured to tank, don’t tank. Show Blizzard that this format sucks for tanks.
In other news people said the same thing in 6v6, and left in mass. Tank que was mostly zary hog dps players looking for a quick game.
Be it here you can actually just work around most things by doing what I mentioned.
For starters no one can hold space as well as the tank can. McCree certainly can’t just stand there and the team will be oh so afraid of him. Oh no, McCree is high nooning while his Rein’s shield is broken? sleep hook grasp shield defence matrix rock wall shatter etc
Sure, if you’re against a team with absolutely no methods of stopping a high noon, that’d work assuming he doesn’t just get obliterated.
Yeah, because Rein or Mauga can just bounce around like Doom or Ball can, right?
No?
Didn’t think so.
If Rein is not in front
Then he is behind
And also very loud and obvious to notice
As in a single unit now, but you have two of each of the other role. And combined the can easily nuke any one or two players.
You are pushing into a team, that does normally have individual outs just get away from whatever is attempting to run at them.
And again your still going to push as tank, leaving the fight for three or so seconds. Just means the push bot gets to move like a few feet. And that shouldn’t ever matter because it’s going to move a lot more if you die.
Congrats you ult/resources traded and your tank that is now ready to push back into the enemy team that doesn’t have to worry about DM, hook, shatter, sleep.
Because there are still in the game. They are not dead, it only takes a few seconds to reset a health pull and most of your barrier/cooldowns to push again.
That and some options don’t get around the fact that cassidy has high damage resistance while ulting.
That’s not how any of this works, like the rien does have a mobility tool for starters. Secondly a lot of tanks don’t act as a hard frontline.
Doom specifically is off dealing with dps/supports in most cases. You playing doom means your team is almost always in line of taking damage.
They are made to play around this scenario. Their kits don’t change because you have a rien, hog, doom, d.va, ball or mauga on your team.
Oh, because Rein has one mobility tool that makes him extremely vulnerable, that means he’s as mobile as Doom, right?
No?
Again, didn’t think so.
Most tanks do.
Ball, Doom, D.va and Winston are the exceptions. They are the only ones with the ability to bounce in and out of the backline to the frontline to the sideline. The rest are frontliners. Especially Mauga and Orisa who are designed around bullying the tank.
Except there’s a big black man or a rodent in a mech that acts as a distraction in their backline, either that or my team is playing dive and is in there with me anyway
You also just traded your McCree because he decided to high noon in front of the enemy team and got slapped with a CC so now you’re in a 4v5, how valuable.
Frontline is where i’m facing.
Also a ball main, probably
You mean most the time in your games. Play with a stack as the game was designed like i do and its a different story
Oh yeah? I see it.
So that’s the enemy frontline huh? Makes sense why I can see their heads turned.
Where’s my frontline?
It’ll still end up the same way lol. Team with the momentum has the advantage regardless of the other one having coordination. There are ways to make the enemy team stumble over their own momentum, but it’s easier for them to continue rolling you than it is for you to recover from losing space.
He doesn’t need to be as mobile as doom, Nor did I say he was. So please stop making up stuff. Secondly you don’t need mobility to walk around a corner, that also happens to have a second door to enemies side or back line.
For example new queen street on either end of map close to players spawn, you will be at a point where you need to play around a hill, ontop of that hill is little room with open doorways to drop down on the enemy team side or back end. He can do that safely at any point once the cart gets close to that corner.
A rien can just drop shatter, a hog can hook freely at the dps/supports below. Dive tanks drop down on said players without burning mobility.
so you can do your aggro play, use tools like barrier to position back into that corner and repeat as much as you like. Till the enemy is in a position where they don’t have tools left to deal with you.
They don’t Winston can only hold such with a bubble up. Ball, d.va, doom are where ever they can smack the small fry.
Zarya is more of teams center piece then a hard front line. As she benefits from letting her team take aggro in a wide space around her as long as she has LOS to them. And a hack/emp/stuns can force her to eat damage without her bubble, which can kill quite easily for havign such low health.
Orisa, mauga, hog can be shot around and mostly dependent on getting picks before the enemy team does.
Rien, sigma are the only ones that can really hard hold a given lane or angle.
while ram can goes back and forth in being like sigma and the hog like group.
Most tanks don’t or simply can’t establish a front line and instead are bulky damage dealers that force the fight to break out around whatever they begin shooting at. More so then establishing some specific front line.
Yep, but like. They are human beings. They can choose to position around you and shoot at the rest of your team. Especially when you begin focusing someone else on their team. Your causing havok. But your not outright preventing damage going to your team.
That’s not how most dive tanks work.
Not much of an issue when you can counter with your own ult / hook /DM /shatter and more. After or during the fact.
That and you need to position very aggressively to do any of those things. And can get caught out for doing such.
like a d.va flying at a cassidy can still get slept at her side, you can keep hook from landing via suzu/mei wall and more.
Heck you can just stand infront of the cassidy in some cases. And just Mr.president you way into a free few kills. Doesn’t matter if someone else is slept, or hooked if cassidy gets of 2+ kills.
You can also charge a cassidy behind a wall, then have a mei raise him up above that wall. Ice block infront of him to break LOS while he is charging. Knock more of the enemy team into his LOS with Pharah if they choose to attempt to escape.
and keep in mind your tank is still in play, they still exist an can still do things even if their not fully charged up. Their just not taking all the aggro at the moment.
It’s not a hard 4v5. The tank isn’t dead.
Which is where you are losing the plot.
Except he does to be able to move around like Doom does.
Rein cannot just bounce around like any of the dive tanks can, he can not just move in and out of the backline freely. If you attempt to make the kinds of plays a Doom would on Rein, you will get CC’d into a corner and die instantly.
Literally said Winton is one of the exceptions
And then once her teammates bubbles are gone she has to move back into the frontline.
Oh, she can move back for 2 seconds? That means she can do whatever!
They have to be on the frontline to get picks, and Orisa and Mauga are DESIGNED AROUND SHOOTING THE TANK, meaning their pick is the tank. Mauga’s survival is literally tied to shooting the tank. Wherever the tank goes, Mauga must follow or he will die. Very few characters outside the tank roster can keep Mauga alive.
No he can’t? He’s as stuck to the frontline as Sigma is.
That’s in fact how they all work. If your team isn’t diving with you, then the way you’re protecting them is being a problem that forces the enemy team to take their attention away from yours. Ball especially as he isn’t required to return to his team every now and then like the other 3, Ball just rolls about and does whatever.
That depends entirely on the tanks being played. Sigma can rock you for free. D.va certainly doesn’t have to fly at you and can just sit there while her team just gets free shots off. Ram can just shield. Hog can just hook and bounce back behind cover while you get melted.
A 4v5 is still a 4v5. You’ve still just lost an ult and a teammate to force out one resource from the enemy team, assuming they even use an ability and don’t just all focus fire McCree.
He doesn’t need to, flanks and corners have ramps and stairs if not are just flat land. you don’t need to TP into a new Zipcode to get better positioning or get out of the LOS of the enemy team.
She can’t hold the front line without her bubbles. So she cycles around to stall them out for a moment. Or relies heavily of her supports to bail her out of a bad duel.
And is mostly relient on her damage to hold the space she is in.
PFft you can kill combo most small fry with these heroes. And nothing is stopping you from doing that.
Also like because are just big guns you can play around corners and use your mobility tools to push in and out as need by.
Hiding large chunks of your hit box, and keeping multiple sources of damage off of you is a huge benefit. Like keep in mind the point doesn’t move till one team is completely removed from the point.
You just need to get the kill and nothing else really matters.
Dude has a metric tone of armor and a speed boost, to run at and melee people. His DPS is trash against most tanks.
He is made to go chase and brawl one of the small fry, then establish a corner with his barrier to charge that back up. Dude is litterailyl made to cycle.
And you only really hold the attention of a hand full of players, not every one is in one neat little pile for you to slam and punch now. You will have people still pushing againt the rest of your team.
so are they going after you the tank? or the cassidy ulting?
Because like… Your forgetting both still exist at the same time in this scenario.
And they can in fact still do things and work together while the tank is getting healed outside of the focus fire. Especially if your pushing in with d.va or hog to go after Cassidy.
No one is dead, the tank just is around a corner getting healed. waiting for like the self heal/barrier to charge up while not under fire. Which can be the same corner you attempting to push into the team with.
if not getting ready to push your own team that you actively pushed away from to go after Cassidy.
so like… ya it’s not a 4v5. And no team will treat it like this. The tank is in play simple as that.
If Rein is not in front
Then he is flanking
Do I need to repeat this 10x more times?
Cause you can say “Rein can just flank” as much as you want, it doesn’t magically mean the awareness of high ranked players just ceases to exist.
So yeah
She’s a frontliner
None of the tanks can hold the frontline if they lack their abilities lmao
Orisa maybe, she can certainly throw in a sneaky javelin at someone being duelled by a flanker while she’s slapping about the tank, still a frontliner though and still designed primarily to bully the tank. Mauga on the other hand is throwing if he uses cardiac to survive off of a Tracer or a Kiriko. He should always be shooting the tank because if he stops, he will die. There are very few characters that Mauga can live off outside the tank roster.
Still frontlining lmao
Still frontlining lmao. You are still the one at the front of the team making all the pushes and taking the space. And if you stop paying attention to the tank, they will walk past you and kill your team or shoot you in the back of the head and kill you, especially if it’s a Mauga in the latter case. You’re correct that Ramattra is better suited to killing squishies, but he’s also more than capable of killing squishies while still brawling the tank. Piercing punches go brr.
That’s the point? Where do you think you were going with this lmao?
If you pull two individuals’ attention, then it becomes a 3v4 for the rest of your team, if three then 2v4.
The McCree? Why would they go after the tank who lacks the ability to safely make any plays over the ulting character?
Except your McCree ulted without anything to protect him from focus fire or any CC, so yeah he’s dead and you’ve lost an ult and a teammate.