Winston doesn’t have auto-lock… and he never does.
have i understood what you mean?
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Winston doesn’t have lock-on. His gun makes a cone in front of him, meaning if you step outside that cone, you stop taking damage immediately. As opposed to Sym’s lock on where you can walk directly behind her and you’ll still take damage for a bit before the beam detaches and you can stand right beside her without her looking at you and you’ll still be attached to the beam. Also Winston’s gun doesn’t amp up in dps the longer it’s on someone.
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It’s not that hard to survive from Winston with Mercy tbh, you have a 2s dash use it and you have allies use them.
Pretty much all of your points are wrong. I don’t know if I should even bother to refute them individually. But here’s some food for thought.
- Most of the time Winston isn’t damaging multiple enemies. He can, but he’s not going to typically 1 v 3. He’ll be feeding.
- Winston’s time to kill for a 200 hp character is 3 1/3 seconds. That’s what is important about his DPS. Symmetra’s is about 2.92 seconds if her beam isn’t charged off another hero first. If it is then it’s only 1 2/3 seconds. So, she has a lower time to kill currently. It’s going to be even lower with new Sym.
- Symmtra’s beam is going to be massively buffed in the DPS department. Unless you want her to remain completely irrelevant and not get the damage buffs then you have to sacrifice the auto-aim.
- The fact that the lock on had even a .5 second window where you could be around a corner or behind her and still maintain the lock on was not fair. It should have been 0.0 seconds. If you can’t track well enough to keep the target on your screen, you don’t deserve a kill.
Symmetra’s beam was not equivalent to Winston’s tesla gun. To make it so is disingenuous and shows a lack of understanding as to how these two weapons are different and how these heroes function.
One was a 200 hp support, the other was a 500 hp tank with a critbox the size of the moon. Now Sym is not going to be a support anymore and DPS heroes need to DPS which wouldn’t be right with her current weapon.
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DPS is a measure of damage per second only, not “damage per single target”. If he’s taking away 60 damage from 3 people on the enemy team, he’s still putting put 180 dps. There is no other way to put that.
Sym’s small hitbox is only an advantage if the enemy cant aim, so I don’t think its a fair criticism for assessing the skill each hero takes to play.
The fact that Winston’s damage doesn’t ramp is even more damning, because it means he doesn’t have to earn his damage like Sym, its just free.
But I’m not here to damn Winston. I’m merely pointing out the double-standard that Sym’s weapon is accused of being brainless whilst Winston gets of scot-free, despite the fact that Sym’s weapon is does less damage, has less counterplay and takes longer to do its full damage.
Wrong. Winston can put out his max. DPS instantly. Furthermore, his barrier will last at least 2 seconds, and considering the fact that his main weapon can kill a 200 hp in 3.3 seconds, and he has 500 health (some being armor), plus an aoe cone to work with, its more than feasible for him to kill a support hero just by suiciding in.
@Gojak
Assasinate my character all you like, but if you take the time to read thru my replies you’ll see I have never once advocated nerfing Winston. The point of this thread is to remind everyone that Symmetra and Winston are both no aim no brain heroes, and if one is unfair then so is the other.
Implying it takes any effort at all to “earn” damage with Sym 
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but 50 damage is still less than half sym’s max damage.
What??? 
winston does 35 damage a sec, 1.5X is roughly 50 damage.
Winston does 60 per second.
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This is silly, Sym is losing her lock on because it was a glass ceiling on her gun’s viability. Without it, they are buffing every aspect of it(range, damage, and a new shield interaction that restores ammo).
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Are you implying Winston always gets a 3 man kill simply diving in? You’re lucky when you can pull off one or two before having to dip out. Most times you jump in, do damage and have to escape because you’re taking in more damage than you’re doing. You only have 25 minutes on him versus all those hours you’ve put into Symmetra, I don’t think you can speak for how he’s played when you haven’t been on him enough to see how he really works.
The feeling’s mutual.
Even if this is true (and I question that), so what? You could argue the same for Sym, as most of the time she isn’t 1v1ing anyone. Even when I was in Diamond, 75% of my time was spent either playing with turrets, placing my ultimate, or spamming orbs. The laser is really not her selling feature, contrary to popular belief.
True, but Winston is also more likely to survive a 1v1 encounter than a Sym.
My opinion about the damage buffs is irrelevant, as the point of the thread is not whether the changes will make her more or less powerful.
My issue with the changes, and the point of the thread, is that I feel like her primary fire’s auto-lock is not being removed to increase her viability (as they could have done that without removing it as well).
Instead, I feel like the changes are being made to satisfy people who don’t even like or play Symmetra (especially, but not exclusively, the OWL/pro players). These people have parroted the opinion time and time again that auto-lock has no place in Overwatch, because of the lack of skill required.
Yet equally skilless heroes (by that definition) like Winston are allowed to go about their business, quite plainly because they are meta.
In this context, Symmetra’s primary fire is not being changes to help her, and for the sake of those that have an actual stake in her future (i.e. Sym mains), but to satisfy these entirely irrelevant parties, who woudl be equally happy if she was simply deleted from the game. And that’s wrong.
Lots of weapons in the game are unfair in this way. Why is Genji allowed to get kills by dashing in the general direction of a player? Why can Hanzo OHKO someone thru pure spam? Why does Rein, a tank, have an instakill? Why do instakills exist at all?
When you apply this line of thought to the entire hero roster, the meaningless of it quickly becomes apparent, because what you’re really complaining about is that one hero operates from a different set of rules than another.
However, even if you removed that .5 second los break window, that still wouldn’t stop it being an auto-lock weapon. It would just be an even worse auto-lock weapon.
And all of this is entirely beside the point, because the point is why is Sym chastised from having a brainless main weapon when other equally brainless heroes get a free pass.
Because she’s off-meta, and an easy target, that’s why.
Mei has a similar TTK to Symmetra and doesn’t need 200 dps, so why does Sym? Answer: She doesn’t.
The point of this thread is to remind everyone that Symmetra and Winston are both no aim no brain heroes, and if one is unfair then so is the other.
So many people have explained how this is wrong already. The responses explaining this to you have been super thorough and clear. Just read the thread.
It’s willful ignorance at this point on your part. There’s obviously not a single answer that would satisfy you. It’s frustrating to read everything that’s been said here and still see you not getting it. I think it’s time to just move on, everyone.
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Eh, between Winston not ramping up his DPS and being able to hit multiple people, he does actually do more consistent damage than Symmetra. That is objective fact. Not that it makes a difference. I am just saying, that is the truth.
I thought Winston could deal damage behind barriers. I barely play him or barrier tanks, so I would not be entirely certain. If that is the case though, it definitely bolsters the argument. That being said, it is far more difficult to kill Winston with headshots than a Symmetra because he has over twice her effective health. Do not get me wrong, I would rather be up against a Winston than a dancing Symmetra. In terms of just raw stats, Winston is superior.
I am all for the rework too, but your “opinion” is just wrong.
Whats the DPS on Mei RMB when it crits.
Funny because multiple posters have also responded agreeing with me.
Oh wait, silly me, I forgot you weren’t posting to have a discussion, you just wanted to shout me down.
EDIT:
@idSurge
About the same as Symmetra’s secondary fire regularly, 44-150 vs. Sym’s 26-125.
Of course I was talking about their primary fire, but they’re still very similar overall.
Agreed. I don’t think that no aim = no brain, and while different heroes require different levels and kinds of skills, all heroes require some kind of skill to master and excel with. To perpetuate that train of thought for either hero (or any hero) does more harm than good.
I shoot Pharahs out of the sky as Reaper all the god damn time. Pharah kinda lacks the ability to stay very high for very long.
People have this stupid notion in their head that Pharah can only be hit by S76, McCree, and maybe Bastion and everyone else is a pig and can’t look up.
He’s a tank. Tanks should survive 1 v 1 encounters. They are tanks.
No, they couldn’t have. Put that notion out of your mind. It was not possible to make her anything other than f-tier as a DPS without changing her gun.
It doesn’t, at least not like Sym. Other characters have enough differences from Sym to make it OK but Sym needs to be higher DPS and it doesn’t work there.
Winston isn’t equally skill-less. Winston’s weapon is fundamentally different from Symmetras. Everyone is telling you so and you just refuse to understand. Some pros think Winston is one of the highest skill cap characters in the game, but they laugh at Symmetra. She needs this change. She will not only be more viable, but she’ll be more accepted by the community. It will make it better to play as Symmetra.
It absolutely is being changed for her benefit. I’m sorry you don’t see that right now. Maybe after she becomes a viable, maybe even meta pick then you will understand.
Because hers was the least skilled weapon in the entire game bar none. And it couldn’t be buffed without changing it. There are other weapons that require low aim, but no others that could kill someone outside of FOV.
Mei’s TTK if you didn’t get headshots is 2.22 seconds which is faster than Syms 2.92. With headshots it is only 1.11 which is more than twice as fast at Sym. So, yeah, they aren’t really all that similar.
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