No one gives u algorithms, not just blizz
2 Likes
Ooof, that’s gotta hurt. Truebut hurtfull
1 Like
thanks again for making these every season, way more people should read this
3 Likes
I honestly think the matchmaker is as noisy and terrible as it is due to cheaters. It’s trying to figure out the mmr of them and balance around them in all elos. It’s generating toxicity and people are misattributing it.
In all honesty at this point obtaining a better anti-cheat will lower toxicity and the knockdown effect on what the mmr system devolves into.
Easy fix – don’t put me vs. anyone with an SR more than 100 higher than mine. Don’t say queue times will be too long either, I don’t believe it and don’t care. I’d much rather wait 30 minutes for a FAIR fight than play two insanely unfair matches in that same amount of time.
this is an easy fix. you should be able to set SR parameters and it should give you feedback on expected queue times.
if we had QoL for the LFG you could 25 other people that play during your time and similar to you mindset. once you have these 25 friends, the match maker only needs to find 6 more.
The silver bullet for the matchmaker, is not to use it. but the tools they give us to cast off the burden of matchmaker are lackluster
Here is my data for 20 games on my 1100 account and my 64 account.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Y9nPBftKfRztopksyrJUczCdDMCmtCUEl4U4Jdl0cVA/edit?usp=sharing
and here is the screenshots for those games:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dlYgyTlbm0DB_RaVJ4CPE_b1JNEhxvEz/view?usp=sharing
Results:
1100 avg teammate level: 365
1100 avg enemy level: 285
00 avg teammate level: 247
00 avg enemy level: 246
and this is on the LOW end, the very bottom as I counted in hundreds instead of being exact. The average level I saw was 400 for my high end account and 200 for my low end account. The low end account also had substantially more leavers where my higher end had none.
“Role MMR is a hidden number that goes up when a player wins, and down when that player loses. How much it goes up and down is a complicated formula, based on many factors, but the essential truth of wins are good and losses are bad is certain.”
complicated formula, based on many factors, huh?
why don’t you just show some good faith and let us have peek at it?
oh, no?`
why?
because its CoMpLiC4t3d?
weak.
STOP HIDING THE MACHINE, IF THERE’S NO FUNNY BUSINESS; ONLY BORING MATH - LET US SEE IT!
1 Like
Exactly. I’d love to audit that kindergartenkode. My 5 y.o. learned to make a matchmaker on her tablet in Scratch today. It sure doesn’t use TrueSkill/ELO because even kids know people who run that kind of system may as well run themselves out of a job.
I think that this ‘matchmaker’ effectively throws a dart at a dartboard with a ‘blindfolded’ bot to determine the outcome of a match.
Thanks for the data. It looks like your dps account is seeing players of about 75 levels higher than your tank account. Your dps account is also ranked a bit higher (about 130 SR). My hypothesis is that higher SR players have higher level, on average (because players become better with experience), and that is why you are seeing higher levels in your dps matches.
The alternative hypothesis, that Blizzard is matching on level, but only a bit, is just kinda weird. Why would they do this? If they decided to match on level, I would expect it to be a lot less subtle, especially for accounts under 100.
It would be nearly impossible to get exact SR comparisons and I don’t particularly believe that it’s that much of a factor. I can do game as support (1100: 1669, 67: 1632) and probably see the same result. [EX: Tank and support accounts starting match at +/- 300 instead of +/- 100 like it was before rolequeue. See Also: Overwatch Forums where I talk about the SR divide between players and overall being in the <50 of each other with only a few spikes into the 300sr range. Recently tanks and supports are commonly out of their rank, for faster dps queue times.]
With MMR the way it is - the closer to the middle you are the closer to mid level the players you should see as there are simply more people at a wider range of levels, if it were just random groups.
It might have something to do with the age of the account. My 60 account is fairly new (less than 6 months) while my 1100 is over 2.5 years at this point.
When I queued for tank (1700) on my dps account I also get really high level groups and it’s not an isolated incident. This happens ALL the time.
https://imgur.com/a/WWjMRS6
I tell ya, I’m not just talking out of my butt when I say things.
[edit:] The main reason I believe they do this is to try and mitigate the amount of smurf/throw accounts placed with older, more established, accounts to give a sense that there are less smurfs and throwers as people play more. I come to this conclusion because my newer account has a substantially more volatile experience than my older account. Don’t get me wrong my older account has problems sometimes but not nearly as much as my lower level account.
[edit2:] It would also explain the phenomenon of older accounts seeing more teammates leaving on the OTHER side and newer accounts seeing them leave at random or on their side.
1 Like
Nothing about how they make teams.
I am pretty sure they are matching people based on levels too. But mmr has higher priority. You can very often see low level accounts on both sides as game is trying to balance levels too. But sadly one team have high ranked player on alt and other team new player often too.
2 Likes
I apologize for my slow response. Holidays are very busy for me.
It is often difficult to gather conclusive data, yes, especially if you are trying to explain subtle effects.
I guess you just didn’t want to play support? This would have been a significantly better test (and I indicated before hand that I would be suspicious of results where the SRs were not matched). It also helps that they are the same role.
People have reported all sorts of funny business with tank matchmaking. I would not be surprised if many of these reports are true, as the game struggles to make matches without enough people queuing for tank.
This debate reminds me a lot of the debate of whether quick play MMR affects competitive, where I sure how things work, and so are people that say exactly opposite things. If Blizzard made a clear, new statement, I could point to that, but it probably still wouldn’t convince everybody.
I didn’t actually realize the SRs were so close. I don’t often look at my support sr.
Its just my experience, I often see low level people matched in one game, both sides have them and its not because of MMR as i asked them several times. One side has completely new player and enemy side has diamond smurf.
As I said MMR has definitely priority. Then they probably try to match levels if possible which is hard these days I guess because there is so many people with high levels vs a lot of new account with low levels.
Again, my experience, my opinion. I can be wrong, I am fine with that. I didnt really make notes about this and didnt count levels in my games. Its a thing of past anyway probably as we have much smaller community than we had in past and people had much lower levels so it was a lot more easy to match people by it.
Btw one funny story about this. I started to level up new account, my first QP game ever on it, everyone in game is lvl 1 or 2 expect one guy, who was Grandmaster, silver frame 
(It was several seasons ago btw)
I could not believe that as I never saw anything like that before on new account :). Sometimes is matchmaker doing weird things 
Completely unrelated but not really: I mentioned you in my previous post, was hoping you’d take a look at it because you seem like the guy to ask. I wasn’t sure how else I could contact you or get your attention, so apologies for the off topic reply. Thanks for your time.