Genji is OP against who he counters, UP against his counters

Yep

Using “euphemism” wrong btw, just as you did “straw man” lol…

Yep x 2

Yep x 3

Dynamite, Bastion Assault mode, sticky bomb/focusing beam, storm arrows etc are all very powerful. Junkrat’s concussive mine is versatile. Mei’s wall is versatile. Soldier is all around versatile and powerful…

There are more. I’m not gonna list them all lol…

He is literally the most inferior flanker there is. He does the least damage out of all of them, he charges his ult very slowly compared to all of them and can get 2tapped or 1shot by basically anything.

The only supior aspect of genji compared to other flankers is his ability to access highgrounds.
He does less damage, has predictable movement when he jumps and if he misses a shot on a combo he is always dead.
He cannot even blade without nano if a torb has a turret available because he just dies from it.

And because of all the movement increases of heroes or survivability buffs he is just bad compared to tracer for example. Ontop of that, the only great thing about him is his ultimate.

And nowdays blade can get shut down or messed up by nearly any tank or support.

He can get pinned or booped by pin, he can get knifed by jq, the shout can make someone survive long enough, hog hook, whole hog, zarya bubbles and graved, doomfist punched, dva boosters can knock him out of course and mess up his intial dash, ball can boop or piledrive him, winston can primal him after a dash, sigma can rock him, rammatra can vortex him and orisa can spear, ult, or javelin spin.

Supports, ana can sleep him, brig can whipshot, zen can tranq and kick, lucio can beat and boop him, moira can fade, lifeweaver can petal platform a target or life grip a target, bap can immo field, kiriko can tp, wall climb or suzu targets or ult for the movement speed.
And then the dps can just sojourn slide, mei iceblock or wall, torb can overload, cass can hinder him, ashe can coachgun or bob him, reaper can fade or deathblossom him (or his team and trade), phara can knockback, junkrat can trap and mine him away or himself, etc.

And ontop of that he can just get countered by simply spreading out or shooting him and actually hitting the shots.
Thats just a number of things from the top of my head.
So a nanoboost and a slow charging ultimate that can get countered or messed up completely by one of the above things if the genji misstimes or misses 1 ability that is still available.
Compared to a tracer who got buffed again because kiriko and ana can no longer 2shot him and brigs shield is weaker meaning she is less effective against her because tracer can now kill the shield relatively easily to pulsebomb her.

My guy denial is not a rebuttal:
1 - You pretended I said those 2 abilities make him outperform anyone : Thats a strawman
2 - When I pointed out how powerful and versatile (busted) the abilities were, you called them “fun” instead. Thats an euphemism. They are “fun” because they are powerful and insanely versatile, hence you are downplaying it from “busted” to “just fun”.

And here we go, thanks for exposing yourself.
All of them are literally countered by Deflect or using SS appropriately lol.

There are none buddy. You took the bait and failed :wave:

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No hes a close range fighter and deflect is his survival tool like wraith and rewind which are both better then deflect.

Your nit getting countered your getting skill diffed.

Lol if i was to make a dps hero non of genji abilities would be in them if i was making an op hero. Genjis abilities are trash alone they wouldn’t work on qny other hero but fhey work together in genjis kit look at reaper i would take wraith orver deflect. The look at sojourn i would take her rail gun over dash and primarygun i would take soldiers primary over genjis and passive i would take reapers over genjis and ult i would take suns over genjis

Zarya winston sigma doom ball for tanks

Mei ash cassady sym echo pharah for dps.

Lucio zen ana moira brig

She can counter him before he even gets to your team if you put turrets in common flank spots he has plus she can slow him making it easier to kill him.

… what? :rofl:
Dude Deflect KILLS people, Wraith doesnt. Also Wraith can’t really be used offensively, if you do it, you are dead in 5, 4, 3, 2 …

Railgun is not bad, but it doesn’t save your life buddy: SS does.
You can push in OR out with Dash AND get a reset.
Railgun can only potentially get you kills, its powerful sure, but not even close as versatile as SS.

Yeah stop right there bud, I said “abilities”. Primary or Sec are not that. We are not talking about those.

Are you dence genjis mobility is so bare bones you want onsane movement look at lucio doom and ball all which have better survival abilities then deflect

Wraith cleanses reloads makes me faster and accualy Invincible to all damage.
Also deflect is not an offencive tool im high ranks its an engaging and disengaging tool like wraith

I think getting 195 damage ever 1.35 second would same a dps players life.

I was making a hero with the best abilities of the top of my head so i just whent all the way

Even with melee heros parey dagger could be used to block large weapons in history so i see no problem with a hyper sonic sword blocking a slower then sound hammer and flail

Used-To-Be Genji main here. Currently Mid-To-High Diamond in all ranks, if that matters. I’ll try to give a less biased review of the Genji problem.

First of all, does he need to be looked at by the balance team?
In the current meta? No. At most some of his more infuriating interactions should get toned down while adding QoL here and there.

Why?
Balancing Genji is like walking on a very thin rope, even a tiny buff that brings him over to slightly overtuned will be squeezed for all it’s value by good Genji mains, to the point where increasing his damage Anywhere without heavy nerfs elsewhere would make him a must pick IMO. Maybe not so much in lower ranks, since unless you’re smurfing Genji is a nigh throw pick there, but Top 500s would have a field day with even buffing his Shurikens damage by one.

The reason as to why you see so many complaints about him varies depending on the POV: Of course there’s the folks that believe he should get buffed because he’s their OTP and is one of the highest skill ceiling heroes. Let’s ignore those.
Others lament his lack of impact against sustain, sometimes I find myself falling in this group though it’s an opinion driven by frustration more than anything else. Genji used to be able to Solo Dive Supports by taking longer flanks. Thanks to higher, overall easier to land sustain along with the Support Passive this is no longer possible. It doesn’t make him weak at all, just necessitates a mindset shift. Within OW2’s Ecosystem he’s there to pick off isolated targets or focus down whatever the Tank is shooting at or even better, whatever is healing what the Tank is shooting at.

Then there’s the other end of the spectrum. Supports and DPSs without sustain that find him frustrating to kill and get killed by. It is unfortunate, but that’s how the game goes. Frustration should not be cause of balance changes.

To address some of the comment’s complaints about his abilities:
Deflect as an ability quickly looses effectiveness the higher up you go in rank, where mind games are the main focus. Everyone anticipates a Genji to have deflect ready on engage and to proc it once he gets shot at, so the Genji’s job is to catch the enemy offguard with it. Should it receive the changes proposed by OP? No. I’ve seen the argument of Genji being good enough in close range where it isn’t necessary (Which, especially against melee heroes, really isn’t the case), but it’s more of a slight survivability boost than anything worth writing home about. Good Genjis will waste your time by tanking one or two hits and dash out. It’s up to you to gauge whether the Genji will keep engaging afterwards or GTFO (Hence no need to spend time on them). Also, fun fact, Deflect Does have a cast time. It’s a couple of frames at most, but it’s lead to a lot more deaths than I’d like to admit.

Swift Strike and it’s reset is what makes Genji viable in the first place. Touching any of it’s fundamental mechanics would be akin to what happened to Doomfist with the switch over from OW2 Beta to OW2 Release. Dash in, get a kill, get out is Genji’s gameplay loop. Altering the reset on kill, the ability itself etc would fundamentally make Genji worst to play, both from a fun and viability prospective.

Another complaint many have is Nanoblade, and yeah it is an issue but it’s more a Nanoboost than Dragonblade problem. It’s as problematic as Nano Ram.
Tl;Dr If you want him buffed, git gud. If you want him nerfed, try to change your approach to engaging him. If you’re getting stomped by one, blame Bliz for putting you up a smurf or curse his supports for enabling him. He can’t do jack without team support.

No thats still tracer shes a must pick hero at higher ranks you would have to make gnejis damage 30 to make him a must pick hes a high c tier hero. Hes just a skill check at multiple ranks and thats why people call him op.

And any heros main will pull all they can out of a hero like for lucio i practice my combos on him so i can deal with widows if we dont have a good flanker.

And even then traver was better and in high ranks your off tnak would come with you. I dont think people realize how much genji lost with the lose of hus teams off tank.

Nano boost does need removed from genji like its been removed from other heros like hanzo rat and dva.

Exactly he has little solo carry potential i have games where i go 40 kills 4 deaths and we loose because i cant kill the widow help peel the tracer keep point all at once itsl ike jungle in mobas you cant carry like the other roles can

Nope.
Again, all I said refutes this.

Sure, still not as versatile and still a RMB thing, not really an “ability”.

No it does not.

So what is an ability please explain because i constisder every thing on a hero an ability because we can change it our like you can a gun in a cod game

Unless you refuse to read, yes it does.
You said its a cleanse that makes you invincible and faster.

Deflect literally prevents that thing to hit you (nade generally) in the first place AND can throw it back to the attacker my dude. Since you are invincible to ANYTHING that is not a beam, its basically the same but with more uses.

Again, facts are not changing:
You can’t use Wraith offensively like Deflect.

Anything that is not a passive, a primary fire or a secondary fire button.

PS: I get it. Wraith is easier to use and requires less reaction/proactivity, still not better than Deflect in terms of power and versatility.

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And what do you do when it goes around you because deflect its not 360. Throw it over genji and it will track to his back. Second reaper becomes truly invincible and get his gun reloaded along side a speed boost letting him get into a fight or out of it while for deflect to do damage you have to have the have the enemy shoot you so in high rank you have to predict them shooting and teh usaly stop

Shouldn’t, but we already know it is, with Hog and Sombra sitting in the bottom of a dumpster and heroes like brig and mercy getting nerfed Several Times since their creation for other peoples fun.

I don’t see why Genji, or anyone should be exempt if this is how the devs balance the game.

(Not that I think Genji needs nerfs really, but he should never be exempt if the reasoning for nerfs would be ‘hes frustrating to deal with’.)

Shes was only bad for 1 season then got good buffs and was s teir for 2 seasons now shes sits again with genji in c tier because all the heros shes great against are not meta

She’s a mixed bag imo. Either dominates a lobby or can’t get anything done, usually the latter if it’s not comp/high ranks. That’s why I consider her trash still.

Also I wouldn’t put Genji in C tier right now, he’s at least a B+. Though I haven’t been playing this season too much so I could be wrong.

Genjis last season was b- because the meta favored him this season the meta doesnt and hes c+ if your team builds around you c- if they dont

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