META doesn’t really affect the general player base to the extent that you think it does. That’s largely irrelevant.
Most players still played whatever they wanted.
You’re still wrong. Your rationalization of the entire situation is hilarious, though.
I mean, it’s not like no one else has ever used that same talking point on these forums - even in response to me. May have been you, even!
Additionally, GOATs wasn’t really about tanks and supports being over tuned. Tanks and supports were not much different before Briggitte was added into the game. It was the synergy that Brig had with Rush/Sustain comps that caused that meta to bubble up.
In other words, GOATs would not have worked if Brigitte wasn’t in the game. Her existence, and the extent to which she was overtuned, was the primary enabler of that composition. If Tanks and Supports were overtuned in general, we would have seen a 3-3 meta before Brigitte was added into the game. We did see some Quad Tank, but that was short lived (and often relied on a solo Mercy zipping around, so hardly the hallmark of an overtuned archetype).
Put current Brig in GOATs and it isn’t as strong. Her Shield, Healing output, Rally, and CC were all over tuned. You’re conflating issues with Brig to everything in the Tank and Support Roles.
They had to nerf everything down because they couldn’t just #DeleteBrig and had to deal with it in other ways, to force GOATs out of the META. That did involve tuning other heroes, because you couldn’t just expect teams to not play Brigitte, or not play a GOATs comp as long as it remained glued together and as strong as it was.
I understand what META means, and my disagreement isn’t with the definition.
It’s with you idiotically projecting an issue with ONE HERO as an issue with TWO COMPLETE ARCHETYPES comprising of about 10-15 heroes.
Without Brigitte, Goats wouldn’t have ever existed. The fact that she was so OP is what enabled it, and the extent to which she was was so extreme that the comp eventually dropped moira and just added in Zenyatta, instead.
She provided insane peel, sustain, and CC.
The “META” is largely irrelevant out side of the top 3-5% of players. People were barely running goats below Masters, and even there you saw a ton of non-GOATs comps.
If you think Silver and Gold players were playing GOATs because it was META, you clearly have been are misinformed. It’s hard to play GOATs decently when you can’t even rely on players communicating, coordinating, and cycling ults properly.
The definition of META is not a factor in this dialog. Do youunderstand that?
Dude, making dps stronger vs tanks/supports will for a fact exacerbate dps queue times.
And what I said about goats still applies.
No, I do not think that, and I don’t know how you got that impression.
Just because lower ranks don’t take advantage of it doesn’t detract from the argument. Just like how global warming doesn’t literally mean the temperature of every point in the world goes up.
You think if the dps role got their impact reduced absolutely none of them will queue other roles?
If you do, then you clearly have been misinformed.
If you don’t, then you agree with the converse statement, i.e. buffing tanks/supports will alleviate dps queue times.
Hopefully OW2 remedies the queue times as one less tank required should launch games faster…
Not 100% accurate. If tanks and supports felt more ‘rewarding’ to play (currently only multi-kills get feedback during a match which is usually the DPS doing it) then more tank and support players may feel better about the role.
…any game with 10+ minute queues for a role (DPS) is not in a good place though…
I’d say it’s more 1/3-5/10 minutes for the respective roles (tank/supp/dps) for silver to plat…
…to which they’ve acknowledged and are working on…
100% disagree. Games are for entertainment. The individual plays the roles they enjoy and have no ‘obligation’ to play roles they don’t to have 0.000001% impact on queue times.
It’s not ‘their fault’ they only want to play DPS no more than some people play Mercy and nothing else because some people only want to play Mercy.
Ultimately it’s up to the game developers to come up with a solution, not the players…
Sounds like shirking at least partial responsibility to me. If people want to play all dps matches there are modes and other games for that. Go play those.
That’s like saying a QP player is at fault for low gravity having long queue times. It’s a ridiculous argument and suggests people play things they don’t want to…
Been saying this for a while now but everyone refutes it.
Wouldnt change anything Mercy could have 600hp never die and be the most broken character in the game and the queues wouldnt be short because DPS would be the favourite role still role queue is just flawed open queue was better.
I think the bottleneck is region dependent. Because in oceanic region (Sydney server) it seems like support is the bottleneck. Since every time I try to queue for competitive as tank, it takes twice as long as support, especially later in the evening.
Even in quickplay, if support estimated queue time is <2 minutes, tank usually says <3 minutes (and DPS is usually x2 or x2.5 times that amount, so ~6 - 8 minutes.)
What do you mean? This is exactly what all the DPS mains wanted. Do you know how many threads saying “I’m okay with a longer queue if it means balanced team” there were before role queue was added? Well, you got what you wished for and now the DPS complain the queues are too long.
Apparently they don’t. Every queue was like a tank queue (10-20 seconds) before RQ, but that didn’t sit right with DPS mains. The devs did what people wanted and then it turned out you hate it.
Yup, Role Queue happened just and only because of DPS. Seems QPC is gonna be a sub-mode of “unranked” in OW2 (judging by the beta), so that’s good. I just don’t know if I’m gonna be playing that now cause I’ve gotten so used to getting free money just for maining tank.
You’re right, it’s a reanimated corpse. Some strong necromancy going on here.
I do think the game design itself overall reinforces players to pick DPS.
The DPS roster is the largest. Having more choices at the character select screen should not be understated.
It allows casual players to pick characters they like based on things like appearance or playstyle, and more competitive minded players get more options to strategically respond to a variety of situations.
Kills are emphasized more in the feed and are more likely to be highlighted in the play of the game.
Most of the stats available to players to measure their performance center around damage and kills.
Yes, players can pick whatever role they want, but DPS offers a lot of very strong incentives to influence player preferences.
More effort should be placed on incentives for non-DPS options.
Yes and no
Passes on its own do nothing because they cant create tanks out of air for people using them, and they give them easy so everyone can have that so priority q is just normal q anyway
But… they make some pick tanks instead of dps at least few times.
So yea, they basicially bait non tanks to play tank to make q times little shorter. Thats what priority pass is for.
Solution blizzard style, YAEA!
That’s the whole point. Most players don’t want to play tank and support and it has nothing to do with whether or not those classes are “fun” to play. It has everything to do with most game’s natural want to do damage and kill in video games.
It can take 5 minutes to find a match on counter strike ranked, with a terrible ELO spread (mixing silvers with double aks), on a game that features no hero types. So yeah, could you elaborate?
