I’m not trying to fix the unpopularity of barrier tanks either, just trying to make Orisa a bit more balanced and create diverging different comps available for play at ladder level.
Yeah tbh Sigma threw balance out the window with his bloated kit.
I put his release higher on the “messed the game balance over” list - even above Brigitte - because he actually forced a meta in every, single, rank after his release. Brigitte didn’t even do that.
Double shield happened because it was inevitable; as soon as two characters with shields was added, double shield was possible.
Double shield was only a problem because lack of sufficient shield counters. Blizzard refuses to buff Symmetra, Sombra, and they only JUST buffed bastion, and they let two dummy thick shields run amok.
Don’t blame Sigma; there are tools in the game that would allow Double Shield to exist AND have plenty of counters.
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Well, I could meet you halfway on that giving Orisa a stronger barrier and a weaker fortify is what I would do regardless.
Even if that means babysteps now, but bigger steps (not too much) later.
To say this now means you must sniffing glue or something. Sigma’s considered a throw pick, the problem now is constant Winston.
Its not that they’re versatile, its just that they’re objectively better for tanking damage. Like, would you rather get shot and die, or have a shield to protect you.
The solution there is to give Tanks passives that reinforce tanking. Simple ones, too.
Winston could get a passive where he get’s more ult charge from being CCed and can ult while stunned. This would allow winstons to forcibly get between characters with strong CC skills and take the blow for their teammates.
Hog could get a passive where he gives the enemy less ult charge. That would allow him to body block like he’s good at.
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I feel like like is just Sigma being in the wrong place at the wrong time. There could have been another shield tank that could have went with Orisa and double shield. There are a lot of times now where Rein is paired with Orisa for double shield.
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I reckon the queue times issue is dead and done as far as OW1 is concerned. We’ll likely see a reworked version of 1-3-2 in OW2 that will be the main comp and that will be it.
Until then buckle up and leave that YT window open.
I look at it this way, queue times need to be fixed in the next 2-3 months.
And OW2 doesn’t come out until the next 6-10 months.
Outside of 1-3-2 I don’t see that happening.
Hopefully OW2 can bring a bunch of new folk and not just stop the leak.
Maybe. But if BarrierTanks could have just as much fun as OffTanks it would help a lot.
Also OW2 is gonna fail, if the OW1 playerbase collapses before it launches.
Sigma should have been an off-tank. His shield should be the one that has less HP than Orisa’s as he has a second damage-blocking ability (Kinetic Grasp).
They should probably reverse the 1 second CD nerf on his shield. Sigma’s niche could be that he can constantly reposition his shield, but it has low HP, while Orisa is able to hold one spot on a choke for a while.
What I think?
I think they will always complement each other for good tanking.
- The only thing they lack is mobility, which you can use a Lucio.
But they have:
- Good barrier uptime when alternated
- Sigma’s barrier has positional flexibility
- Both can “Body-Tank” with Fortify+250armor and Kinetic Grasp
- Orisa has long range spam damage, but not AOE
- Sigma has less range, but AOE damage, which can be complemented by halt (AOE damage enabler).
- Orisa has displacement CC with Halt, Sigma has stun CC with Accretion.
That’s all there is good about tanking except for mobility that they don’t have. They pretty much complement each other for those things.
You could use Rein for good barrier uptime and positional flexibility, but you will lack ranged attack, despite the fact that his melee can be AoE.
Maybe the game doesn’t have space for more than one tank with Range+Barrier+BodyTanking abilities,
that’s why Orisa was good alone in the past, but now we have 2 of those: Orisa+Sigma, so they get to complement each other and be meta. Whatever future tank with that combination of abilities they release will compete to be meta.
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The main problem with Sigma is how little room you have to counter him, and how seems to have an answer for everything.
Enemies push past the barrier? Use rock, enemies caught you off guard with burst damage, use grasp. The barrier can block damage regardless of whether it’s being placed or stationary, and because of his range he can entirely control where and when to fight.
He has so many advantages it’s very hard to kill him unless he royally messes up.
A simple change to fix him would just to make him barrier not block damage until it is placed, this way he has a point where if you catch while he’s moving his barrier he’s vulnerable to burst damage, and therefore easier to kill. He’s far more readable this way.
100% agree about sigma ruining orisa. sigma is very fun to play but if you ask me sigma never should have been launched into the game at all. why did ow need barrier tank #4?
perhaps in ow2 if more tank/barrier buster heroes were added to the game, then sigma could have been a welcomed addition to the game. but why did the devs think that a intercastable, stationary, resource barrier at 1500 health was healthy for overwatch? especially at the time when bunker comp was dominating the meta
edit: hold on imma make a sigma rework concept thread
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Double Barrier would have been counterable had Sym not been nerfed into obsolescence.
Bunker was de facto meta before double shield and there are Orisa/Rein double shield comps. Double shield is just good.
Maybe if numbers dwindle enough we’ll some some content planned for OW2 as OW1 content drop, but I doubt it. Any content released now makes OW2 smaller, so there’s a balance to strike there.
I fully expect a completely new UI in OW2, one that is specific to each role, as well a multiple tanks reworked with a different philosophy in mind, atop of 3-2-1, and that ought to do it for queue times.
actually if anything symmetra enabled double barrier more. a sym requires to have a barrier tank. during syms strongest days right before her nerfs she took double barrier a step further and made it an unbearable triple barrier meta. there were too many barriers and beam damage thanks to her turrets
sym was meta during double barrier she never countered it
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I really think they are, because they can be used in so many ways.
- Counter ults D.va, Doom, Junk
- Moveable damage block, micro blocking I guess? (e.g Ashe’s bomb next to team, just turn as Rein or reshield as Sig)
- Pocket shield DPS/Support in good situations (e.g Torb turret, high ground DPS, Support retreating)
- Use to stop healing on enemy Rein (I mainly do this as Sig, but it’s extremely effective)
- Make up for bad positioning or bunker
- They stop Beams and all CC abilities, except Mei Ult I guess
There’s probably more, but you can do all of this while not feeding Ult as others may have to while trying to do the same thing.
And you’re right about what they do. They effectively give yout team a higher health pool.
The problem with tanking in this way is that it completely blocks the sight of the people you’re protecting. This can cause a team fight loss because of counter pressure (another reason Shields are better). This is why I disagreed with people saying to make Hog bigger etc.
Although it does seem like the most straight forward fix you could make, we have to remember that this is an FPS game with lots of flashing lights, so the less screen clutter the better.
I completely agree with you.