Tanks still die in games without Ana or Zen.
It goes away after two seconds, but there’s no cooldown so it’ll be back as soon as he sees you again.
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They are playing poorly then.
I want you to bring in game balance, scenarios, data, player experience and give advice on how this could possibly be solved.
What you’re providing is just an empty complaint.
Asking players to experience it shows that you don’t have an argument, at least not right now. Otherwise you would’ve used an argument.
There is no point being made by just telling players to go experience it, whilst you know experiences are completely subjective.
It promotes a discussion, yes! But it doesn’t provide you with an argument, which I’d believe is important here.
Tbh, people like Lucio/Brig who can perpetually boop the tank away are also very viable options. Ball is extremely vulnerable to being booped since his movement acceleration raises dramatically in ball form, and D.va and Winston both have movement cds that are heavily harmed by simply throwing them back.
And you’ve hit the nail on the head here: The only real way for a tank to stop Zen is to dive him, but Zen is also good at counter dive for tanks. So… what is a tank supposed to do if Zen discords them all game?
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You mean afk? Did you try to go afk for 3 seconds in gm lobbies and then immediately get it back when you return?
No, it’s not an instant kill, it just uninstalls your entire game for a match.
Ah you are one of those…
it’s all about winning your duels. you have a tank duel and zen is winning it for his tank.
yes
thank you
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just kill zen he has like 1hp lmao
yeah, just switch sobra and kill him, what’s the problem, tank?
I feel like people underestimate how big of a nerf it is to have 30% less health.
I forget if it’s a 25% or 30% debuff, but I’ll just assume 30% since that’s what the wiki says, unless they didn’t update it, which in that case oh well, can’t be arsed to scour through patch notes.
That pretty much changes people’s effective health from:
200 → 140
250 → 175
400 → 280
600 → 420
Just for some examples, mind you discord doesn’t really affect me because I don’t play tank, but it’s pretty easy to see how discord can be extremely annoying to deal with when a lot of playing tank involves using your health as a resource to push up and create space, so having 30% of that suddenly missing can be super annoying.
Not really sure how they should tweak discord orb, all I can really say is that it disproportionately affects tanks since they have to be frontliners and trying to LOS a Zen constantly is basically throwing.
2 Likes
It does, but you have to stay out of LOS for a couple of seconds. Also, it effectively reduces tank HP to 80% of base, w/ 87.5% of base damage dealt to the tank generated as ult charge.
Discord makes tanks into ult batteries. It’s nuts.
Sorry, but you’re kind of wrong here, for one key reason: Ball has no way of blocking discord, and ALL of ball’s defenses are affected by it. Heroes like rein/Sigma/D.va/Orisa/Rammatra/winston/d.va have defenses that, even when that hero is discorded, are still just as strong. D.va’s DM still absorbs 100% of the damage even when discorded. Discord doesn’t effect barriers.
Ball doesn’t have a single defense that is not harmed by discord. Everything in his kit is harmed by discord, and it takes literally no aim, so his mobility does nothing to counter the discord.
Discord is the single biggest counter to Ball in the entire support roster, and likely one of the largest in the entire game. Instantly slicing 25% of his health AND his defensive shielding all game long pretty much toasts his ability to dive effectively.
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It’s 25% damage received, or effectively a 20% reduction in health.
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dont really agree but explain how this matters anyways? discord and 1 or 2 others poking ball out is one of the only direct ways to counter him specifically. complaining about discord for making the giga hp stat tanks vulnerable just comes off to me as whining because you are being countered and cant adapt
It’s 25% more damage taken which works out to 20% less effective health. So it’s like this:
200 → 160
250 → 200
400 → 320
600 → 480
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And tanks rely on being in the fight in order to actually do anything. The idea that you can just never be in Zen’s LOS is frankly silly, especially since it stays stuck on you for 3 seconds afterwards. There is no world where tanks, who are low-range heroes, can somehow be just as effective while also NOT being in Zen’s LOS.
But they can’t kill dive tanks or really contribute to killing them much. And by sitting on whoever is getting dove all game, they lose A LOT of value as a support. And despite that, there’s still ways for dive tanks to play around them, especially Brig. They can just focus the tank or anyone who plays up, and those three repair packs isn’t going to be enough to save them, then focus the people they’d originally dive.
What is a support supposed to do if a dive tank is taking over the game?
It’s a skill matchup at the end of the day heavily weighted in the dive tanks favor. But dive tanks as a whole’s job is to make support’s lives miserable… and Zen is pretty much the only permanent answer to that give enough of a skill gap.
ok so it actually just is a skill issue. if your understanding of the tank role is just tank duels then ofc you dislike zen
Brig can nullify ball easily too. Your inspire uptime creeps into the 60-70% if the ball tries to play the game, and your health packs can undo pile drivers.
Only issue then is slam mines, really.
You also have to account for the 25% increased ult charge from shooting the tank, which mostly offsets the tank passive charge penalty.
i didnt claim that zen is the only option, i said he is one of the only
okay most of what you said came off as gibberish. But are you seriously complaining that you have to alter your play style due to enemy heroes…seriously? Isn’t that a basic concept?
And cover hopping isn’t going afk…Are you seriously plat? Have you actually played the game? or any shooter if you are confused by cover.