Exactly, and this really only happened during the update droughts. With the current balance team that actually updates the game frequently and has aa different approach than the first team, I feel like they would do much better with 6v6 than they are currently with 5v5.
Roster size is important because of variety,
people have a blast with Magua, and play him the most often,
what would they play, for the 6+ years when Magua didn’t exist? There’s no tank like that,
they’d have to play old Orisa for the compensated version of Magua,
you didn’t have Rammatra,
you didn’t have Junker Queen,
WB and Sigma aren’t that old either.
you used to be able to queue all roles, and occasionally get DPS,
now you can’t, now it’s just guaranteed Tank/Support when you queue fill.
If you were able to get a DPS game, the ratio wasn’t that screwed up,
also who is we? My queue times were quite okay, the priority pass didn’t matter, during the priority pass era, I still occasionally ended up getting DPS role on a queue fill.
Content drought wasn’t the only cause of player dissatisfaction.
yeah, and then you had 6 people locking DPS either losing because nobody would switch, or losing because they didn’t have a competent flex player that could play other roles well
so now it’s an assumption? well done,
also the only two reasons content drought didn’t see big loss of players are as simple as the fact there’s no other game like Overwatch, there isn’t,
and the fact that people were hanging on the hope of PvE bringing something fresh…
3-5 minutes of queue times aren’t terrible,
the fact that you expect queue times faster than 3 minutes is already unrealistic even if the game had double the tank players right now suddenly,
boohoo, what was your rank?
what was your rank?
I’ve seen similar queue times myself, but not always did the game take 10 minutes to find a DPS game aswell
they would do as good if not better, comparingly to the 6v6 Overwatch times where people actually and genuinely had fun, and when the queue times in fact weren’t a complete disaster
At this point, with all these 5v5 vs 6v6 posts you guys are just screaming at a brick wall. Have fun beating a dead horse…
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Roster size: you didn’t address my point. If roster size was a significant factor, how come there were many more support players than tank ones when tanks had a larger roster?
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“We” is a group of people large enough for the devs to consider there to be a problem with tanks bottlenecking queues. If you yourself didn’t see that then great, but the devs did, as you can see in that article.
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That’s true, but I was addressing your point about the content drought being a factor in queue times. We had tank bottlenecking the queues before the drought. Therefore, we can’t blame the drought for the bottleneck.
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That’s the sort of thing I meant by “fair share of annoyances”. But one problem it didn’t have was with queue times, and you implied that there were queue time problems in OQ.
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You can’t have your cake and eat it. You can either dismiss my point as being an assumption or you can find other explanations for my point. You can’t do both at the same time.
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It’s not terrible but it’s not exactly great, either. And I’m being generous and talking about 222 RQ at its height. It got worse as time went on.
As for my rank, I’m metal. Gold to plat. I’m an average player and don’t suffer the same queue time problems as someone at either extreme (either bronze or M+).
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If you are going to type a small novel, at least look up the correct numbers. There were 8 tanks in Overwatch 1 and we only have 40 total heroes now in the year of our Lord 2024. There were only 16 DPS in Overwatch 1.
League of Legends is 5v5 btw. So is Valorant. Maybe using Riot as an example here isn’t the play.
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boring? most of the tank designs were boring? support designs weren’t boring and had wider spectrum?
Magua isn’t boring, but was Magua existing 6-8 years ago?
Roster size isn’t the only element? you are clutching onto 2D situations inside a box inside a box,
a group robbery happens, and you blame/defend only one of the robbers,
I’m not reading that dev article, it doesn’t always tell the universal truth, that’s not good PR strategy
“Factor”
if you talk bottleneck as a base, might aswell freak out when you have the fastest components in your PC, because even then some are bottlenecking others
did I?
I said OQ had problems with queue times when?
and even if I did, wouldn’t you count 6DPS stack technically as queue time?
but first you’d have the find a quote where I stated that OQ had queue time problems, so I can either revise my comment or see where I got confused or what I was trying to say.
"I seriously doubt that the player numbers dropped to a point where ratios didn’t matter
and I even explained to you why the numbers didn’t drop as much as they could have,
222 RQ was a mess at launch and caused noticable bad queue times,
as time went on the 222 RQ queue times adjustend and actually became better,
as more time went on
with the various other issues this game had, that made players less satisfied
the queue times started to increase again
- but not by too much until too much time and too many things have happened
- and during content drought
- and during boring metas devs let slide → just like they do now
- during these periouds my queue times have been better or worse as well
- the problem is people and you right now, overexaggerate the length of the queue times the game had
- people and you claim or sound like you claim that queue times have been a problem always and there was never a point during role queue where queue times weren’t decent
- which again is completely wrong for a sole reason of 5 minutes isn’t that much and I found games below 5 minutes of waiting for DPS
- 5 minutes of queue time isn’t even that terrible, unless you have a serious problem with yourself
- at some points in the game had queue times below 10 minutes or way below 10 minutes during role queue for DPS
- Queueing flex still had chance to give you DPS - you didn’t wait eternity because you’d get assigned Tank or Support instead if you did wait for a long time, since you were queueing flex
- The queue times got worse but you can’t blame 6v6 by itself yet lot of people do
- The game had serious issues outside of the format, slow balance changes, stale tank state that was less often updated than other roles were, small tank roaster, less players playing the game regardless how you feel like there were less players,
strange, I was a Gold in 6v6,
I was Gold in 6v6, and my queue times weren’t a problem ever, (and I played DPS and I wanted to play DPS not just occasionally, and that requirement was satisfied)
I never complained about queue times, I never felt like queue times took forever,
in fact if I were to play 5v5 right now and queue DPS,
I’d be frustrated by the queue times,
interesting right?
Ana, Bastion, D.va, Doomfist, Genji, Hanzo, Junkrat, Lucio, Cass, Mei, Mercy, Moira, Orisa, Pharah, Reaper, Reinhardt, Roadhog, S76, Sombra, Sym, Torbjorn, Tracer, Widowmaker, Zarya, Winston, Zarya, Zenyatta
this is a random full roaster from a random point in time of OW1,
There are 6 tanks,
There are 5 supports,
and there are 15 DPS,
15DPS, 15DPS, there were 15DPS and 6 tanks at one point,
5+6=11, there were 4 more DPS, for both tanks and supports at one point,
and this isn’t ancient OW, there’s Doomfist on the list.
what does that have to do with anything?
does league have 2 pairs of 2 roles and one single role? no
does league have constraints on Champion choice based on role? no
do you have chance to swap roles and champions with other people before the game begins? yes
don’t compare absolutes, it won’t go well for you
And you had even less support heroes to pick from and yet…
And you think that if the game stayed 6v6 - these things wouldn’t have made it live? Or any sort of changes?
I hate to break it to you but in the parallel universe where the game is still 6v6 - devs updated it, and it’s no longer the same as 3 years ago.
This a a thing that happens in live service games you see
We’re talking about this in the context of queue times. The last time there was 6 tanks was before role queue was implemented. There was no queue times issue when there was only 6 tanks. The queue times issue occurred after there were 8 tanks and 15 DPS, post role queue but pre-echo.
So you are factually incorrect here.
You brought it up. I’m showing you it’s a bad comparison. Glad to see you agree with me that you never should have brought it up in the first place.
not you don’t?
nope, there would be no need for them, no need for 99% of them in fact,
yes it is
League of Legends?
game looking whole lot same from what it was 10 years ago
Doomfist?.. Doomfist?.. Doofmist?.. Doomfist?.. Doomfist?..
Doomfist?
Doomfist?
Doomfist?
I’m talking about playerbase, not formats,
if League introduced 6v6, the queue times would barely increase, but few trillions players would be mad at the change to 6v6 most likely,
same with 4v4
Give it a shot. It won’t bite you.
what about the remaining 200+ words I wrote to your reply? no comment?
Why would I when you’re going to dismiss an as-close-to-objective-as-we’re-ever-gonna-get marker of queue time issues out of hand because it doesn’t match up with your anecdotal experience?
If you don’t like being dismissed, then don’t do it to others, I guess. 
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Then tell me how from 2019 to 2022 when ow was dead people where still playing daily and now one year into alive ow queue times in gm are the exact same as 2022 ow. Because for bad players ow2 doesnt seem so bad. But high ranked ow1 players have compared and obviously dont want to play this garbage. 6v6 had nothing to do with queue times. It was bad powercreep balance combined with abandoning the game
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anecdotal experience?
so you dismiss the fact that relatively average Gold player wouldn’t be part of a minority, that their experience is too anecdotal?
you’re the one not liking to be dismissed, you’re literally upset that,
not only I disagree with you, but provide an extended explanation to why you’re wrong.
finally someone with a common sense
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You can’t argue that one player’s experience is anything other than purely anecdotal.
I’m not upset. I’m just explaining why I didn’t respond to the rest of your post. If you’re going to dismiss something as concrete as that article then I’m obviously not going to convince you, because you don’t want to be convinced.
calling that article concrete is like believing in lies
Dead format?
Aaron says it is coming back as a test mode, perhaps as early as Season 13
Looks like 6v6 isnt quite dead yet after all
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I love how Aaron Keller confirmed many things as facts that you’ve denied being true. No more rewriting history for you lmao
6v6 will not last, balance and queue times will kill it. Go ahead and keep holding out hope though lol
Forum members have neither the knowledge nor authority to legitimately make this statement
I recall seeing many forum members similarly claim that Pink Mercy couldnt and/or wouldnt ever come back…and yet…
also, 6v6 does not have a queue times issue
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anyways as I was saying…