💔 Bastion ISN’T being forgotten, he’s being ignored

[ShadowDarter-6407]

From a lore point of view Bastion both works and also is one hell of a wrong design for a mobile area denial weapon. ok I agree with the gatling gun, its a great tool for turning targets into free floating mist and dust. but lore states that the Bastion units where the ground troopers for the first crisis.

Issue one… AMMO how in the hell did the Bastion units get their re-loads. there is nothing in lore that even mildly explains it.

Mobility… a slow army is fine, if you want a dead army. it is shown that there is rapid deployment of omnics to a battle. But Bastion as a weapon of modern day of warfare is to slow to be effective (Ground speed.). in my old job Bastions would be easy targets.

ok my lore rant is over back to the Regular Darter in my next posts.

[TREB-21513]

AMMO how in the hell did the Bastion units get their re-loads. there is nothing in lore that even mildly explains it.

Why single out Bastion for this requirement? Where does Pharah get her rockets from?

This is a reasonable hand-waive considering the game was developed with ammo-resupply in mind but was found to be too hard to balance in practice and it was a wise move to just remove it.

And in the great omnic wars they didn’t show resupply means for EITHER SIDE,

Resupply trucks (or the omnic equivalent) are easily going to be missed because they never stick around for the battle, they arrive briefly in what will be the battle area, quickly deposit supplies, load whatever they need to take back then immediately leave. In any given snapshot you see combat units… and no resupply units.

Mobility… a slow army is fine, if you want a dead army.

That’s not really the problem armies have, ironically the army that moves the fastest moves the slowest.

For example, if you outrun your resupply lines you don’t slow down, you just STOP. The gas tank goes empty. And now you’re strategically paralysed and defenceless.

No, armies are only as fast as their supply lines and we didn’t see how EITHER SIDE of the omnic war fulfilled the strategic supply requirement. You generally only want to move as fast as you can keep enough supplies that allow you to continue to move and fight.

But Bastion as a weapon of modern day of warfare is to slow too be effective (Ground speed.)

5.5m/s is 20km/h

Overwatch shows all the humans running around at 5.5m/s as well but we know humans can do that for the few minutes that a match lasts but can’t keep that up for hours. There’s no reason an omnic would tire. If they can move on their bipedal legs at 5.5m/s for 1 minute then they can do it for 60 minutes, they can do it for 24hours.

Maybe some ultra-marathon runners can maintain 20km/h for 24 hours but they’ll have just moved their skinny butt 500km, Bastion will have moved a powerful machine gun and a substantial amount of ammo. Bastion units could advance 500km a day which IS A NIGHTMARE, as that’s probably not outpacing whatever is resupplying them and would - for example - spread from New York to San Francisco in only 8 days.

Tanks replaced cavalry long before they could actually come close to matching the top speed of cavalry, they replaced cavalry when they exceeded the average speed of cavalry.

That’s the difference between flesh and metal. Even if muscles can perform greater bursts of speed, the machine doesn’t tires. Both need supplies, fodder for horses, petroleum for tanks and IDK for E54 units… maybe they can just scoop up any combustible matter for fuel?

[hehé-1167]

one of these days they will notice this megathread

[DrClan-1789]

It’s possible they already did. We suggested the spread buff for sentry one time but it’s possible that is a coincidence.

[hehé-1167]

It’s possible they already did. We suggested the spread buff for sentry one time but it’s possible that is a coincidence.

I just wish we would get some sort of conformation that our threads were indeed being read. Maybe like they could add a button for Blizzard that gives you a notification marking the thread was read.

Otherwise it feels like posting on these forums is shouting into an empty void.

[ChibiFox-11511]

It’s not as if this is currently the largest player made thread for responses besides the original version of 𝓣𝓱𝓮 𝓞𝓿𝓮𝓻𝓶𝓸𝓳𝓲 𝓒𝓪𝓯É:𝓻𝓮

And even that has dev responses and was directly influenced by them.
(For good reason, as it’s the best thread)

[TREB-21513]

Dev tracker says 5 posts for the totality of May so far. For general discussion.

Not nothing.

But not a lot.

Though looking through the dev tracker there’s a distinct lack of any engagement with specific hero balance unless it’s something like a bug such as how they said Ashe’s recent “nerf” wasn’t intentional. Lots of talk of other aspects like what modes are in rotation, how matchmaking works, and tricky interactions that don’t affect a single hero like symm and reaper’s teleport ability interacting with common destructible like railings.

However, waaay back in March Geoff Goodman went on a spree on a single day of actually talking about the heroes in the game he and his colleagues made. Talking about what they hoped for many heroes, how healthy they think they’re doing, what buffs wouldn’t be viable where they went wrong and so on. It was really refreshing and showed how in touch they were.

Other than that no talk of hero balance.

You’ve just got to be there and be relevant when lightning strikes.

[JaredMnstr-2554]

Everyone on forum should spam the fix the halt bug on orisa because we know what’s causing it and even have documented it.

So why it takes so long why no one actually looked into it. Wish someone could just send it to stylosa or something… hey its free content you just need to let the world know.

Why theres not many posts about this bug. Why am i ranting here.

[TREB-21513]

If it really is a bug maybe it should be in the Bug Report subforum rather than the General Discussion subforum.

Sometimes it’s hard to tell what is a bug, what isn’t, what was a bug but is allowed to stay as it is because they think it’s necessary for balance, and so on.

Is this about how Halt doesn’t move sentry bastion? Because that’s not a bug, just like how Doom’s rocket punch can’t move Bastion.

[JaredMnstr-2554]

Its been on bug forum then general then back to bug section again…

I think i posted about it twice now in bug report and made few posts about it in general.

Welp

[JaredMnstr-2554]

No i mean the halt effect doesn’t represent the actual pull range. It links and breaks on a certain range even tho the target stays in place.

Also ofc its not about the balance because it messes with your gameplay, as orisa player i could count how many times i didnt get the environmental kill because the halt broke even tho it was linked. Im not saying that someone got away from halt range, but when it links for so long and doesnt pull then something is wrong.

Orisa "Halt!" pull range [bug]

“You’re not getting away.” …or maybe you are… So i want to present you a bug or a feature that i found while playing around with Orisa. I dont know if this was already brought to light but this might fix the inconsistency of the "Halt!" The main problem from what I’ve seen is the visual effect of halt is longer than the actual pull. Take a closer look at the video posted below. self explanatory. No wonder why so many “halts” break by themselves… Before i take this to “bug reports” i want…

Here should be the clip (if it still works).

[Haychii-2819]

I was summoned. Hey Chibi! How are you doing? I miss talking to you xD

[ChibiFox-11511]

Hey Chibi! How are you doing? I miss talking to you xD

Why hello there!
I would rather not elaborate and just say i’m doing fine.
How you been?

Hopefully better than poor Bastion.

[Haychii-2819]

I have been fine ^^
I personally don’t like the state of Bastion, I think he needs to be more powerful but not a constant burst dps. More mobility

[TREB-21513]

I tried to replicate your results in the training room, I’d edge pixel by pixel horizontally and could never get the halt-orb to trigger at a distance where the green line appeared but the target bot wasn’t pulled in.

Only if I replicated it vertically would I be able to get a green line to appear in a very narrow range of distances.

I think the source of this bug is the visual effect does a range check to the hitbox model but the force effect does a range check to the cartesian centre of the target’s hitbox and as both doomfists and training bots are substantially taller than they are wider then that’s the source of the discrepancy.

But it’s so minor, it’s going to be on the bottom of the priority list of things to fix, I think if you are going to command the developers attention I’d bring much more pressing concerns, like how fortify may need a buff such as headshot immunity.

[DrClan-1789]

More mobility

Like a new ability or faster transformations?

[TREB-21513]

Bastion is objectively the least mobile hero but it’s important to note what’s causing him to have such low mobility and it’s not really his 5.5m/s movement speed. Loads of other heroes have that movement speed and don’t have any way to get above that speed.

Bastion is slow in escaping things because of even the 0.5sec delay in going from sentry to recon has a huge impact, especially over shorter distances. This may seem small over long distances but it has huge impact on speed over short distances. Like for example the time it takes bastion to start in sentry mode and move 8.25m away into cover, heroes with a regular 5.5m/s move speed have a relative speed advantage over Bastion as good as Sprintin Soldier 76 has over most 5.5m/s movement speed heroes.

The problem here is the 0.5sec transformation time and the solution cannot be making that time any shorter but that problem may be negated another way.

Give Bastion the ability to “hop” a direction in sentry mode and begin the transformation into recon mode as soon as the “hop” is triggered.

By my frame count, a standing jump will last 0.66 of a second and is at the same speed as base movement speed.

This would effectively negate the time you waste waiting to fully turn into recon before you can move. This would even allow Bastion to dodge projectile based CC such as roadhog hooks and ana sleep darts. Yet would make him more vulnerable to CC such as Doom’s rocket punch.

Bastion’s “legs” in sentry mode do seem to allow a limited amount of articulation, just enough to perform a crude “hop”. This means the direction keys/joystick and jump button could have use in Sentry mode. This is not a super jump, this is just a regular jump that when triggered by pressing jump key/button in recon mode triggers a regular jump and instantly transform into recon mode.

Okay, that still leaves Bastion’s sustained movement speed of the baseline of 5.5m/s and no burst or speed or vertical mobility option, the other two heroes who are like this are Zen and Roadhog, but they have good self heal with 75% shield-HP and breather respectively, so they don’t have to take long slow walks to get health-packs.

This “instant escape” ability in sentry mode is what would solve Bastion’s mobility problem.

That and he needs ironclad and self-repair reworked to make escape into recon mode viable and recon to have its power concentrated more in time.

[DrClan-1789]

Bastion is slow in escaping things because of even the 0.5sec delay in going from sentry to recon has a huge impact, especially over shorter distances.

His self heal has a similar cast time meaning it takes 1 second to go from sentry to healing in recon.

[TREB-21513]

Frame analysis indicates this might be a bug.

There is a delay from when self repair is activated and the resource meter begins to drain and the healing really begins… but it’s kinda complicated.

The Wiki concluded that it’s a “0.5 sec delay before healing” but actually it’s only a 0.3 sec delay before the resource meter begins to drain but the first “tick” of healing is TINY (only 1-2HP). It’s not until the next tick of healing that it really begins which is about 0.5sec after you began healing.

So if they changed the base healing rate to 100HP/sec they’d probably tweak the tick rate so that 0.8 Seconds after deciding to flee (0.5 config time and 0.3 latency on healing) you’re getting healed at a good rate like a tick rate of every 0.1 sec +10HP of healing.

A 0.8sec delay on healing isn’t so bad if the healing is good enough, like how roadhog has a delay on his healing kicking in but when it does it’s at a really high rate.

Relating back to my idea of “non-recoverable armour” in sentry mode, if you only take about 100 damage while fleeing into recon mode you won’t have much to heal, it was the +100 armour that took the damage and that armour is going soon anyway. Say for example Hanzo shot a fully charged arrow at you, you’d be down to 278HP, you’d only need to heal 22HP to get back to max health of recon mode.

[Haychii-2819]

New ability