You canāt do that without giving her a more generic weapon that doesnāt need prep time and set up.
Sheās more general now then she was in her first incarnation
Itās not that it isnāt dangerous, itās that it isnāt dangerous enough to deter from peeking around corners that are 5 meters away.
My question, To what end?
Blizzard has a very faulty track record of distributing power negatively. I would say most of this is due to player feedback. Blizzard listens to the wrong people.
In the case of Bastion you would need to redistribute the power structure within the dynamic of Bastion himself. Recon Configuration is a means to an end. You can get things done, but realistically you are in Recon to move from place to place. Take power from Recon and move it to Sentry Configuration.
Bastion has a lackluster Ultimate. It can get work done, but it is highly risky and the reward doesnāt justify the risk. You can adjust power from his self sustain to increase the power of his Ultimate.
I say all these things with no real way to fix the issue. I donāt play Bastion, or damage heroes enough to have a clear understanding of what would need to be done. On the other end, I am not stupid enough to think that Bastion is fine and he needs to be reworked into basically āenter hero _____ liteā. We have too much overlap of heroes as it is. Bastion needs to stay Bastion, but I have little confidence that Blizzard is capable to do that.
In my honest opinion, Sentry is fine for the most part, itās literally everything else that needs to be looked at. Pumping more power into sentry does nothing for him and just would anger people. Itās already strong, everything else is just feels like trash. He needs to move and switch more, because anything that encourages him to just sit there is met with disdain (and is completely the wrong way to play him anyways). He needs to switch more, not have any real changes to Sentry, and turn Recon into something useful without being the same as Soldier Boi.
I do have thoughts on that and I believe we have discussed them a lot together. He does need a rework so he can get buffs, and itās wrong that they have left him this way.
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Iād really love your opinion of the rework i suggested in light of these points.
As long as you can be killed by a peeking Hanzo from within 10 meters because he has cover, Sentry is not fine.
That literally happens to every dps in that situation. Like I said, Sentry is fine. That happens to everyone, not just him. Itās EVERYTHING else that needs looking at in his kit. Tripling down on Sentry is not going to help him, and just get him nerfed again.
Edit: I want Bastionās in my games, and I want him to be good. But Sentry isnāt the way forward, not in my opinion.
Everyone else can move before they are killedā¦
Bastion does not have that luxury, thatās the entire point of Sentryā¦ digging in your heels, and saying āI will not move, iām more dangerous!ā Which is why it should be different.
Sentry is Bastion.
I just do not know what you do with Bastion to make him usable at all in a game. He feels like one of those characters that just becomes either really good or just really bad.
Wellā¦yes but alsoā¦so are other heroes. Making symm even more niche in comparison.
And again, they wanted a more generalist symm and yet she isnāt McCree. Despite a rework to literally every. Single. Aspect. Of her kit.
So ā¦no. her rework failed. Because being less nicheā¦is still niche. And she has less players. And has more counters via other generalist changes.
Yeah, and he has tons power in it. He already stays in it longer, has tons of power budget in it and should. But pumping more power in it wonāt help his problems, it will just get him nerfedā¦ again.
I really disagreeā¦ it doesnāt need much, just enough to make staying close very very dangerousā¦ even for Tanks.
Looks like we are back to where we last discussed lol. Glad we both want him better though, I really do hope the devs do something.
I have done a once over of these proposed changes before, but let me do it again with a different spin.
I will start with how I feel when people talk about Reinhardt changes. To this day I have 749 hours playing Reinhardt. I am pretty much the exhaustive subject matter expert when it comes to what changes would affect Reinhardt and how they would play out. When thinking about balance changes for other heroes, I generally think in terms of what it would be like to play against these heroes, with the balance changes, as Reinhardt.
Wouldnāt really affect me as I have a huge shield. Possible outcome is that it may change the power structure against non tank targets too much in Bastionās favor, maybe.
Reinhardt doesnāt care. The balance between his falloff range (Unknown to me) and how much direct damage he can pump out at range may be an issue, or it may be beneficial for Bastion in a good way.
As a tank this would be very bad for Bastion. If you are tanking well, you are always keeping track of where Bastion is, how much he is shooting and when he is reloading. More reloading would hamper him in large negative ways. Mostly in the way where he will re-spawn more often.
100% in favor of this. It would be a hard sell for other players who hate barriers, but it would allow Bastion a new form of defense that is reliable and exploitable at the same time.
Reinhardt doesnāt care. Charge kills Bastion the same no matter if Ironclad is there or not. Not sure how this would affect other players or how any change would affect the structure of the game.
By far the most important and to me the most relevant change there is. I donāt really care about adding Tank Configuration as a normal mode. It would just be another form of damage I would have to block.
The Ultimate change should be on PTR or in experimental today. There is no reason why this couldnāt happen and I see no downside to changing Bastionās Ultimate in this way.
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Honestly, a lot of the changes you suggested are the same as mine. Only I completely overhaul Recon to be more of a defensive skill for him.
My rework was: Only heal in Recon, can shoot while healing, Shield regen in Recon, projectile in Recon but with better recoil AND damage (makes it defensive in nature, makes him less like Soldier, and becomes my aim/healing vs enemy aim/cds), shield in Sentry, Sentry regains healing bar, better bloom in sentry (this is the only buff to damage I can see him realistically getting in Sentry), remove passive and make shield/heal his new passive (only Tank mode keeps DR), and faster switching. I donāt want to get into numbers, because they get adjusted all the time. Damage is not his problem, itās surviving to output anything and not switching more.
No heās not. Sentry is a part of bastion. Bastion is the change modes hero not the sentry gun hero, just like torb and sym arenāt the turret heroās theyāre the set up heroās.
Bastion has a very specific role in mind for the devs, break barriers and counter tanks. His problem is he requires the team to play around him due to his immobility that lacks any sort of power curve outside of initial set up.
Bastion is not sentry.
By who? How many characters can realistically corner peak a Bastion at close range? Outside of Hanzo, whoās threatening Bastion in the half second or so it takes him to melt them?
As long as they corner/ledge peek correctly?
Literally any hitscan.
Watch those and tell me how i could have āPlayed betterā
My tracking on that Soldier: 76 physically could not have been better, when directly assaulted. Yes i know i was already slightly hurt, but come onā¦ thatās like less than 10 meters away, maybe 5ā¦
Letās not get caught up in āForum Bastionā Here eitherā¦ if youāre junkrat trapped in the open? Yea he can deal quite a bit of damageā¦ but in the mere seconds that good players allow you to see them, heās not doing much of anythingā¦ even under sustained fire.
I want buffs for bastion too
But I think people are afraid of buffing bastion in ways that may potentially make sentry form a complete nightmare to deal with.
Giving sentry a shield was scrapped during development for a reason. Giving him a shield behind another 1-2 shields from his tanks while being pocketed is / would be my literally vision of hellish.
And I imagine it would be for quite a few other players as well.
Not to mention buffing his sentry damage quite a bit on top of that?
Damage has never been bastions problem.
Honestly- and I hate to say it, I think bastion needs a rework. Iām not a fan of reworks- but I simply canāt see him being made viable with his play style for the overall health of the game and the community.
That shield had 1000 hp.
You mean having to do something other than hold W and M1?
The humanity.
Iād love your opinion of the suggested rework in the OP.
No way. Thatās utterly ridiculous.
In your first clip you, as an isolated Bastion, kill a baby Dva, a Blading Genji, and then a Widow who landed 2 scoped shots on you before you get a bead on her. You donāt die, and heal up after killing 3 characters and them wasting an Ult.
It in no way shows Bastion being weak.
In your second clip, Soldier got the drop on you and had already pumped 100+ damage into you before you got turned around and into Sentry, and he did it without using Helix. He should win the matchup at that pointā¦plus itās deathmatch so itās irrelevant.
Neither clip shows Bastion being unviable or weak, one is actually the exact opposite and the other you were simply outplayed.
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