Personally I loved that Soldier:76 was gay… it felt so great getting representation that wasn’t just a stereotype, even if they did it just for publicity… it still feels nice to have representation, especially in a character who not many expected to be gay, I really hope they do more LGBTQ+ rep in the game, it’s wonderful that such a big game is giving our community representation, thanks, overwatch! 
Does this not seem incredibly silly, that he/she is basing whether or not Baptiste should be homosexual on his appearance? Obviously Blizzard didn’t want to have a gay character fit a bunch of stereotypes to avoid as much negative backlash. Having Soldier revealed as homosexual makes sense, he’s not feminine or over dramatic as those stupid stereotypes would suggest. Soldier being gay shows that not all homosexuals act or look a certain way. Suggesting that another character should have been gay because their “design is gay” is absolutely absurd, and disrespectful for obvious reasons. Soldier being gay instead of Baptiste isn’t worthy of complain in my opinion, unless it is just some scapegoat for Blizzard to hide behind. It’s hardly something to claim the LGBT community deserves better than.
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You literally said Baptiste looks and sounds gay, so he should have been gay. that’s more than just “Because he’s the new hero.” It’s not a matter of sensitivity, it’s the fact that you think a gay character shouldn’t look masculine like Soldier. Just ridiculous.
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What do you mean by, “perfect sexuality”? Do you just mean for the sake of diversity, or because you feel like it doesn’t fit Jack to only be attracted to men? While I would understand that thought process, it only further reinforces a stereotype. Not trying to attack, I would love to know what you mean by that.
i think that it would be better… simply because Baptiste is a new character that people didnt have any chance to categorize or relate to yet
so it would be much easier to calmly accept what he is… making a ‘tuff guy’ have such turn is not adding depth, but contradictions and is confusing for character archetype
… now i am wondering what Baptiste role will be, who he will work with adn why, because it seems (as Jeff said it) his time of cooperation with Talon is over
because it was against his world view - will he join Overwatch crew? or will he join ‘wild card crew’ of Sombra? :>
her logo on teaser must mean something
Alright, you got it!
To me, Jack breaks more stereotypes that exist against bisexual men than any other character in Overwatch would.
He isn’t a flirt, he isn’t evil, he isn’t some kind of sex weirdo. He’s just a normal guy. (relatively, that is)
There have been many normal masculine gay men in culture. Raymond Holt, Shiro from Voltron, Steve Cortez in Mass Effect, Sir Hammerlock and Kevin Keller from Archie Comics.
Bisexual men have a big ol’ bowl of nothing in terms of that. Best we get is Darryl from Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, but he’s hardly a character to look up to, he’s a goofy dad.
It’s like we are always viewed as only hypersexual people, or people see that as the only way to represent us.
Not to mention, Jack falls into a bunch of tropes that exist against gay men. Namely the “tragic” gay trope, no happy sweet ending for gay men. In other words, it sounds good until you think about it.
Like, lets look at Baptiste. He’s a complex character who went from being a young man put in a terrible situation and making bad choices, who recognized his mistakes and decided to become a redeemed hero who seeks to make the world a better place. Imagine if he were gay, like what if in a comic they show that he fell in love with a man and that was the reason he was fighting to make the world safer. That would be amazing!
But no, instead we got that Jack had a past relationship. Lame. (Another trope, off screen gay)
But for displaying bisexuality, past relationships would be a amazing way to reveal that. Like what if Jack were carrying a photo of Vincent and then another photo of him with a woman at a formal event or something. You don’t change his arc and you get definitive proof of a male character being bisexual, and quite a popular character at that. Which leads into my last point;
The number of lesbians who are out of the closet is 86%. Gay men are at 83%.
Bisexual men are at 40%.
40%, that’s tragic. We need more representation that defies stereotypes and encourages people to be open, and Jack would’ve been nearly perfect for that.
But now, there is no character that does that. That why Jack Morrison’s perfect sexuality would be bi.
Of the original cast, I like Rein as gay. Same effect as Jack, but you could actually give him a husband. Baptiste is near perfect as well.
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nice you are stereotyping gay people. yeah, that’s totally what the LGBT community deserves. anyway, soldier being gay is totally fine. the majoritiy of people complaining are straight people and not lgbt people.
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your post is a perfect example of why making soldier gay was a better idea than making baptiste gay.
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His logic is faulty, but I actually do agree with his idea, or at least partially.
Soldier is a very safe choice for gay representation. Like, a old guy who is past being in romantic relationships, that doesn’t help the issue that mlm relationships are still rarely shown in culture.
They effectively just said that he and Vincent were in a relationship, instead of actually showing it like what they did with Emily and Lena. Even the photo looks more like two friends than partners. Maybe if he just had a photo of Vincent alone, that would actually point to him being his partner.
Even in Overwatch, he’s not the best old man for representation. Reinhardt is much better in almost every way, including the fact that they could have written him a husband/partner.
Yes, Jack is a very strong and masculine man, but there have been several popular gay characters that have been masculine. Captain Ray Holt and Steve Cortez for example.
And it’s a pretty huge stretch to say that Baptiste isn’t masculine either. Like, he cares about his appearance and flaunts it, that’s hardly stereotypical. It’s not like he speaks with a lisp and is critiquing the other hero’s outfits. He is simply a masculine man who knows that he looks good.
Also, Baptiste is a soldier the same as Jack. They are both fairly similar, honestly.
And finally, Baptiste is still fairly young, which means that they could actually have him have a romantic partner in future content. Jack is left with a relationship in the past.
In total what makes better gay representation;
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A masculine old man who is completely past being in romantic relationships and who’s last partner was over a decade ago
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A man who is attractive, masculine and flaunts it, with the possibility of having a current romance revealed in the future
The answer is fairly obvious to me.
And I’ve said this before, literally in this thread, but Jack should have been bi.
I think we can agree that there are several great options for a gay man in Overwatch. Jack is one of them. I see no reason to argue and measure crumbs to decide who’s a “better fit”. These threads are pointless. Is Jack a harmful stereotype? No, so the choice was good.
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You have a point, but the fact is that ‘measuring crumbs’ helps inform people what these characters mean for representation.
someone saying “i’m gay” doesn’t make them a stereotype. gay people openly existing doesn’t make them a stereotype. gay people are allowed to like being gay. they don;t have to act like its the least important thing about them, as if that’s suddenly good representation?
i mean did you ever think that maybe ghoststryker might also be lgbt instead of assuming their straight for some reason. like what about “i want this character to be gay” makes you think “they have to be straight”
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you do know that some gay people are feminine, and flamboyant right? and saying that gay people have to be masculine to be “good representation” is kinda backwards right? its basically saying that if a character shows “sterotypically gay traits” like being flamboyant then they’re bad representation. but the reason those traits are seen as bad is because feminity and flambyance in men is seen as “not the right way to be a man” and so was being gay for a long time, which is why those things were connected in pop culture. but some gay men are flamboyant, and feminine and all those things. of course not all gay men are like that, but not all gay men are masculine, tough guys either, so acting like thats automatically better then being “stereotypical gay” is erasing real life gay men who do fit those stereotypes and having to “act more manly” in order to fit in.
the problem with sterotypes isn’t that they “are wrong” its that they’re "not meant to represent everyone. if you keep making all your gay men flamboyantly gay then it shows you think all gay men act one way which is bad because it only tells one story. but if you have all your gay men act manly, and have them almost never talk about being gay ever, thats still bad because its only telling one story again.
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its always bugs me how people act like a gay character being confident or proud or even mentioning themselves being gay orwhatever is “bad representation” because it always gives off this air of “being gay is only okay if its the least important thing about them and they don’t ever talk about being gay” like gay people do talk about being gay, and its still important for them. like obviously its not their only personality trait but its still important.
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I agree, 100%.
There should absolutely be more openly gay characters, as well as more on screen depictions of mlm romances/relationships.
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a character being openly gay doesn’t mean the character is “dedicated to it”. baptiste would have all the things that make him interesting while also being gay.
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yeah like jack isn’t terrible but i never really liked him personally also. also the fact that so many people are acting like “old man who once dated a man and will probably never be an a relationship ever again so him being gay will probably never be brought up again” is pinnacle gay rep leaves a bad taste in my mouth. like tracer is at least still in a relationship so emily could still be brought up again (as a hero or maybe a plot line where she’s kidnapped and tracer as to rescure her or something) plus we actually got to see her girlfriend in person. while we know almost nothing about vincent besides him being married after breaking up with jack.
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what “dumb stereotypes” all they said was that they thought he;d be more interesting gay rep. also some real life gay men are flamboyant and feminine you know that right. is any gay man who doesn’t act manly suddenly an embarrassment to the lgbt community to you?
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Exactly.
The only convincing argument I’ve heard of Jack being good gay rep is that since he is old, he is good representation for older gay men, who are largely unrepresented in culture.
At which point I rebutted with Reinhardt again. Not to mention the fact that old bi men are literally non-existent both in pop culture and in real life, due to most simply choosing to stay in the closet.
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