Asmongold has a point I think is relevant even to Overwatch

So Asmongold (World of Warcraft streamer and youtuber) posted a video “The State of Battle for Azeroth” that I can’t link here. Basically he breaks down a lot of the issues currently impacting the World of Warcraft expansion BFA.

However I think that there also is a lot of truth in his statements that can be applied to Overwatch

I think this is extremely true, especially for people like myself in the Mercy community. Megathread after megathread after megathread of feedback and we’re still at the same point (if not worse after even more nerfs) where it feels like we are literally just yelling into the abyss.

There are multiple youtubers (Aria isn’t the only one in spite of what this forum often memes), twitter users, redditors, off-official forums posters and the like chanting the same thing.

Yet where does that feedback go? It feels like into the abyss.

And lately you can tell through the entire community (twitter, youtube, here, reddit, etc) that there is certainly a mounting feeling of “us” vs. “them”.

And no I don’t even mean DPS vs. healers. I mean the community vs. developers.

Lots of people want Bridgette nerfed. Lots of people want Mercy changed. Lots of people want Hanzo and Doomfist nerfed. So many cases can be listed I don’t even want to get into it here. Outside of balance this includes game features like matchmaking, better LFG where LFG seems like it’s dying out, more relevant events and the like.

100% exactly how I feel. Yet the open dialogue here is one sided. Relate it to the quote above and it feels like it’s a one way conversation with a person who isn’t even sitting in the chair opposite.

Overwatch also feels like it’s taken this angle. It feels like OWL and “epic OWL potg” heroes have been cocooned at present.

What makes fancy plays? Doomfist getting a 1 shot and leaping into the fray. Genji doing a huge dragonblade, Zarya + Hanzo ult combo wiping a team.

Certain playstyles seem heavily enforced and encouraged and others flat out dismissed or altered.

(Symmetra, Torbjorn and Mercy who can all be argued to be “not interesting to watch” have received reworks that fundamentally altered their kits.)


And lemme add this: I feel this even more with these topics.

1: Rampant smurfing where an account bought for $12 on a humble bundle deal is more valuable than retaining their current playerbase.

Where smurfs tank their MMR to silver/gold/platinum and run rampant. I’ve personally in competitive hit a smurf probably in 50% or so of my competitive games. Either they are on my team making me feel like a Christmas ornament or the enemy team making me regret even launching the game.

2: Events are little more than lootbox “limited time BUY BUY BUY!” events.

Junkenstein has been rehashed for like the 3rd time now. It was cool back then, but now it’s way way way way too old.

3: A new hero every 4 months is abysmally slow. And the quality of them in terms of game balance is really questionable.

Orisa: Never has been amazing.

Sombra: Was widely considered a throw pick for a year.

Hammond: ATM widely considered a troll pick compared to D’va and Rein.

Doomfist: He was considered a troll pick until he was considered outright flagrantly broken at present.

Ana: She was OP and caused the season 3 tank meta, then was made into a throw pick.


Honestly a lot of how the game has gone feels opposing to what players want.

-Each new map is met with more and more disdain. I think Horizon Lunar Colony is one of the least liked maps in the entire game.

-New heroes are released that overall damage the current pool of heroes while ignoring the blatantly in need current heroes (Bastion, Symmetra, Mei, etc).

-The events boil down to being “get your limited time skins now or never!”

And I’m just so fatigued to even try and list more, as anyone who plays this game and visits this forum knows: there is more.

I think that one need not look further than the Mercy rework to see that there is clearly no lack of evidence that this rework should be reverted or yet another rework done.

And yet there are so many claims of it being a “success” followed by 10 or so nerfs even after that claim of it being “balanced”. So balanced it warranted 10 or so nerfs?

I think this point is absolutely a huge one for the Mercy community and the rest of us.

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Hey guys, Jeff here. We feel support changes were good.

Mercy players: Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Jeff: :Silence:

Mercy Player: wHy U iGnOrE uS?

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Adversarial relationships between players and developers is the normal state of every game, including down to when the first caveman invented tic tac toe and the first monkeys were playing rock paper scissors.

bigshrug

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The main problem with Mercy is not about Blizzard saying that she is fine, the problem is that they dont have courage to say that because they know that she is in a bad spot, but they dont have an answer to it as well, like they did with Symm, they said that she was fine being a niche hero, then they reworked her after she not being picked once in OWL. They know that heroes like Brig, Doom and Hanzo are overpowered, but they will let this be because they want us to forget how Genji and Tracer dont have effective counters.

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Exactly. Yelling and screaming at them constantly whenever you don’t like a change isn’t exactly going to make them feel like they should even bother saying anything here…

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So we, as the blizzard community need to come together eh?

Riiise up. Riiiise up Blizzard’s overwatch community. Rise up forums!

In all seriousness though, we over at WoW noticed this decline early into the late Catastrophe expansion. Panda was okay, but WoD? Whew…

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I blame the original set of Dva megathreads for making the devs stop giving regular feedback.

Mercy and Brig were broken for a very long time in OWL and other pro play.

Not interesting to watch is a side effect of being unable to stay with the team during the teamfight. Pre rework T500 builder mains pretty much went on solo missions to see what they could get away with, while Bastion sucks for the same reason. Also people went crazy every single time Torb was used; Mangachu’s WC 2017 grand finals Torb hammer kill is legendary.

It’s really not that bad unless you play main tank or one of the F tiers. We haven’t had this many things be viable in a long time. A side effect of a team game based around counters and switching is that a sign of good balance is that everyone is equally frustrated.

Blizzneyland and Rialto are quite good and junkertown isn’t that bad. It’s really that no one likes 2CP.

The other points I more or less agree with, but perhaps the biggest issue not mentioned is that before I even enter a game, I have very little faith or trust in my teammates, or the team’s ability to play to their fullest potential, and I know my teammates likely have the same idea. This game got as far as it did because the high points of the game made the problems worth sitting through, but we’re getting lower and less frequent highs.

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a developer that ignores feedback in all their games generates toxicity

color me surprised

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While I don’t agree with devs’ decisions on topics from time to time, I will take their decisions and knowledge of the game over forums’ any day regarding balance.

Throwing suggestions is one thing and easy when you don’t know what kind of impact they can do in the game as a whole. Most of them here come out of straight bias in attempt to buff heroes they one trick or nerf heroes they hate, caring less and knowing less about how the game works.

I will go with the decisions of a neutral party than of xXxheromainxXx’s.

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finally someone with some sense! thank you thank you thank you!

the devs need to wake up from their slumber and go back to their origins of being recognized as the devs loved by the community (not talking about overwatch origins ofcourse)

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I honestly believe that they need to have a AMA livestream to answer all of these questions and give us there thoughts on their decisions as well as why our suggestions are being ignored. Instead of that troll Christmas stream, lets do an AMA with all the devs…by the campfire.

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Speak for yourself and the “mercy community”. I really like some of the changes blizzard has made, especially the balance changes. Although Doomfist was f tier for a year after release, blizz knew how oppressive he could get, and made the right decision in waiting for buffing him. Now that they DID give into the whines of the community, the same community wants his nerfed. Brig has been nerfed after every patch since release, and although she needs to be nerfed more, at least it shows blizzard knows they went wrong. Hanzo is finally in a good position after being f tier since release. Also, I enjoy watching OWL, and would gladly have “lackluster” events for it.

This post is based upon feelings and nothing else, move along folks.

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i Needed this. Bad… :D.

oh god…

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lol sure m8

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This is an interesting way of putting it, to say the least. But no matter what Blizzard does in regards of Mercy’s balance, people will hate it. Simple as that.

Blizzard could come up and say “We dont think she needs a revert” and people would still say they’re not being listened at because for some reason being catered to = being heard.

If Blizzard reverts her, the people who had issues with Mass Rez will hate them.
If Blizzard doesn’t reverts her the people who like Mass Rez will hate them. There’s no good way out of this.

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I’m not onboard with the “us vs them” thing. Way I see it is OW is their game, they can do with it as they please. Where I fit within that is I can either like what they do, tolerate it or refuse to spend any more of my time on it.

If they reworked a hero I really loved to play e.g. Moira for whatever reason and I completely disagreed with it, my options are to either drop Moira or if I feel strongly enough about it, stop playing OW completely. I could make megathread after megathread but if that’s what they want to do and made the call to do so what good is my constant “feedback”? :man_shrugging:

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So you mean what the devs of Warframe do each week. They stream every week answering questions, and show upcoming changes like Fortuna.

That and they have separate streams for Prime Time and the console versions.

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Said it once and i’ll say it again:
More developers need to take a leaf out of Digital Extreme’s book.

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I gues the forum shoud just be shut down.
Its just a place for crying f tier mains coming up with bias idees and no real points what so ever.