Ashe nerf when?

So that means it’s okay for one hero to literally be broken, by not half of the rest?

ONLY because people play them?

That’s beyond stupid

Genji is broken and coddled, you literally cannot deny this fact

She’s viable therefore she must be OP.

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I’d love for you to provide me a quote of where I said that in my reply, even though I know I didn’t lmao.

Would still love to see the quote where I said that.

This is Genji’s first substantial buff in 3 years. Reinhardt, Hanzo, McCree, Junkrat, Reaper, etc, they’ve all been getting regular buffs, nerfs, reverts, etc. The power-creep happened and Genji was abandoned for 3 years. How is he coddled, again? Nobody bats an eye at the 2,570 damage High Noon but everyone complains about Dragonblade?

And I’m not even denying anything lmfao. Why are you getting so aggressive?

Im fine with Ashe nerf, if they nerf Genji first. If they had to nerf something, I would say its her ult charge. Or revert the ammo buff. Hopefully not her reload time, because thats the weakpoint of her kit already.

If they nerf Ashe, but let Genji run free as he is, then I’ll be a little bit salty tbh.

Ahh yes, having to have every single beam character in the game on your team, to counter 1 person is the epitome of balance hahahaha.
The genji changes pretty much completely invalidated reaper as a character. His right click does the same job, better, and more reliably. Winston isn’t good against a decent genji.

This is the buff, imo, that caused her to become unfair. This used to be an exploitable weakness. Now it’s a ready answer to being dived that isn’t on a CD like coach or dynamite.

Syntex’s Theory of Ashe’s Kit:

  1. close range burst damage
  2. long range poke
  3. shield break
  4. damage over time
  5. AoE damage.
  6. auto lock on damage
  7. mobility
  8. cc
  9. “2-shot kill”
  10. 15 shots in a clip.
  11. special ability: ult charge while ult is active

Ashe’s Actual Kit:

  1. scoped primary fire.
  2. unscoped primary fire.
  3. tnt
  4. coach gun
  5. an long-term placeable ultimate (which acts the same as other long-term placeable ultimates and is not unique).

… And yes, she has an ammo limit, like every hero except D.Va.

Yes, she has effective damage at most ranges (short to moderately long, but not very long), and an escape ability, and a high-health point-contesting turret for an ult. That’s not “overkitted”.

Her slow-rate of fire balances against her scoped fire + spread balances against her unscoped fire.

D.O.T. on dynamite is a chance to cleanse the damage with certain abilities or health packs, or simply be saved by a healer. The same amount of damage that wasn’t over time would be drastically more effective.

The ult charge mechanic is not unique to Ashe, and is not an ‘advantage’ of any kind.

If Ashe is properly balanced and you decide change the mechanic to not charge while Bob is out, then you would reduce the ult cost to compensate. If Ashe is not properly balanced and you want to bring her into balance, then you would change the ult cost and not touch the charging mechanic.

Ultimate frequency is an easily measured statistic with an easily adjust parameter to control it. If Hamster/Torb/Ashe/Hanzo (maybe others) couldn’t charge ult during ult, it would provide a peculiar counter-incentive to take action at the time when you most should take action. The ult mechanic would suggest you should save your risk-taking and cooldowns for after the ult, while good gameplay dictates that you should act during the ult. This also rewards good players more – if they can make good use of an ult, they get their next ult sooner; if they ult in a bad position and immediately get killed, then they will have much longer until their next ult.

If for some reason you want less differentiation between good ults and bad ults, then go ahead and change the ult mechanic for any and all of the characters that work this way. If you want to change ult frequency, however… just change the cost.

Similarly, yes, Ashe has several ways to do damage. She’s a damage hero with very little utility, so she should do a lot of damage. If she does too much damage or too little damage, then she might be overtuned or undertuned, but that doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not she is overkitted. If she were overkitted that would mean she has too much flexibility and utility in her design… which she really doesn’t. She doesn’t do much except damage.

If she’s doing too much damage, then she has damage values and rates of fire that can be adjusted. There’s no need to breathlessly list off every way that she can use her abilities as if ways to use the hero were all separate abilities.

Which, I think is your real problem with Ashe. I think you think she does too much damage, but for some reason you don’t want to say that but instead want to attack her all-'rounders damage-dealing kit for being… well rounded at dealing damage across multiple ranges.

I always saw this as removing clunkyness. Made her feel better to play without feeling like a huge buff. At least from the Ashe side of things. But i guess it makes her little less vulnerable, because she gets a faster clean up shot?

Yup. It makes her less vulnerable from the perspective of the one attacking her while she’s scoped in

She’s not even close to overtuned and CC does she have cause coach gun barely even counts since it just pushes you back a bit, it’s a weaker whip shot and Lucio boop in terms of CC so that ain’t it and plenty of of heroes can gain ult charge when their ult is active as long as their ult isn’t something in itself that can gain ult charge this post just seems like a weak attempt to nerf a hero you somehow are struggling to deal with when in reality she’s one of the most balanced characters in the game

exactly some people just like to complain about any given character just cause their unable to counter them

I want her nerfed too, but not for these reasons above. Also, before this nerf happens, I want that damn Genji nerf.

She is completely overkitted! You have to be insane to see what I’ve listed, a hero that can do damage in almost twice as many scenarios as any other DPS, and think that’s totally fine. Take any other hero to compare, and they can only do 1 or 2 of the things that Ashe does. There should never be a jack of all trades DPS hero that has 5 or 6 different ways to do damage!

You’ve said so many things that are objectively wrong. Her ult is unique, because only ONE (1) other hero in the game can charge ult while their ult is active! That fact in and of itself gives her an advantage over any hero that cannot do that. It’s completely unbalanced and biased.

Wait Genji needs more nerfs?

She already got nerfed. Now she has down time when reloading and also downtime waiting for dynamite cooldown which is longer now. Stop crying, she is fine.

:rofl:
Totally not fine.

She has the most downtime of any hero now. Stop complaining.

I kinda want a full revert.

The destiny devs made her perfectly balanced.

Blizz buffs messed her up.

At least 4 other heroes act this way.

Ashe Ultimate Charge

Removing Ashe’s ability to gain charge during ultimate would be both irrelevant and inconsistent.

It’s irrelevant because ult charge is balanced around how often the devs want a given hero to have ult. If they want the same balance, but took away the ability to earn ult charge while an ult is still active, they’d just reduce the cost of the ult to compensate.
If, on the other hand, an ult is coming up too often, or not often enough, it is not necessary to change the charging mechanic, simply changing the cost of the ult will directly change the balance.

It would be inconsistent because generally speaking, ults that directly enhance the ulting player or that directly damage the enemy freeze the earning of ult charge, but ults that create a separate object and leave in place allow the player to continue earning ult charge through non-ult damage.
(Tracer, Hanzo, Torbjorn, and Hammond all act this way; Symmetra does not, which I think is inconsistent and should be fixed).

This acts as a skill differentiator for both the ulting player and their opponents – a player can take advantage of the situation caused by a good ult to earn a significant portion of their next ult during the current one, but on the other hand, if the enemy successfully shuts the ulting player down then they lose that opportunity and that enemy earns some breathing room. If the mechanic were changed and properly compensated, average time between ults would be unchanged, but player ability would have less effect on charge time.

I honestly don’t think they’d need to do that. You don’t need Bob every fight because chances are you don’t want to use him till certain heroes are dead or you know they’re on cooldown.

Ana, who can sleep him, Sigma, who can get shields from him, and Sombra, who can just hack him. And those are just the easy examples, Bob is best used as clean up, a distraction, or to stall. Otherwise it’s best to not use him. So there’d be no need to decrease his Ult cost, it just makes more sense that if Bob is out you shouldn’t be able to get charge. Most abilities need to function like this anyhow.