bap do more damage vs zen even with discord on personal level
bap gun dps is 189 (with new recovery of 0.38) not counting headshot, while zen with discord is 156
bap gun is easier to use, and more consistent because its hitscan
bap heals more, in aoe
bap has very good mobility
bap has self heal
bap has IF
bap harder to kill, and have smaller hitbox compared to zen
And “just” discord is a huge understatement. Discord is probably the strongest support ability/utility right now. And you failed to mention his insane damage output that’s higher than many DPS heroes.
Also Zen being “easy to kill” doesn’t really exist anymore now that Brig, Bap, and Mercy can all hard pocket him depending on what you are playing vs
As Jake said:
Waiting for next Exp card
People on here whine about Mercy Damage Amp but discord is 100x stronger. Teamwide, 40m range. It’s insane with how much tanks and shields have been nerfed and how much Zen’s damage has been buffed
the people i see complaing about zen also complain about bap
bap does all the things you want a support to do
better then most supports also he has lucio ult but
better on cd
(they could buff the other supports that arent viable (only moira i think)
which is probably what they are gonna do
I think blizzard wants tanks to be as weak as they are now
and i remember flats saying he is happy with the tank balance
now)
Yep. 30% damage increase is pretty much a death sentence for anyone, not just tanks. Especially if said person is also antihealed.
And it wouldn’t be an issue for tanks.
If we had barriers that were more consistent.
But since we don’t have barriers because players can’t shoot the big blue screen, we still need tankier tanks.
I’m a big fan of giving way more power to armor and shield hp.
Armor should do a 33% damage reduction, with a minimum reduction per projectile/bullet of 3, but no maximum reduction. Armor reducing damage from widow headshots from 300 to 295 is currently just pointless. But if it was reduced from 300 to 200 it would be far more impactful. And doing this would perhaps make it unneccessary to nerf damage, while it also makes tanks more… tanky.
And shield hp needs to regen constantly instead of requiring to be out of combat.
armor now does -5 or 50%(50% on ten damage or less) which ever results in the most damage
to the individuel with armor
i fail to parse what you are saying considering this as the base
In zen’s case it’s definitely quality over quantity. Bap is quantity AND quality. Doesn’t mean Zen’s one ability isn’t ruining a lot of fun in the game.
I think the damage boosting abilities are somewhat inappropriate for a game has already low (raw)TTK. Mercy, Zen and Nano, except for Bap’s ult considering it’s like a turret or a Sentry mode/Bastion, and how easily people can avoid it.
No, he hasn’t He’s gotten 3 buffs the past several months and kept his damage buff from 2019 even tho he got 30% discord back
Shields got systemically nerfed
Tanks got nerfed across the board
Damage is high af
Also, that’s a poor argument conisdering Zen has been REALLY GOOD for most of the game’s lifespan. Zen is literally the most meta hero in the game’s lifespan. Year 1 of OW he was meta with Lucio in dive. Then meta with Moth Mercy for a year. Then he was meta in Double Sniper. Then Grav Dragon. Then GOATs for another year. Then he wasn’t good for the beginning of double shield (when Doom/Reaper/Mei/Moira/Lucio were all overtuned). But he’s been good ever since it shifted towards Bap/Brig/Zen Double Shield. Then meta in Hog meta. Met with Brig dive. And now meta in the current meta.
They are.
Was this supposed to be a counter argument? Both are overtuned, and the pros have been saying this all month. They said they are talking to Blizz, hopefully Zen/Echo/Tracer/Hanzo/Ashe/Bap get nerfed next Exp card
And for the love of god buff Orisa shield, revert Rein’s buffs and give him meaningful shield ones, and fix Sigma and Brig so Dive can exist
Examples of how it works right now:
A shot deals 100 damage. Damage reduction of 50% would bring it down to 50, but there is an upper limit of 5, meaning actual damage is 95.
A shot deals 6 damage. Damage is reduced by 50%, which is 3. This is less damage reduction than 5, so the actual damage is 3.
This means armor is currently quite good against shotgun / rapidfire weapons. But it’s not effective whatsoever against high damage per shot, like Widow or Pharah or Junkrat.
My proposal is to just reduce damage by 33%, with no upper limit on the amount of damage it blocks.
In my examples:
100 damage would be reduced down to 67 damage, instead of 95.
6 damage would be reduced down to 4 damage, instead of 3.
Meaning armor would be far more effective against high damage shots, but somewhat less so against shotgun/rapidfire weapons.
I’m against nerfing Zen’s damage orb; i don’t see how a 5% reduction would make a change for tanks, it would only remove some breaks points against squishies…
The problem with Zen imho is his damage, right now he does more dps than Mcree while healing and supporting his team.
He needs his destruction orbs damage nerfed from 48 to 40
He’s gotten 3 buffs the past several months and kept his damage buff from 2019 even tho he got 30% discord back