3-shot Junkrat feels terrible

The buffs today are honestly nice for mobility, but they don’t address the real problem—a slow 120 dmg projectile is a terribly inefficient way to kill a 250 HP target.

I think Junkrat’s primary fire needs to be reworked around that 250 HP breakpoint.

Option A
Buff direct hit damage by 5 for a total of 125 (45 direct+80 splash).

Option B
Decrease total damage to 90 (30 direct+60 splash), but increase clip size and fire rate.

I think Option A is the easiest fix, but if Blizzard insists 2-shot Junkrat doesn’t fit in their current vision of the game, then something similar to Option B is inevitable.

18 Likes

Junkrat does not need to be more lethal. The people playing against Junkrat need to be nerfed.

He’s the same as Reaper where he puts out a lot of damage with a hefty cost (short-range, massive drop off). Unfortunately, most of the other characters with both range and mobility can kill just as quickly, if not faster than Junkrat, even though they already posses the previously mentioned other great attributes.

15 Likes

125 dmg against a 250 HP hero is quite literally less lethal than 120 dmg against a 200 HP hero, even 1 armor or healing prevents the 2-shot.

I’m fine with losing the mine+grenade combo, but I’ve never heard anyone complain about dying from two direct grenade hits. Needing 3 is ridiculous.

23 Likes

They need to figure out what they want for Junkrat in this format. He’s always been this weird mix of slow and spammy at lower tiers and vulnerable yet bursty at high tiers. We need to remember his skill floor is extremely accessible but ceiling is top 3 after Echo and Genji, imo (because of the nature of predicting, aiming, and bouncing of one of the slowest arced primary fire projectiles).

I’ve said slap some armour on him and call it a day (they should also reduce how much noise his footsteps+pegleg makes), but those are temporary solutions.

With this reshuffling of +HP, they have to figure out what Junkrat is meant to do because players having solutions isn’t going to lead anywhere until the devs choose a direction with him. I just kind of hope they don’t Hog/Sombra him.

3 Likes

The only dps hero Junk can beat in a duel is Sym. He’s outrageously awful right now and his horrendous ttk along with the inconsistency is a major part of it. He absolutely needs to be more lethal because right now he isn’t a threat to anyone.

It isn’t this at all. Junk loses at close range to most of the roster now because it just takes him far too long to actually fire and hit 3 shots.

9 Likes

Poor Sym :sob:

12 Likes

Ya I’m losing most 1v1 duels I would have won in season 8.

How do I know I would have won? Because the person who killed me has 10 hp.

4 Likes

I’m learning the 3-shot dive thing. I’ll find a way to rebind my melee to make it happen.

Pre-melee goomba stomping + combo. They don’t wanna do anything for rat, I’ll make my rat playstyle work again.

2 Likes

Most heroes who have 250 HP don’t have armor (Only Brig does). He also has a TTK of 1.2 seconds (in this scenario) without considering the mines, which is pretty insane when you think about it.

The fact that other characters have a TTK that’s even faster than that is absolutely absurd and the real issue.

It is the exact same argument just flipped in reverse. If a hero who took 2 seconds to kill Junkrat now was made to take a minimum of 3 seconds instead, it would be the same result as making Junkrat have a TTK of 2 seconds.

The problem with buffing Junkrat to 2 seconds of TTK is power creep which is why the HP buffs were given in the first place.

2 Likes

This is where its at. Hitscan its better

2 Likes

How is Junkrat having the exact same TTK for direct hits as the rest of the entire history of OW “Insane” or “powercreep”?

You are wearing you bias on your sleeve.

3 Likes

No. Junks ttk was increased by 50% with his primary. Most heroes did not see such a large increase and that’s before we remember that Junk has the most inconsistent primary in the game.

He loses to everyone except Sym and that’s only because she also suffers from the same ttk increase.

It puts him level with every other hero. He takes forever to actually kill somebody even hitting every shot which is completely unrealistic.

There’s no power creep when even with 125 nades he’d still be weaker than pre season 9.

6 Likes

Sym also suffers from the devs either accidentally or intentionally trying to destroy her nearly every change they make… since OW1. There’s a tiny bit of hyperbole there but it’s still mostly true.

Regardless, Junk and Sym don’t deserve to be trash just because people don’t like playing against them. People don’t like playing against anything (except a Widow 1v1 they win), really.

5 Likes

He’s basically unplayable against any somewhat competent player.

6 Likes

Vulture (commonly known as Sewerrat) has dipped from GM1 to DIAMOND 2. That should be telling enough how awful this character is to play right now. No matter what they will try, Junkrat is worthless without his combo

6 Likes

I think losing the mine+grenade combo would be fine if I could still 2 shot with my primary fire.

I never really liked the instakill combo, my playstyle was always about mine jumping and predicting shots.

3 Likes

I didn’t say he was power-crept. I said it would lead to powercreep if they buffed him.

Also realizing, thinking, and committing to a counter action within 1.2 seconds is insanely difficult. The only reason it doesn’t seem ridiculous is because other characters have an even more absurd timeframe to deal with. Doesn’t mean that its not insane.

Also what bias? I play every character (except for Sym, ironically), so it doesn’t make sense to have a “bias” against something I enjoy playing.

I fail to see how this isn’t the same as what I’m saying. It still takes 2 shots to kill like it did before and his primary fire was just as inconsistent as it was before. The only difference being that now there’s a window of opportunity for the other party to survive if coordinated. A global reduction in TTK is a good thing as long as global TTH is also increased.

Increasing the TTK would only make the game worse (because, believe it or not, humans have a hard capped reaction time of 190-200ms), which is why I said it would be better for other characters to receive nerfs instead.

Putting him on equal footing with broken heroes would simply make him another broken hero. It’s only “forever” relative to the game, not what is optimal or even realistic.

The season 9 changes were an attempt (a very stupid and poor one, but an attempt) to lower the overall TTK, which is a direct success in Junkrat’s case.

Without his combo, he truly is the epitome of what most people complain about him being a spamrat. He is forced to play like this, more trying to protect supports and spamming between them and the tank at the areas where it’s most likely to hit someone or at least force an enemy into a worse position. It’s not very effective.

5 Likes

You are biased because you have a thread complaining about Reaper being weak, then you come into a Junkrat thread and say “don’t buff Junkrat”. I didn’t come into your thread and say “Don’t buff Reaper” then go on a Junkrat tangent. Take a cue from the Symmetra main showing solidarity.

7 Likes

I was just about to specify I’m not a Symmetra Main™ (I’m a Ball Main™ if anything), but then I looked it up and at the start of Feb I had 232 hours on Rat (mostly from OW1) and 203 on Sym. Maybe I am a Sym main… the horrors!!!

Either way, you never want your DPS hero being compared in any way to the effectiveness of Symmetra. Unless you’re referring to one of the 3 GM Syms that recently quit.

1 Like