Why do completely fine heroes keep getting reworks?


#15


#16

in skilled play, Slam build was the only thing people really built. the rework was designed to make stitches just as useful (maybe even better) while increase talent diversity, hence the baked in slam buffs.

She was pretty awful before, having been power crept and left to die for months.

Sonya needed that rework to be pushed into being more relevant.

Powercrept and offered very little compared to many other supports. the rework brought her more in line with other heroes and gave her % healing baseline as well for some quick burst heals.

i’m not sure if the changes count as a true rework? some things are being lightly tinkered with and moved around but otherwise Aba is the same.


#17

Lol… She was first pick/ban even up to the highest level of play


#18

I really wish they didnt touch kerrigan, but she got some great stuff out of her rework. Just my opinion. I know some people really liked her changes.


#19

i know right? tass, tyr, kerri, and sonya were all NERFED when dozens of these forumgoers begged for BUFFS

ROFL…


#20

hero reworks need about 3 qualities

1: the problem
2: the demand
3: the solution

some heroes have a demand, or they may have a problem but if there isnt a solution to fix the “problem” then a rework isnt going to roll out.

Of the not-heavily demanded reworks they generally fall into two kinds of heroes: bad talent options or the talent design encourages not using the entirety of the hero kit.

In some cases, a solution may seem to come quickly, for others it may be in limbo for a year+ working out whatever it is apart of the process.

For stitches, slam was a mana sink if it wasnt talented into, and without slam, hes just a hookbot that occasionally has a heroic. With the rework, he has more options and utility available for auto attacks, trait, slam, devour, etc. that enable him into being more than an ignorable walking dot with a displace effect.

bw had similar limitations in q being weak without talents, but opportunity costs on abilities may render the ability not worth talenting into, so it ends up with half a hero that can sometimes teleport — lili had similar issues with serpent and so did several heroes that feel into a string of reworks that looked to bring up the baseline effect of basic abilities so the hero has effects that are useful from the onset.

A few ofher heroes that may get mentioned had a fan followed that “enjoyed” having an ignorable hero that was “unkillable” because the talented effects they took may them a low priority target that could afk in lanes and pretend the rest of their team werent carring an extra load.

If someone wants to know why a hero is reworked then they may want to set aside the notion that something is “fine” in favor of being willing to endure information they didnt expect instead of essentially putting on a display to ask for an echochamber to reinforce the “fine” so expected.

j


#21

At the time - increasingly stun heavy meta came in which shut down Sonya and Sonya poor talent diversity.

Also here you are again arguing with people again.


#22

Because liberals only balance by feelings


#23

Simple. They weren’t completely fine. Stitches had 1 build (on his most boring ability) for one example. He wasn’t fine.

Plus it needs to be done for the upcoming role changes.

But I understand that someone like you, who don’t really play those Heroes didn’t see their need of attention.

Also, just because a Hero receives a rework later doesn’t mean it’s a lower priority. It might just mean it’s a lot harder job which needs more time, effort and thought. More work.


#24

Because some people on the forums keep making salt threads about certain heroes which are fine and have been for the longest time but cant play against them personally.

Then all the other 3 players who have the same problem tag onto it.


#25

Let’s see:
Brightwing was the worst healer in the game and the most boring to play.
Lunara was consistently one of the worst heroes in the game. And the worst assassin.
Sonya was annoyingly OB for ages because of one skill which they keep trying to fix without breaking her.
Stitches was a one trick pony.
Aba had one mildly effective build post ammo rework and was totally safe while doing it.

And reworks take time and people. Plus many of your ‘Needs rework’ heroes have had reworks and were once even worse.
For instance: Tychus. Yes he’s a niche hero. In that niche he’s a god of murder. He was once worthless, but he got a rework.
Nova was once only good for noobstomping and had a grand total of one effective build.
Glaz used to be a joke. Now he’s fully capable of wrecking face.
Tassadar has the unfortunate distinction of being both incredibly weak and incredibly OP dependent on both teams. That’s a challenge to fix.


#26

Not true. Lunara has always had a place in the game pretty much. She’s never been the cream of the crop, but she’s never been nova tier either. I think most of the perception that she’s weak comes from people who don’t understand she has to play slowly. She’s not about getting kills, she’s about straining the enemy healers and racking up big damage over the course of the game.


#27

Which she simply couldn’t do before her rework. Hence the rework. There was basically no reason to take her at all. She had a niche and was a total failure in it. Kind of like old Tychus.

Her power peaked at ‘Kind of annoying’, which is an issue and why her pick and win rate were both in the trash. She couldn’t outpoke anyone but the slowest melees. She couldn’t deal with coordinated teams at all. She was a painfully slow laner. And her damage was so low that the effects on healer mana was negligible at best. Especially when you take into account the many other hit and run characters that did more damage, faster, and more safely.
She was somewhat effective in low tier QM, but even then there were just too many counters.


#28

Why ?

There is absolutely nothing i wouldnt outperformed the current medivh with me using the pre-rework medivh.

Manual portal should had been a base line since the start . tier 1 was the only tier i would always pick the same thing ( portal mastery ).

People kept complaining that he had only 1 build and ive shown on many occasion that he didnt. I made multiple guides on how to play him efficiently and how to select each talents and people still cried about him having only 1 viable build.

The current portal mastery is a mess. Its much slower to place the portals. I dont care about placing portals as a bird but that delay in the portal placement was never fixed but even with that issue , portal mastery remains the best talent of lvl1 no question.

They changed him so playing vs him was less frustrating and changed his talents so lower skilled players had an easier time selecting which talent they should go with.

I still play medivh now , yes. But am i dominating as much as i use to ? Not even remotely close !

Im willing to debate but there will be very few things the new medivh will outperform the old one. (Outside of some talents i admit are much better and should had been from the start like raven intelect )


#29

Mainly increasing base W and E cds.


#30

Do you every get tried of complaining?!
You need some positivity in your life…


#31

Then if i get your point , what was needed with medivh wasnt technically the rework but rather the nerf ?

How did medivh went from being seing as " weak and useless " character but after the nerf he was somehow seing as “much stronger” ? All that mostly by the same group of people who couldnt play him to begin with .

After his rework we were flooded with new medivh players who thought that the rework would make them play better , then gave up .


#32

If we merely took old medivh and just nerfed E and W cds he would be worse than current iteration.

Let’s not pretend circle of arcane explosion never existed.Medivh rose to 48% winrate and was breaking the game with or without Diablo so some people kinda got more successful with him,for a time.

Is this really an issue though?


#33

What are you talking about, Sonya had like 1 build needed a rework. Stitches needed something because the hero is one of the least picked tanks in the game. BW had few talent selections there was practically 1 build for the hero.

Tassadar got a rework, but needs another, NOVA has had several changes.

Junkrat is still a pretty newish hero and is in a great spot.

Tychus has a place, does his role rather very well.

I dont even know what your complaining about.


#34

Medivh’s talent diversity was bad. His cds were op. The rework was welcomed and necessary imo as well.