What heroes would benefit from talents being baseline?

With the recent patch we’ve seen a number of heroes getting talents baseline from Stitches fishing hook, Blaze’s crossfire and Garrosh’s into the fray. Which heroes do you think have talents that could be made baseline to provide more power and increase build diversity? I can think of a few:

Nova’s explosive rounds could be made to scale (from low damage not the 90%) with the snipe quest. It would give her a soaking and DPS buff for maintaining the base quest. All from the start of the game.

Chen’s brew masters balance is an incredible talent and making a weaker version baseline would shake up the talent tier. Elusive brawler and gift of the ox are good but BMB is just great. I also love the idea of giving his brew mechanic deeper effects baseline.

Are there any other heroes with talents that could shake up their power and builds if made base effects?


Interesting idea!

I’d love Zera’s Blink CDR to be baseline. Change the level 1 talent.

Jaina’s Fingers of Frost too


Those are interesting! I always liked Zera’s shadow hunter talent but felt it was only good in AA builds. Making it baseline could make him more risk reward. Although it being Zera I fear it could over buff him a ton in skilled hands. The only problem with frost fingers base is that Jaina already has a base quest. I worry adding that talent in particular would push Jaina into super strong territory. I don’t play her much but her slows and damage are insane already.

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  • Alex and Lifeblossom.
  • Kael’Thas with Manaholic.
    […and Convection should just die, die, die]
  • As above, Nova with AoE on Snipe.
  • Lunara’s Nature’s Culling but with something like 70-80% more baseline PvE damage. Mostly for Q build, that uses Blossom Swell. 125% should still be talent.
  • Morales and Cellular Reactor.
  • Tyrande and Trueshot Aura, without AA buff on damage. She should have legit Seasoned Marksman-like quest on lvl1.

I really like all of these! Life blossom feels more like a static effect over a talent. Manaholic would be a nice buff for Kael without sacrificing his tier one. Lunara’s culling having a base effect that could be buffed is interesting but could push her into OP territory. Morales getting cellular reactor as a heal is cool because it has a built in downside. I’m not sure about Tyrande since I barely play her but this idea is an interesting change that could provide a decent buff for her.


Nature’s Culling is used in more then half of overall Lunara games. Laning is integral part of her gameplay. It’s also part of 6 top-win builds [even if it’s the same build, but with variations on lvl1 and 13]. Rest of her builds is below 47% winrate…

I used to think, that any Lunara player that has any brains go for it, because healing talent is very veak and Blossom Swell is useful only for Q build. Value of Nature’s Culling is jus so immense, that other options are not worth it. Blossom Swell is actually very good talent, but competes with Nature’s Culling that’s mandatory for Lun in majority of games… Especially on Battlefield of Eternity.

I don’t pick Nature’s Culling in only one situation - when I have competent TLV in my team, and it’s not BoE.

I think she requires another rework, because despite the fact that her talent tree is versatile, she has a single effective build. I gotta prepare some rework design one day.

Her last rework turned her into generic and not the best healer, and imho killed whole spirit of this character. She was always exceptional when paired with marksman heroes, like Valla, Fenix, Lunara or even Nova. Now she has only mediocre heal, and no real damage.

My ex gf mained her before rework and loved her for being basically ranged Kharazim. After rework, she was so disappointed that she switched to Sylvanas, as playing Tyrande is not satisfying anymore. Tyrande should become battle healer again.

HCL is not a thing anymore, so characters does not need to fulfill generic tank, dps and healer archetypes. This game does not need generic characters. It needs fun characters.


Thralls level 4 mana tide totem should be baseline.


This is another talent that has high popularity and win rate. Making a weaker version of it baseline or adding it at a certain level would be nice. We could get a new talent there and hopefully get some more diversity at 4.

Or an alternative to culling Convection, bake it into Q baseline! He might need a slight tune-down in other areas of his kit as compensation, but at least feeders wouldn’t be wasting an entire talent slot on it and having the quest uncompleted at level 18.


BW Hyper Shift
Naz Vile Infection


I think kt should get his mana barrier baseline.


Hyper shift is so integral to BW, at least in my opinion. I hope the devs consider this at some point. I’m confused why I didn’t even think about vile infection being a base quest. It makes so much sense for it to be one too!


Qhira getting booming Kick either baseline at a certain level or attached to some sort of baseline quest would not only create an oppurtunity for a new Level 16 not connected directly to E which alone could create new build pathes (especially if the new level 16 is meant to combo with the Bleed Quest which as win and pickrates show is struggling)
But would also free us up to use the other 2 on that tier and not have a talent with 80% pickrate

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medivh’s portal mastery ; not taking this one talents is such an handicap.
zeratul move unseen ; that 30% movement speed is really a good impact at any steps of the game.

those would be the first 2 i could think about.


Disclaimer, I’m not really that good on balance so just bear with me :laughing:

Zagara; Bile Drop extra roach, unlocked automatically at 13 or have it made a baseline quest (I prefer the former rather than the latter). Right now Zagara is only valued for her Bile Drop and Corrosive Saliva at higher plays, making these 2 a must pick. Introducing these 2 baseline should be great. Alternatively, Zagara can have a baseline quest similar to ZJ where she has to basic attack heroes to gain different benefits after reaching different amount of stacks.

Kerrigan; Fury of the Swarm, Q quest, and possibly Boundless Fury. Fury of the Swarm and the Q quest are dominating their tiers because the hero feels awkward without them. I don’t think Boundless Fury is necessary, but I think the other 2 options are just really bad.

Probius; shield regents from pylon and his own shield combined into 1 and made baseline. Also the echo pulse too.

Kael’Thas; Mana Addict for the winnnn, and delete Convection or make it into an infinite stacking quest ( :grin: )

Lunara; Nature’s Culling, it just seems like such an integral part of her kit and it doesn’t have to be given at 1 but still at a later level.

Auriel: I wanna say Reservoir of Hope but I’m really afraid it’ll get broken even if it’s a free quest talent at 16.


Somebody pour this man a round! On the house.

And another. This one is on me.


I personally won’t mind some Qhira buffs, so I’m down and Booming Kick seems to be what Qhira should have baseline anyway as a team fight initiator and finisher.

A bit off topic, but this made me realize something scary/awesome;
Johanna with Falling Sword + Anduin Light bomb + Qhira Unrelenting Strikes = triple unstoppable stun + silence and on top of that, Johanna and Qhira can get resets and recast their Heroics for another unstoppable silence and double stun! Haven’t tried it yet but theoretically nothing wrong with the comp.

Lol I see you’re a man of Nature yourself :rofl:.

Is that the level 1on Medivh? Yeah the other options just seems underwhelming lol.

Can’t believe I forgot about this. But should Vile be made a baseline quest or does it need to still be locked behind 20? I personally would like to see Nazeebo’s Trait incorporate Thing of the Deep and Vile Infection both as baseline quests.

Bad Nazeboos rarely finish the quest, and often go for upgrade for Ravenous Spirit. Lvl20 Vile should remain a reward for Naz players who actually bother to lane for their team and accumulate enough stacks.

Although Naz is specialist, his waveclear is not the best and for the sake of reward, it should not be. KT, Azmodan, Sylvanas, Lunara, Xul and plenty of other heroes have way batter waveclear efficiency. Meanwhile Vile is extremely powerful talent, and I don’t think it should be unlocked by very reason of surviving up to 20. Let’s not encourage a generation o Lazy Nazeboo Players to emerge, like we already have with Aba and Nova :].

I spend majority of my free time in my local forest, strolling, practicing martial arts, archery, meditation or just strolling around :]. I strongly recommend, even if you cannot find any friendly dryads around.

As level reward on 16? Yeah, that would do the trick. Also her armor reduction talent needs buffs.

Agreed on Fury of the Storm. I miss old cleave AA talent, but Fury also works considering resets on her Q. Boundless Fury is also pretty much must have, but instead of Q baseline quest, I would add W quest with more damage and faster casting time as reward.

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Brightwing Hypershift should be baseline


Or give it the proper nerf it deserves and not have a damned 4 radius aoe, though I still usually pick the other two.
But power creep is fun too I guess.

I rarely finish the quest.
Because I actually kill heroes instead of afk in lane.
Maybe he should just get some stacks when he kills or damages heroes, and Vile should just be less powerful, to discourage people going afk in lane in an attempt to build up for a level 20 talent that most likely won’t have impact because the game is already over.
There’s a reason that despite its overwhelming pick rate, its win rate is still slightly below the others. You throw away the early game, you don’t have much of a late game to even aim for.

But if power creep is the name of the game.
Anub beetle talent, because it strengthens his identity.
Morales Clear! because it improves her an active non-heal role.
Li-Ming Aether Walker because who would ever ride a horse when they can teleport everywhere.
Hell, just give Abathur Evolve Monstrosity because its better than Ultimate Evolution and people should stop picking the inferior heroic so very frequently. :stuck_out_tongue:
Actually lets just give him Hive Mind too, because apparently the idea is to just give heroes things that people consider integral to their play, and that has an incredible pick rate. Talent diversity via giving “must picks” rather than thinking about balance.
But at least some of these make the heroes more interesting and speak to their identity.