I find it very annoying when people get a really great game as someone and than they use that as evidence of how X hero is OP/ Trash. But I suppose i can play this game.
https://imgur.com/a/h9K12z1
Lucio OP because i had a really great game with him that won’t happen for the next few months please nerf.
Rehgar theoretically has a decent dmg and waveclear. The issue is that in order to get that dmg, you have to overextend A LOT. Rehgar is a melee character, but doesn’t have enough survivability in order to unleash his true potential. In order to get a high single target dmg, you have to use your only escape - Z. There is no way to Ancestral Heal yourself. There is no way to Cleanse yourself. Totem only slows and can be killed by anything.
Another glaring issue is the Ancestral Heal heroic. Rehgar’s kit has been butchered several times simply because this stupid heroic is so ridiculously powerful if used at the right time. Rehgar’s kit must be kept underwhelming in order to keep Ancestral’s power in check. As a result, Rehgar is a boring backline support whose only job is to land that perfect Ancestral heal (and perfect Cleanse). The rest of his kit is just filler.
Rehgod is better not being summoned ever again.
Rofl “every couple of months” You want to play that game? Let’s dance.
Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Those are just from Yesterday. You want to get into today’s games? I got plenty more.
Saying LiLi’s damage is trash is an objectively ignorant statement that is easily proved false by anyone with the slightest bit of common sense.
If you take Electric charge at level 1, you can clear a minion wave very fast, maybe in a 6-7 sec if you stand in the middle of the wave.
Blood and Thunder at 7 reduced basic ability by 2 sec, you can finish the wave with another cast of w, but the wave is almost dead.
I don’t know where you are getting your number from.
Reghar is fun. I like to play him a lot. His talent choice are nice too.
In higher ranks. i love to pick reghar.
If I do a camp , no one complains.
You can carry the team by doing multiple roles.
Mana is never a problem if you go W build on early talents.
Both ults need a bit of tweeks tho. Good single target dmg and kill potential.
I especially love him on dragon shire and tomb where he can roam around and pick up gems / do waveclear/camps very quick
Fight! Fight! Fight!
Sorry, but those are fighting words!
Will you and Ephraim duel in Weehawken at dawn?
…I thought you two were friends for some reason…(goes to spy at Ephraim friends list)
That’s his problem. This is now alliance imagery, RIP.
And this just proved what I said… Notice how in a nearly 26 minute game Li Li got less than 20k siege damage (trash tier wave clear) and only ran up large hero damage due to constant poking (fewer deaths than everyone else).
Was this including Blood and Thunder and constant wolf conversion spam to maximize DPS and lighting orb up time? Did you also wait before starting until the minions spread out for alex to start (typical situation where one needs wave clear due to build up or mercs).
So? I also get games like these… Does not make Lucio have less than trash tier damage, just it shows that other people on the team are not using their hero correctly. For example the Jaina ally who died a lot and did far lower hero damage than a Jaina should be doing.
Again look at siege damage. Heroes like Li Li, Whitemane and Lucio can get surprisingly high hero damage numbers but it is from continuously poking enemy heroes. They get as good as no siege damage as a result which shows their overall low damage. The Gazlowe on the other hand had only 10k less hero damage but ran up over 8 times the siege damage, meaning the only reason he did not win hero damage was because he spent so much of his time doing siege and the same goes for the enemy Zagara.
To put it in perspective Lucio has such trash tier damage he cannot even damage many warriors like Artanis, Stiches and Arthas as their self sustain is higher than his DPS. In versus AI I often find myself as Lucio wailing on those heroes for well over 1 minute making as good as no impact to their health. Reghar can damage all of these thanks to superior DPS although will still lose 1v1 against Artanis and Arthas at full health due to them being some of the best 1v1 heroes in the game.
Versus AI is a good example in this case since you can get hold of targets which will just let you poke them with damage for excessively long periods of time. Against any sensible real human doing this is not safe as Lucio is high priority so they will kill him.
Then goes onto a stupidly long cooldown during which Li Li only has serpent and auto attack damage.
On the other hand every 4 seconds Reghar can lunge at opponents thanks to his wolf form conversion which does non trivial damage. If he really wants to DPS at level 16 he can take Rising Storm which causes Lighting Orb to have over 200 AoE DPS average against heroes on top of his lunges. His auto attack (without lunge) is also high end for a support at a massive 141.25 DPS at level 0 as opposed to Li Li at only 75 DPS (slightly above half). These values were pulled from online so might not reflect latest balance. Lightning orb + auto attack does far more DPS than Li Li with auto attack and serpent so quickly runs into the extra damage from winds and possibly an ultimate. If Li Li picks water dragon she forgoes any healing from ultimate unlike Reghar which both will provide healing in some form, hence it needs to do reasonable damage to be worth it.
That said Li Li might still win 1v1 against Reghar due to her being an auto attack counter hero while Reghar is an auto attack hero. A few key blinds to avoid his lunges and her superior sustained healing speed would win it for her.
On the other hand I mix what I play so I know what assassins are capable of. That is why those Lucio and Li Li hero damage numbers do not impress me at all.
Alex wave clear is not bad if you use it against a wave before they clash with your minion wave or structures. They line up perfectly allowing each flame buffet shot to hit all minions at the same time. It also slows them and refunds all mana cost allowing many shots to be landed before the waves collide.
The problem is when clearing a massive minion wave where the minions are all over the place already. Alex has to choose to either clear a type of minion (melee or ranged) by shooting perpendicular to the lane, or she has to clear a tiny fraction by shooting parallel to the lane.
At least she has wave clear unlike Li Li and Lucio. Best Lucio can do is use his knockback on them for 100-200 damage to all the minions. Li Li just cannot…
It is trash. Look at her siege damage numbers compared with allies. For example Game 6 it was 1/13 of the D’Va who is not even that good at dealing siege damage…
She can run up high hero damage due to constant poking. She is unlikely to kill heroes doing this without allied support and in doing so she basically does as good as no siege damage. Any combat orientated hero that spends the entire game auto attacking other heroes will get decent damage numbers, even Morales.
Soooo… Rehgar then xD ??
You’re really making this whole argument very confusing.
Rehgar pokes with wolf and lightning shield and autos all game = legit damage
LiLi pokes with wind and serpent and autos all game = fake damage
You aren’t being fair with your assertions here. Why is it that only Rehgar’s damage is considered “real” when he does the exact same thing as LiLi?
Sooo… just like Rehgar then…
Again your assertions for why LiLi is weak is faulty for two reasons:
A) It is not my job to clear as we have heroes who are much MUCH better than me at doing so, allowing me to focus on driving the enemy team away with constant damage.
B) Having one weakness (LiLi’s waveclear) is enough for you to completely discredit her which is completely unfair especially given how amazing she can excel in other areas.
For example, Alex has some of the worst hero damage of all supports against any team that doesn’t consist of 2-3 frontline bruisers/tanks. She makes up for this with unrivaled healing and fantastic waveclear.
The reason why your argument fails is because you neglect to acknowledge that having your team patch your weaknesses so you can focus on your strengths is how the game is supposed to be played. I.E., in the case of LiLi, have other people clear so you can focus on driving the enemy away with constant damage or in the case of Alex, use your lack of damage and amazing healing to ensure the people on your team who can do damage can do so without having to back.
Isn’t that a good thing. I mean most discussions are “X hero is broken. Buff/Nerf them” Having few people complain about Rehgar seems like a good thing.
He has the 2nd highest health pool of any support behind Uther.
Uther’s mana problem is worse prior to completing level 1 quest.
Honestly when I take reduced mana cost on heal for rehgar @ level 4 he really doesn’t have that many issues mid-late game with mana. They might wanna look into adjusting his mana cost baseline based off that if their is an issue, but the past 2 seasons at least Rehgar has been my most played hero, and my only issue has been early game mana management, and ana’s grenade totally negating his heroic 
were you expecting this to go any better than the last time you made this topic? Kinda curious if you copy/pasted parts from it, or just chose to recycle terms instead of just linking to the topic – iirc, I think you’ve self-quoted and plugged topics before.
I dunno, i find it odd you chose to keep to the ‘nothing’ matra from before which would evidently suggest you chose to neglect most of any of the previous other topics, except, perhaps, for the bit on bloodlust.
Seems you mostly gave on up just offering simple tuning suggestions in favor of more the more chronic-complaint posts of the sort of posters you used to complain about instead of carrying on a more… compelling argument in this regard.
Press F to pay respects to the once proud orangejuice?
Yeah, I also play lots of supports and I find Rehgar to be lacking… He seems way too squishy for what he needs to be doing.
Allowing him to use AH on himself may fix this problem tho.
I feel like with all his nerfs it’s probably safer again to make his ascentral self castable again
Its because its the most efficient way to decorticate each element and develop on the idea and context one at a time rather then one block where its possible to confuse ideas or misreading something.
As for reghar. I like him hes a good aggresive support. Good hero in my opinion. 
Bless you, OJ. I don’t like to spam the forums, but I’m still with you on Rehgar.
I’m not sure I agree with you on every point you make in this post. To be completely honest, Rehgar is actually pretty balanced currently. Unfortunately, they balanced him around a heal-bot role, not an aggressive role. Which is what hurts us the most.
I played Rehgar for Lightning Bond. It was the Heart and Soul of my play-style. It gave Rehgar the ability to go toe-to-toe with almost anyone willing to get close enough. I don’t even care about the wave clear it granted, I just want a Lesser Lightning Bond back. Rehgar just feels so stale without it. ![:frowning:](https://d3rakab8gpdsa3.cloudfront.net/en/heroes/images/emoji/twitter/frowning.png?v=6" ":frowning:")
Well, that’s because Lucio is OP and/or overtuned. lol
Typical Xenterex - attacking the poster and contributing nothing towards the topic.
If you’d like to discuss (without needless walls of text), please do. Otherwise, just move on, dude. 
OP? Nah, Overtuned? Maybe. The strength from Lucio comes from his lvl 10, lvl 16 and lvl 20 talents for him to keep up with other healers. His speedboost is his saving grace before lvl 10.
Yeah, his speedboost is what puts him in a weird spot. He enables diving a little too well and minimizes team mistakes with the boop-n-boost away. :X