Bet on the match outcome - win/lose more rank

Competitive Discussion
1

Ok - so we all know how bad the grind is in this game - we take 100 steps forward, 99 forced steps backwards. Most of the games are decided before they even start - either because of troll picks, bad players, griefers or any other reason. Because of this, it takes AGES to get into the right bracket where matches are fun - we have bronzies who should be in Gold and who don’t enjoy the lack of tactical play, we have Golds who wouldn’t win a Bronze 5 game who don’t enjoy being ‘that’ bad player in the team. Most of the games are decided before you play.

So here’s my idea:
Allow the player to place a bet on whether they think they will win, or lose the game, during hero selection phase of ranked gameplay, or shortly after starting the game e.g. during the first 30 seconds of gameplay. Once the bet is made, it cannot be undone, or changed until the game is lost or won, and the bet will affect how much rank is won or lost at the end of the game.

Here is how I see it work:
I get grouped with a known griefer who keeps griefing his team - I expect I will lose this game: Not because I’m good, not because I’m bad - but because the griefer has so much power to force the loss (but NOT the win). Luckily, I can bet on myself now - I bet our team will LOSE this game (all bets are SECRET, and noone knows of my bet when I make it - my team mates could be betting for a win, I do not know this), meaning that I will gain only half the exp if my team wins this game, but if I lose, it doesn’t feel as bad because I only lose half my exp I would normally have lost. I can also decide not to place a bet at all, in which case I will win or lose 100% of my normal gains/losses. If I get placed in a good game, where good picks are made and I expect to have a good chance to win, I can gamble that I will WIN, meaning I will double my gains or losses. If I lose, then I lose 200% of my normal losses, but if I win, I win 200% of my winnings.

This will ensure that smart, good players - have a chance to affect their ranking that goes beyond the random 100 steps forward, 99 steps backward. It will give us more control, it will make for a more exciting gameplay with a bit more strategy and will give a sense of control to the player.

Optional idea - the option to bet could be limited to solo queuing only - to prevent possible abuse of this system by groups.

1 Like
2

Is this a joke / troll thread or are yo actually being serious?

Based on what you said, it sounds like you are the reason for majority of your losses with that attitude.

3

Someone made an AI and fed it like 300,000 replays, and the AI was able to predict the outcome of matches with at best 50% accuracy.

For those of you bad at math, this means the outcome of almost every match is 100% random. So, being able to bet on matches is pretty stupid since it wouldn’t solve any problems.

Blizzard should just balance the game instead so that if you play well, you’re more likely to win.

4

I’m serious - let me bet on my games. Trust me, I know 90% of the time whether I’m going to win or lose. For instance, I know when I’m being fed a Bronze 5 that doesn’t highlight until the very end of the round, and last-picks a DPS instead of a healer when we don’t have a healer. It’s GG when that happens, we all know it. What’s the downside of allowing people to bet? If you don’t like it - don’t bet! You’ll lose or win 100%, I’m totally fine with that. I just want to climb out of Bronze a little faster than 55% winrate is all, mainly because the games are totally boring and have no actual entertainment value due to the lack of tactical and strategic gameplay - something I enjoy on my main (but I don’t play my main because there’s noone at the higher levels anymore, so I’m forced to smurf - but that’s another issue with 5 different queues that should be compacted into 2 queues: solo and team, both of them ranked and no more AI/QM/yolo stuff)

5

Betting on match outcomes isn’t how you do this. You do it by making skill important. Today, it’s not. Especially if you’re playing solo or in a pair. There is no way to carry your team in HotS, no matter how good you are, and that’s really really huge failure of the design team.

6

Well, get better at the game and you will climb faster. It’s quite simple really. GM in bronze could easily win 95%+ of the games. That’s the upper limit you’re looking at, at how much better you could get.
Now, there’s 0 chance you could get to GM level before you get out of bronze (unless you get better on a different account and then come back to the bronze one), but you can still focus on improvement to hasten your progress. 52-60% is kind of the natural progression when you’re actually improving. Few people can improve faster than that (unless they’re not only improving but also ranked too low at the same time). 55% solo winrate in bronze roughly means you’re playing like a silver (on average). By the time you become a gold player, you should have at least reached silver rank, so your winrate should not really rise - that’s not some fault in the system or anything, it’s exactly how you should expect it to be.

7

You are delusional. This isn’t League where you can get fed and hard carry your team. All it takes is for 1 garbage player on your team to throw at 20 minutes, or feed from the start, or afk from the start.

Also, stats disagree with you. The highest win rate among players of any rank is just under 60%.

Also, the matchmaking system intentionally creates losing matches for you when you’re on a win streak.

Way to show you know nothing about the game.

8

I’ve done that myself on 2 smurfs over the years and I’ve not even been gm at the time (well I was during the 1st smurf in 2016, but I was nowhere near GM when I did the 2nd one). I haven’t lost a single game from bronze5 to silver on my 1st one and I lost 2 or 3 on my 2nd one. Real GM’s can easily do flawless solo runs on bronze accounts.

9

Which smurfs? I have never seen anyone above a 60% win rate, and apparently neither have any replay sites.

Also, there’s no such thing as “Real GMs.” Most GMs are bad. Your “rank” isn’t even a rank, it’s a progression reward. Welcome to post-2005 gaming.

10

My own smurfs o.O. I’m pretty sure I know quite well what I won and what I didn’t (even if that was years ago). I had all replays uploaded, but that was on hotslogs before it died, so there’s no way to see the match histories of those smurfs anymore (and I wouldnt share the names of my smurfs anyway).

The best solo climb match history I’ve ever seen was Danatan’s smurf “TenLoseMax” in 2016. He got from bronze5 to master with only 8 losses total (so the name turned out correct XD). The win count at the end was over 100 (so well over 90% winrate for the entire run). I think his first loss was in gold in that run (so simply flat 100% winrate in bronze-silver).

I’m seeing many smurfs with better than 60% in plat/diamond games pretty much every day. “Lifetime” winrates of 70%+ are common among them (since they started somewhere lower and obviously won a lot before they reached that diamond or wherever they’re planning to stop). And you can bet they had much higher % when they were still lower.

You don’t even need to look at smurfs if you want to see something as measly as 60%+. Most of the grandmasters have more than that just playing normally on their mains (so against masters/GM’s, not smurfing in bronze). That’s obviously expected as you can’t exactly put just the top grandmasters in a single game every time; so on average they’re playing with people weaker than them and obviously win more than 50%.

Sure, you can put the top end of the scale at “bad”, but a bronze is still 100’s of times worse (what word would you put for that then? o.O).
Average (pro (or is that still bad?)) - bad (GM) - very bad (master) - unbelievably bad (diamond) - even worse (silver-plat) - almost as good as AI (bronze). Yeah, not sure I like that scale - not very informative and pretty demoralizing.

If that was even remotely true, I would have been top10 grandmaster for the past 5 years without breaks Xd (15k+ ranked games played). In reality though, I’ve been GM briefly at start in 2016 and never since. I’ve even been down as low as plat4 recently (rank decay + bad streak + experiments + tilt = nice combo). I guess I’m the only one ranked by how I play and all the rest of you just claim your “progression” rewards and go only up xD.

11

The easiest person to fool is yourself. In every game, almost every player overestimates their win rate.

That’s cool.

This is untrue. Just today I attempted to watch some garbo tournament that Mochrie was hosting. Within 5 seconds of watching it 2 players wasted their ults. In the next 7 minutes until the game ended I pointed out nearly 20 mistakes made by both teams. Pretty much every fight both teams only focuses the other team’s tanks. These were “professional” teams.

12

Stop fooling yourself. No offense to bronze players, but they tend to lack (several) fundamentals of the game. GMs are simply in another level, micro wise, game knowledge wise.

If I happen to make 5 GMs vs 5 bronzes (with the same mentality as yours, that there is no skill difference or whatever) occur, which side do you think will win? Would you bet on it? I’m sure 99.99% of the time, GMs will sweep if they’re full-on serious mode (for flavor, I might ask the GMs to have a game where they avoid team fights as much as possible but win through full macro; map, heroes accordingly of course).

Didn’t watch the tourney, but note that, not all of them participating are top players (depends on the tourney, team). If you’re referring to some top team, that’s rich. What you thought as mistakes may not have been mistakes, and there is high chance that your games will be worse (I might check your games later).

13

You’re simply not good enough to understand what a mistake is or to gauge what they actually cost. Also, not all “competitive” games comprise only good players. There are leagues that only accept bronze-silver max. Watch ccl if you want to see the top-end games.

P.S. What would happen if you tried to capitalize on a mistake of some1 100 times better than you? He would kill you for trying.
If I’m ever playing against much weaker opponents (well that’s usually obvious after a few min with them in a lane) I often do “mistakes” onpurpose to make them try to do something to me and then turn around and kill them coz I simply know I’m mechanically superior to them.

1 Like
14

I’ve been a top 100 player in multiple games. I’m one of about 50 westerners who can say they’ve played with a top Korean pro team. 100% of the predictions I’ve made about competitive games in the past 17 years have become true. The list of people in the entire world who know what a mistake is better than me can be counted on your fingers.

What would happen if you tried to capitalize on a mistake of some1 100 times better than you? He would kill you for trying.

That’s a problem. No competitive game is like that. The point of a mistake is that skill can’t make up for it. Skill is, in part, the ability to avoid making mistakes. Once you’ve already made the mistake, skill is out of the picture. If Magnus blunders a queen against a 1000 rated player, there’s nothing he can do to keep it.

By the way, thanks for finally admitting you know absolutely nothing about competitive games.