Assassins with bad waveclear, why?


E.g. zuljin, chromie. It’s not like these heroes get compensated by having a stronger teamfight presence.

Kaelthas or jaina are just as strong (or stronger) than chromie in a team fight, on top of having godlike waveclear.

Or, fenix or raynor are also as good as zuljin in a fight but they have way better waveclear (raynor with exterminator talent)



Because heroes don’t have to be the same.


Yea but if they have the same teamfight power and one is worse at waveclear, it doesn’t take a genius to realise things aren’t very fair…


Different heroes
Different playstyles
Different potentials
Different weaknesses
Different players
Different utilities


You don’t necessarily need to have waveclear on all your heroes in a composition. Zul’jin actually has a really high damage output via his AAs and strong poke with his W.

Chromie’s waveclear isn’t bad either, for one thing she’s not going to be solo laning anyway. Chromie is looking to be in the 4 man or 3 man lane stacking her Q and in that sense her W is perfectly fine for waveclear.

I think that you’re making the mistake of assuming that all assassins need waveclear when they don’t, most of the time you’re going to put heroes with low waveclear and gank potential with a tank/healer and rotate lanes to look for ganks.


Chromie has longer poke damage .
Zuljin shreds structures faster and wave clear is not an issue when he gets double revolving axes.
You could argue that quest gated heroes may take too long to be efficacious i guess


chromie literally has a longer cast range than the other heroes with whom you compare: how is that not directly an example of compensation?

By not needing to go in as close as other heroes, she can skirt the risk of getting interupted, pulled in, jumped on, and so on. Range of effect is part of a heroes power kit.

On the other bit, if you’re having waveclear issues – esp compared to raynor – on zul’jin, then I would think that a you issue: he even has two particular spec-paths for boosting his clear if so needed. However, given that zul’jin has quests for harassing heroes, having less a focus on clearing waves stresses a focus on hitting heroes instead.

Might wanna spell out the extent of the strengths you think you’re trying to compare to yourself before drawing incomplete conclusions that make it evident you’re leaving qualities out for the sake of short-thought topics.


Because not everyone is good at anything?

Wait, wait. You think that Chromie and Zul’jin have bad waveclear?

We’re talking about Chromie who on a regular wave can hit 4+ minions with her Sand Dragon?
Or Zul’jin who can use his trait and Amani Rage to AA waves very quickly?

Sure, Chromie is bad against built up waves of enemies, But Zul’jin’s Twin Axes is good against these lots of enemies (and against regular waves if you target it well).

I have to ask, have you even played either of these heroes?

It is not like Nova or Tracer, where your waveclear needs an ultimate or a very lategame talent. There I could understand complaining about their waveclear (and I agree with the crowd mentioning not all Heroes are the same).


Chromie is arguably the safest mage in the game, so if she had excellent wave clear on top of that, it would basically be impossible to lane against her. Her wave clear is decent, but as others said, you want her in the 3-4 man building stacks.


Believe it or not, Chromie with expanded Dragon Breath radius has high end wave clear, especially if she goes and complete the Dragon Breath quest. Even without any talents she is still above average as far as wave clear potential.

Dragon Breath pretty much one shots an entire minion wave towards mid game. Even without quest by late game it is one shotting the archer and mage minons. Anything left can be auto attacked and killed fairly efficiently. For that reason I rate her wave clear equal to Kael, whos flame strike does less damage to minions but is slightly more spamable.

Zuljin wave clear is good late game, but he needs the double revolving axes trait quest finished. Axes into an entire dense mob of minions and most that survive (not many) will be 1 shotted by his auto attacks.

Being an assassin does not mean good wave clear. Wave clear is a weakness of some assassins to compensate for strengths in other areas.


I like the fact that ppl are taking waveclear into consideration lately but thing is some may be overreacting a bit though

Not everyone needs to have a waveclear, 2 heroes per team is usually enough, 3 is great, don’t get me wrong, but 2 is still decent overall :slight_smile:

It’s a team game, fill in your pieces, make up for one’s another weakness (yes, that usually IS important, or if not working then emphasize some of your teammate’s strength by adding up more)

That’s like part of the excitement and freshness of what it brings as a different game compared to other Mobas out there though


The only time wave clear is super important to have on an assassin is when you are running double support. Otherwise, it isn’t that imperative (certain maps/situations demand more obviously).