One game in SL I was on Alterac. We had two of the enemy keeps down, while we we pushed core, 3 of us died. there was me (Tracer being chased) and Rexxar left.
The core had about 1/4 HP left. So I told Rexxar he would’t be able to solo it befre the enemy team doubled back and killed him. (Though 1 of them ignored him)
Then I noticed he was doing a LOT of damage to the core.
Now, Rexxar had picked “Easy Prey” level one. But it doesn’t say non-heroes or Monsters. Could the core count as a merc or a minion? Or does Rex have something else that would make him burst it?
The core is the weakest building in the game by a mile. For whatever reason, Blizzard won’t buff them to be any stronger than a tower come late game. My guess is that they’re designed to be soloable by half of the roster late game, since the new defensive features they added to them actually help the enemy team in a lot of cases.
The core is the weakest building in the game by a mile.
Yes but OP is specifically talking about the Generals on Alterac Pass which are unique cores.
General
Structure Information
Health 20,000 (+405 per minute)
Attack Damage 330
Debuff True Sight
Attack Speed 1
Attack Range 2.0
Kill XP: Winning the Match
The Generals are the leaders of the Horde and Alliance on the Alterac Pass battleground. The Horde is led by Drek’Thar , mentor to Thrall and elder shaman of the Frostwolves. The Alliance is led by Vanndar Stormpike , fierce dwarf warrior and leader of the Alterac Valley Stormpike Expedition.
For gameplay purposes, they are considered as structures. They also serve as the maps announcer.
However, unlike a normal core, there is a substantial boost to the general’s durability while one or two keeps stand, gaining 20/40 armor, respectively.
Rexxar should not gain any benefit from Easy Prey while trying to solo the Generals.
But it would be very easy to test in a Custom game whether Generals count as both structures and minions.
HotS has a lot of unique mechanisms, I wouldn’t put it past the dev team to give dual properties to a core (being a structure and a minion at the same time).
He is not in 2 places at once. Instead most of his health is on a hard to control pet that cannot even remote soak because it is tethered to him. On top of that it acts as another target for heroes to stack hero quests from. It also means he can take twice as much damage from area damage.
Hence why he has high end damage. This is similar to TLV which is one of the highest damage heroes in HotS as well to compensate for being 3 heroes. This is also why many TLV’s high damage talents have a requirement that all 3 of them be present since unlike Rexxar they can truly split up.
Play against a Rexxar on Braxis. He will channel the point and clear your minion wave at the same time. You can’t. You have to pick, to catch the soak or challenge the point. And you lose something no matter what you pick.
You can recall Misha anytime you think someone is stacking on her. She only needs to go out when you get value out of it.
Many heroes with long range abilities can do this as well. For example Azmodan. All without the disadvantage of being 2 heroes. It also only works on some objectives. For example he cannot really channel the nukes in Warhead Junction while doing this because they are too far off-lane and he must channel them personally.
This is in stark contrast to TLV which can soak a lane and channel/hold up to 2 objectives on any map. If they should is another question but they sure can.
This is why Rexxar is so strong since he has 2 heroes that are not fully independent. If Misha could channel objectives or had no leash distance then other weaknesses would need to be added to him to balance that out.
Azmodan can throw a globe at a minion wave every 10 seconds. But it doesn’t clear the wave, you need to auto attack to maximize your stacks, and you have to pick up xp globes yourself from minions that did not die from Globe. So you cannot stay on an objective and not miss xp. (Also, it can be interrupted to deny stacks)
Azmodan cannot hold the point against Misha/Rexxar. You have no sustain, so you will eventually run out of health and have to retreat. While Rexxar can heal Misha, while collecting globes from the minion waves to also sustain himself in mana.
Because “All shall burn” gets cancelled if you are stunned. Azmodan basically loses an ability when fighting Rexxar. And you won’t be damaging Misha with Q either since you’re sending it at the minions. So all you have are auto attacks and demon warrior.
Another lost ability on a two lane map is Demon Lt. Because you can never send it to an empty lane.
So no player will realistically pick Azmodan to challenge Rexxar. And he can’t do what Rexxar does.
He can either channel a nuke while Misha fights minions, pushes the wave, and collects xp. Or he can have Misha interrupt the enemy channel while he soaks xp and pushes the lane.
I don’t see having two bodies as being a weakness. Especially since enemies need to kill both to get the same xp as a hero kill.
it does not.
I tried to report a bug about it once… and was told it was not. It is a Core. (I don’t think there are any abilities that differentiate between different types of structures, but maybe Spazzo would prove me wrong).
If Rexxar is getting a damage buff against it (which seems unlikely, but not impossible) it isn’t because of it’s status.
Worst case, make a bug report and submit the replay? Bug Report
It does late game. He also has a summon which OHKOs minions every few seconds and is global cast which is very useful on 3 lane maps with much time spent off-lane.
Rexxar cannot hold the point against a lot of heroes as well. That is what having weaknesses results in.
Only at some positions. Others the nukes are too far off-lane so the leash kicks in. Hence why I used that map as an example.
I do not deny it has strengths. But it also has weaknesses. For example now it is 2 heroes that Living Bomb can use to spread. Sure Rexxar can use pro micro to avoid living bomb spread, until he is CCed in which case it spreads and even then he is having to work a lot harder than single heroes do to avoid the same thing. Additionally Mediev can use Rexxar to progress his quest by 2 stacks every cast, which again pro micro can avoid but that is still something not required by single heroes.
Being a strength does not also mean it is not a weakness. TLV is the perfect example.
It does. But if you’ve spent the entire game losing the lane and objective until that point, it’s likely too late. But my point is that Azmo can’t do what Rex does.
Rexxar wins against most solo laners. It usually takes two players to stop him. When I play Rexxar, I know I’ll eventually have to be 2 vs 1 in lane. They always send someone else to deal with me. Which heroes would you say he loses to?
I’m not saying he’s unbeatable or has no weaknesses. But he has an advantage that no other bruiser has. Yes some heroes can stack on you, but they’re rarely the ones you’ll face in lane. Though a Rexxar that doesn’t move a bomb carrying Misha is annoying.
This is basically ganking. Happens to all heroes who try to solo lane since it can pay returns if they secure a kill. Kills are worth more than simply depushing, especially when level difference is close.
Stiches and Leoric. Leoric can out heal him while stiches has access to huge damage reduction and can also largely out heal. Both late game, but then again Rexxar is more an early game hero than many others. Rexxar does not really have percentage damage so fighting tanks is a weakness.
He also loses out to ranged poke since he has limited abilities to engage. Sure Misha can body block skill shots but Misha eventually dies giving some experience reward. When Rexxar is then alone without Misha, he is fairly easy to kill as he personally is not the toughest. An example of a hero that can do this is Zagara since she has bonus speed on creep that she can put on her side of the lane and can dump summons onto either part of Rexxar given the opportunity, which he is not the most effective at clearing. Another example would be Cassia who has access to Blind, another major weakness of Rexxar, and has poke options as long as she is careful not the charge stunned and lose her trait stacks.
On top of general damage, which does not improve that much with talents compared with other heroes, Rexxar’s strength is CC and chase. As the game progresses it becomes more difficult to escape a fight or even enter one against him.
I don’t know why you’re going to argue Rexxar is a “fair” hero or whatever you’re doing.
He is a hero that has almost never dipped below a 50% winrate for higher level play. He avoids nerfs because he is a niche character. He has been (is?) OP in winrate and the developers were/are okay with it. He wins enough that if he was more played or felt more oppressive he would get nerfed hard.
Rexxar, statistically speaking, has always/nearly always had a much stronger upside than his downsides.
Rexxar’s design makes him a hero who is just good at what is demanded in HotS as a game. An example in another game is that Poundmaker in Civ6, who leads the Cree civilization. Even if he did not have any personal abilities, he would be strong good because the Cree is a Civ that does a lot of what Civ6 demands.
No, ganking is when someone rotates to get a pick on you. If they stay in your lane, it’s no longer a gank. You’re just laning against two people.
I’ll have to disagree on Stitches, because if the team send him to lane against Rexxar, then they don’t have a tank and they will lose in the 4 man. But he still has the same dilemma on an area control objective. Though I’ve never laned against a Stitches as Rexxar. If I did, I would keeo Misha away once he’s taken damage so he can’t heal off her, and just poke him at range. He can 't use E on me, and as long as I’m behind my minions he can’t hook me either.
Yes, but every bruiser does.
Zagara beats everyone in lane. Though I’m not sure who wins during point control.
I don’t think Cassia can win the tug 'o war. She has very basic wave clear, so she won’t be able to keep up. Either she doesn’t go back to her gate to get the xp and you out level her, or she gives up the objective to soak it. Though again. I’ve never had a team send a Cassia against me in the solo lane. Especially if she wants to stack her Q.
(Edit:)
Just an aside, but that’s not actually true. Early game kills are worth less than a minion wave. The reason you gank the solo lane is to ensure your solo laner wins. And good teams will only do it when they don’t have to sacrifice soak for it.
Stiches can heal off minions as well. Late game he has access to mobility and is one of the few heroes that can even become permanently immune to slows. Hence why he is pretty reasonable against Rexxar, at least at keeping him busy.
You keep mentioning objectives but as already mentioned Rexxar cannot do most while still remaining off-lane due to their positioning on the maps. On a few maps he can do this due to leash distance permitting, but not all. As such this is not a general use case of Rexxar anymore, as I have been responding to, but rather a debate about Rexxar on specific maps. A lot of heroes are stronger on specific maps due to how the mechanics work. When playing QM, Versus AI or ARAM with a hero you do not have a choice which map they end up on, or even choosing them so exploiting specific heroes strengths on specific maps is very much a Unranked/SL concept since you are told which map it is on the draft screen.
There are only 2-3 lanes in a standard map. As such this leaves 3-2 heroes free to do whatever they want while all lanes are soaked. As such this is not losing experience, this is getting bonus experience on top of the lane experience. They could also grab merc camps which yield similar experience of under 1 lane clear.
You don’t want a solo laner who will only be able to contest the lane late game. It means you’re losing for 80% of the game. And again, it means you’re losing your tank. I’ve never seen any team send Stitches to the solo lane. But either way, he doesn’t have a way to solve the 2 place dilemma either.
You will face Rexxar mostly on Braxis and dragon shire. Because those are his best map. Having a better game against him on Warhead junction or infernal shrines doesn’t mean much, since he’s rarely ever going to be picked there. (And WH doesn’t even show up on ranked.) But even outside of those maps, Rexxar still has a high win rate. Higher than most bruisers.
Even on CH, he can channel while Misha blocks skill shots. You can’t make a case against Rexxar being good because he’s one of the strongest heroes in the game.
That’s beside the point. You were talking about ganks. Having two people face Rexxar in a lane is not a gank.
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