The problem is there are so many “problem” cards, or cards barely held in check by other “problem” cards, that a handful of nerfs is simply rearranging deckchairs on the titanic.
and buffs…I fear any buffs will just change one oppressive broke thing, for another oppressive broken thing.
And unless Denathrius gets the Brode treatment, the myth of the board centric game is good and dead, the game would simply devolve into “who got lucky on the mulligan and got the big D”
Most of this can be attributed to the absurd power of parrots. There are back breaking battlecries for just about every matchup, and parrots + Bolner can multiply whichever one is most valuable for the matchup.
Combo deck? Duplicate mutanus a bunch and now they lack a win condition.
Aggro deck? Time to chain snowfall guardians.
Control? Let’s get several Denathrius.
Parrots are basically an answer for everything.
You are right that not all classes have these synergistic packages though, which is a huge problem when it comes to balancing the game when you’ve got a few classes given a package meant to compete, and a few classes running a glorified arena deck that was left in the dust by pre-planned synergy combos.
You can’t really buff all of the generic use cards in the dead classes to compete evenly with the synergistic stuff the other classes do right now.
The top of the meta is balanced by win rate, not by what they are doing, which is clearly seen by how punishing they are to the classes that weren’t gifted an overpowered synergy package.
https://replays.firestoneapp.com/?reviewId=af42a743-3fa0-4547-bc3f-54581550ced6&source=game-summary
this game just shows all that´s wrong with the game atm. i beat a shaman, and after stealing denathrius and a parrot i basically had no effort whatsoever doing so.
the powerlevel of duplicating battlecries, especially denathrius own is just really not thought through at all.
I really wonder who was it that pushed for adding brann back to standard.
Yes and no. Parrots exacerbate the problem. The problem is they have all those tools to begin with. Parrots just make it even worse. So yes, parrots are a major problem because they get multiple copies of what everyone else is lucky to have 1. Bolner gives Shaman 2 Branns where everyone else is working with 1. Mutanus can be discounted easily in Shaman thanks to Clownfish allowing for earlier Parrots and earlier double battlecries.
So yes, Parrot is a backbone of the problem, but the other tools also play a backbone. It’s just too much synergy. Everyone else is working with 1 copy and Shaman is over here working with 3-5 copies.
lol I agree…however, I honestly think they thought Reno would be the biggest concern and just overlooked Brann.
if they somehow fix this mess here and then add highlander support with the next expansion he still might.
albeit currently it´s really really hard to imagine.
Yeah, but if not for the parrots, other decks could mess with them pretty evenly. Not exactly evenly because of Bolner, but shaman wouldn’t just have 2 extra copies of whatever relevant battlecry they need at 3 mana.
Now, you could also argue that some of the battlecries they are copying are just too strong (which I fully think Denathrius is, as is snowfall guardian). Overall, shaman has the best of all worlds as a combo/control deck.
lol I agree…however, I honestly think they thought Reno would be the biggest concern and just overlooked Brann.
If they overlooked Brann they’re completely incompetent, and I give them more credit than that. They at least know how interactions work. You’d have to be living under a rock to not know how powerful Brann was back in the day. With the current era of battlecries even that dipsh*t living under a rock half their life would still know that “double battlecries” is strong. And they released Kaelthas in his current form to boot! They knew EXACTLY how influential Brann would be…
I practically screamed bloody murder when they revealed the core set rotation had Brann in it. I immediately called it then and there that he of all cards would break the meta’s back single-handedly. And I wasn’t the only one. You don’t disrespect Brann. His effect is just that busted.
You have succinctly explained what I have been feelling this entire expansion.
I HATE this meta, and it’s exactly this: Boards aren’t actually made to trade and go face, they are made to power other things or as a byproduct of advancing a win con.
Outside of implock, I wouldn’t either. But even that deck is cooked if it can’t win quickly.
Nothing should have that much control. The game was better without heavy control. This meta is heavy on control into broken combos. This meta sucks.
All the synergy in the world won’t stop the current meta leaders from laughing in your face if you can’t kill them from hand without using your board. The problem in this meta is that anything that uses the board is easily negated by the best decks. Control is the problem.
There’s 1 control deck. So Shaman is the only problem?
… oh, my bad, I didn’t realize freeze wasn’t a control tool. I didn’t realize every minion having rush to negate boards wasn’t control tools.
The problem is the top decks have too many tools to control the board and the game to stall to broken win condition that can’t be stopped.
You consider Skele Mage a control deck?
well mostly a combo deck, which entails a lot of control.
you basically just freeze/clear the board till denathrius or kael or the heropower are stacked enough.
i´d say their obsession with cheap fast wincons is making control a larger issue than it had to be (i mean snowfall guardian should never have been printed, but apart from that). it´s just soo boring and dull 1 card wincons which don´t even require very specific setups or anything. you just put them in your deck and you got a strong wincon all by itself.
freezemage stalling you for 20turns doesn´t matter if you could armor/heal/silence through the skelletons - would it be fun to play against? not much, but suddenly priest/paladin/warrior all have a game against the deck instead of dying either to soem kael/brann/dneathrius bollocks or to just the herocard.
Edit: just compare that to the original OTK DH…you had to paly ~5cards in a single turn outside of specific highrolls and most of them where part of your defensive strategy, so you had to balance it out staying alive or killing your opponent. Probably one of the best decks they ever made. Just so much more to think about than current "OTK"s that just autopilot to victory mostly.
Don’t you? It just freezes the board and stalls until the combo goes off.
Are you saying because it has a win con other than fatigue it isn"t?
Not entirely. I consider it more of a combo deck with a side of control like most combo decks have. It plays cards building up its combo to kill you in 1 shot. But for arguments sake, I’d be willing to concede it as a control deck just because of all the freeze it has.
But my point is the control tools in standard right now have rendered the traditional board based classes (rogue, warrior, paladin, and demon hunter) USELESS in the meta.
Control is too strong and too cheap.
But why are you just singling out control? It’s not like Paladin/Rogue/Demon Hunter/Warrior are doing well against Imp Warlock.
You’d have a point if they did well against Imp Warlock and did bad against the Control decks.
But Demon Hunter’s worst matchup is Imp Warlock. Rogue/Paladin/Warrior are getting wrecked by Imp Warlock. Skele Mage and Control Shaman are not keeping those classes at bay. You’re putting all this blame on control decks and aren’t even considering aggro.
Control TOOLS. Not control decks.
What aggro deck beats spooky mage? Control shaman? I’ll wait…
What control tool is Imp Warlock using that is allowing them to demolish Warrior/Paladin/Rogue/Demon Hunter?
Face Hunter
It won’t after they fix the collateral damage bug, though.
But you know what else that deck has? Removal tools, rush, and overwhelming value with the stupid wildseeds. What kind of decks are traditionally good at removal and overwhelming value? Hmm, idk, what kind?
Again, the tools to control what the opponent can and can’t do are too good in these decks.
Wrong question.
Why don’t rogue, warrior, paladin, and demon hunter have effective control tools to clear board and remove threats?
The decks that live long enough to beat warlock can control their big boards and negate them.
Look, I am not arguing that warlock doesn’t need to be toned down, I am saying you could throw it completely out of the meta and the four classes we’re talking about still wouldn’t be playable.