To each their own on that end. I think playing the game should always result in some degree of progress. The only variations being sudden huge dopamine releasing leaps, and smaller progress. But stepping backwards is a game killer in my opinion.
agreed. stop catering to casual players. cater to your life long fanbase that helped you sell copys.
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diablo 1 was getting a king sword of haste was the ultimate hunt, it took a week to farm 1 and was very very very rewarding when found.
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diablo 2 was finishing your last set piece cause you kept getting helms to drop and finally got the boots to drop so you can have your set bonuses
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diablo 3 was all about finding 100 % affix items, sure you had the item semi fast, but you always needed it a bit better, keeping you engaged to hunt for it again and again
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diablo 4 is so streamlined casual now, what is the hunt and thrill in this RPG/Looter ??? the ubers are traded, the max rolls come ez, and now they want to cherry pick a items affixes right after it drops ?? no hunting anymore just give give give ???
games are fun because theres a challenge, a goal to achieve when the Real World isnt as easy as that. you come home from your 40 hour work week and thereās something you can do unwind your brain from work for a few hours a night if you want. if everything was given to you within 1 day of season launch you would stop playing the season 1 week laterā¦ donāt cater to these players. POE never did, it always favored long time players and thatās what keeps there fan/playerbase solid and consistent every season
I feel like the developers should start labelling their ingame systems with a difficulty level:
- Easy to achieve
- better to avoid
- kiss your resources and nerves goodbye for the season
Its quite obvious, and I am not pointing fingers at anyone in this thread, that some players are not very interested in the progression aspect of the game and refuse to accept that some things are intended to cost loads of time.
Attitude seems: If it exists, then it is standard to have and it must be attainable soon because why else is it in front of my eyes?
I see this in the discussion about gem quantity and how trading is awesome because you can skip ARPG-defining parts of the game.
Dont get me wrong, I am fully on board with calling Tempering, for example, a mess of a system in its current state. But the developers seem to be open to get everyone satisfied (which is simply not possible) and it worries me a lot that they may be thinking about implementing death blows to Diablo 4 for people who dont want to play this genre.
I love Diablo 2, but I would argue Diablo 2 is actually more casual than D4 as far as RNG goes in its current state. I can literally just force farm a griffins at pindle and get it before I can get a perfect tempered 3ga. I would say thatās about on an equal footing for power.
I could likely force farm an enigma at Trav before a perfect tempered 3ga.
I think what would put them on par is to have some sort of elongated quest line that allows you to untemper an item.
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Idk how I feel about the Tempering system yet, Iāve only leveled up 2 characters so far this season, and Iām having a blast, because I havenāt started pushing for real yet. Braindead tempers are like water off of teflon: doesnāt affect me. Disappointing & ominous, but no impact on my grind.
But since all the topics on the subject get flooded by sloganeering & adjectives, I canāt tell if this has been suggested yet: In a Tempering cycle you get to mark one roll as a āfallbackā placeholder. You get only 1 such placeholder in the totality of rolls for that item & canāt reassign it - and you only get to āuseā it during that same Tempering session (so if you back out of the Tempering window or you get disconnected, you lose it). The placeholder becomes available to you after your final roll, by giving you the option to switch back to it before you exit the panel, and it obv only replaces the affix it was āassignedā to. This way, youāre forced to fully temper your item, and you still get to settle on a sub-par affix in most cases - it just gets to be an affix thatās got some utility to your build, in a category where it matters.
For the luckier/unluckier ones who want to risk a higher roll on a useful affix, it gives them a safety net that makes the loot grind IMO more meaningful not less.
An item not turning out as good as you hoped is not stepping backwards though. You are neither better or worse off than you were before finding that item.
A step backward would be if you lost an equipped item.
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It most certainly does not ruin casual solo play. It has improved greatly, and the changes have it possible for solo casuals (like me) to start enjoying parts of the game that we have not experienced before, like Helltides. Personally, Iām having a ball!
Right, I was responding to the idea that there should be a chance to destroy the item completely while attempting an upgrade. I think thatās a bad idea.
what a load of nonsense. straight up lie.
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Iām on the fence tbh.
I think what I find frustrating is getting the same tempering affix back to back repeatedly. Iād rather it swap every time (even if it goes back and forth between just 2 affixes).
That said-Iā started this season friday after a friend convinced me to give it a go. I finished it in 1 dayā¦.Iāve cleared all the 200 bosses and done pit at a high enough level at this point considering I still have plenty of upgrade options/missing affixes on gear, and cleared most of said stuff before touching master working. I have 0 3 GAās and only had 1 item with 2.
Because of above Iām not sure how much adjusting they absolutely need to do.
Thereās no seasonal mechanic so I feel not easily/reasonably being able to do 200 pit is intentional. Iām not sure that is the right call, but weāll see.
A GA is a max roll every time and honestly Iāll admit 3ās are rare but they are obtainable. LE for example has a range on T6-7 though admittedly getting desired affixes isnāt as rng heavy.
Hopefully there is a happy medium for people but Iām sure both sides of the fence will continue to argue. I do prefer LE still tbh, the changes here are fine, but as expected not sure they are enough personally speaking.
Had the game shipped closer to this it def would have held my interests longer.
Is it though? If you roll a useful bonus for your build do you roll again just because there is one that is just a little better or do you remain happy with what you got?
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Dude, RNG is loot. Whether or not the player drops a rare item. And not
6 layers of rng!
The first is whether the player has the correct tempering skills. The second and third are whether the correct skills came at a high or low value.
The fourth, fifth and sixth layer is whether when upgrading in masterworking, the biggest upgrade every 4 levels was for the correct affix or not.
This is not fun. Itās just another way that the devs of this game found for the player to waste time and a lot of money in the game.
Canāt take this post, or the accompanying mindset, seriously.
First off, you didnāt bother to describe what āhelped you sell copysā means. Obviously D4 was marketed to a non-ARPG audience, in addition to the core Diablo audience. Itās about as mainstreamed & accessible a title as exists out thereā¦ itās also in the āeasiestā rung of the modern ARPG, in terms of steepness of learning curve, complexity of systems, etc. Diablo games always have been. Thatās their secret sauce: hidden complexity where tryhards look for it, but accessible to ppl who play with one hand in a Doritos bag.
Secondā¦ D2 was about āfinishing your last set pieceā? Kekw. And one of your main gripes with D4 is āthe ubers are tradedā? What? You and I are remembering very different versions of D2 indeed.
Either that or you didnāt put a lot of thought into your post, and are just emoting.
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But again, on this topic as a whole: very few, if any, specifics; a metric ton of generalizations & whining. We can do better.
Edit: frankly, idk why weāre boosting the OP, itās about as meaningless & uninformative a cryfest as Iāve seen in these parts. All fuzzy burbling & no useful info.
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Lol your very first post on the forums, is demanding we stop thinking critically???
BOOOOOOOO.
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He clearly played only D3. Itās a perk of D3 players to come up with something that didnāt exist and present it as a fact.
And btw D3 had loot hunt? LMAO
please explain to us how one can āroll better by skillā.
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I just want them to remove core things out of the game that make me want to break my expensive computer because I just had ābad luckā after grinding for hours on end.
Itās fine to have some gambling and rng elements in the game. Just donāt put it behind the biggest most important feature to advancing your character build. This is the deepest Diablo game for fleshing out builds. So no I donāt want to roll a piece of gear over and over for ice shards when Iām a frozen orb sorceress.
I want more RNG myself. What Class and Build we play when creating a character but we only find out while playing. Random Paragons.
Iād play it.
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pre season to s3 i was able to cobble together bis set ups for most of my builds maybe 40 hours after 100.
s4? 90 hours after 100 on one char and i have ZERO decently rolled items: not one of them is even worth master working either.
rest of you must be super lucky b/c i sure as hell am not.
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I imagine most people are trading for gear and getting goldā¦ from somewhereā¦
I play SSF and yeah, good gear is very very very rareā¦ I guess as it should be. But yeah.
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