Again… the game is best when it leverages just killing enemies… I could spam Eridu/Demise before the nerf for hours and it felt better than running a few NM dungeons now… No one plays Diablo for the questing mechanics…
8 Likes
I think it’s the opposite, the pits feels a bit unique each time to me, but the objectives are just anti fun and there’s not many variations in idea. Find thing. Click on thing/maybe bring it to other thing. Or be forced to kill everything.
Also there’s variety, like I said before Chaos and WSK felt very diff from each other so do ancient tunnels etc. Objectives don’t mean good. Objectives in this case mean bad. I don’t know anyone that looks forward to Dungeon Objectives not a single person.
7 Likes
The point being the meaningless side requirements are silly and repetitive. Not the monster killing.
14 Likes
Rifts were better. There, I said it.
IMO the problem with these “objectives” is it’s annoying and just a pointless time sink. Pick up a rock and backtrack down an empty hall. This isn’t gameplay. It’s not fun. It’s not engaging. It’s a waste of time and this philosophy permeates the entire game.
It also doesn’t let me just get in the zone of the combat rhythm. I like in other ARPGs I can just fight monsters and get into the cadence of my class. It’s like D4 designed a good core combat loop then decided the best thing to do was add tons of menial, tedious, repetitive stuff so you can never really experience it for more than a minute.
19 Likes
I mean, how can we bring feeling into this? If we are staying objective then doing Pits is always the same.
I understand that the objectives arent fun for you, they arent my highlight either, but getting rid of them would make the game not only more repetitive, but also more pointless. D2 has shown how this works, 99% of the game was worthless eventually, the only thing that mattered were elites and bosses. There was no need for dungeons, no need for any maps, all of them were simply ignored.
1 Like
Exactly. There’s a rhythm you get into that makes ARPG’s fun. Add in some interesting itemization to give players something to chase and different builds to tinker around with to break things up occasionally and that’s the foundation of any good ARPG.
They did get the core gameplay right, which is probably the most challenging… But pretty much everything else needs work… so you can enjoy what they did right more…
2 Likes
Because it’s not the same thing. Right now we pop a key, get to the dungeon, run to the objectives, kill things on the way, miss one of them, run back to it, find the exit too early, finish the objectives, get back to the exit, do new objectives with backtrack again, finish the dungeon, exit the dungeon, vendor everything. Then you can do all that again. It’s a short cycle of roughly 10 to 30mn.
Now compare that to : get to a place, clean it, get to another place, clean it, do that as many times as you want, vendor inbetween. It’s not “door, monster, loot” for nothing : that’s the heart of the game, to go somewhere, kill everything and loot. Objectives are just a waste of time. Anything that makes you stop for anything else than looting is lost time, and backtracking shouldn’t happen because you can’t progress further.
You know something is effed up when you find yourself trapped in a room with things to kill that grants you no xp and no loot. In a Diablo game. I remember full afternoons on my WW barbarian in D3 running specific area of Act 3. It was blissfull, hours of running straight to the next area, killing everything on my path. No “bring back that McGuffin” or “kill everything to open that door”. My rythm dictated my run. It had indoor areas, outdoors areas, bosses, big packs of mobs, elites. I can’t do more than 4 to 5 keys in D4 because it’s boring. And it’s only been a few weeks, and i still have levels to grind. I played D3 for at least ten thousand hours. I don’t see myself put many more hours in D4, in its current state.
11 Likes
Trust me … After a few beers the dungeons change … :o… It’s the quest not the location. In combat its the same location … but everything change … don’t blink!
1 Like
I am fed up with the game I been playing since it came out waiting for years to play next version till 3 after that its horrible! I will not get Diablo ever again!
2 Likes
The dungeons are fine when going for aspects or renown etc, but for Nightmare, the way they work breaks down. We are mostly there for Glyph xp.
I prefer the Greater Rift system from D3 for Nightmare Dungeons.
4 Likes
Who are these ppl that defend the current objectives? What in gods name do you enjoy about them? They are idiotic and completely kills the momentum and gameplay.
15 Likes
Yeah, I rather do rifts and grifts than this. Get rid of all the chores and let us kill mobs! Keep them for regular dungeons. It’s cool to go through once, but not fun at all when you’re doing end game.
4 Likes
Yea lol. I also found this counter to… almost every RPG ever…
1 Like
Especially when some classes are designed with builder/spenders or CD’s.
The mob density is too irratic, you fight one pack and build up energy to have and use your spender once and all the mobs fall over then run a marathon to find the next loosely placed tiny group of mob while your fury ticks down.
Sorcs with big CDs holding it for a big pack for a big hit of dopamine to never see one throughout the dungeon, the entire flow of the dungeon just feels bad.
1 Like
Something pedestal, something animus. I can’t stand it either.
The problem isn’t so much the objectives, as it is the way they’re done.
Clear to the center to find the pedestals.
Clear to the NW corner, grab the thingy, run back through the now empty NW area, back through the already cleared center
Repeat for the SE corner
Repeat for the SW corner
Then you can move on.
They need to be more linear and not make you constantly backtrack.
3 Likes
I think we just need much more variety. Fill the bar should definitely be one of the options. Also, we need some true randomization of the dungeon floor plans. I am getting tired of the familiarity.
Bowser in the first Mario Bros is a more exciting boss than any of the D4 NM dungeon bosses. And it was immediately evident from the beta, when we go down that first dungeon, I thought: "This better be the “mom test” boss, or this game is going to be boring. Aaaand…it’s boring.
5 Likes
Getting to that 70 level am coming to the forums because like everyone else its getting very grindish. Agree what is wrong with not only dungeons but the whole game. They did what I call Warcraft 3’ed it. Warcraft 2, perfection. Simple, fun, not complicated. They got Warcraft 3 and made this over complicated graphically appealing game.
Diablo 3 - loved it, too many hours played, too many seasons played, Could run GR 90, 100 speeds, just for a bit of gear all day and happy to do it. We make D4… yep, lets over complicate it!!!
There is things from the older versions that are transferred over under different titles and they work.
Then there is a sit around a board room table with a random problem and give me a new and innovative solution. And of those solutions, some are clever but in practice they are just lost on the game and as others have said the feel.
Dungeons are a great example from D3. Simple. In town, start key, move forward killing, beat the timer, reward, level gems putting in 5 levels. Out into the town, sell up and repair. Rinse and repeat, the higher your paragon, the easier it got.
D4, quests, difficulty to find the dungeon in the first place!!! No flow. Complicated key system, complicated gem level system. 1 random item at the end no matter your level.
I am really sorry for the people that have genuinely put their heart and sole into coming up with these ideas, but fundamentally Diablo isnt Wow, and the KISS system needed to apply. Can only hope there is some solutions coming forward.
Still playing but concerned.
2 Likes
Yeah I really really don’t like the extra tasks like playing hide n seek with blocks to put on pedestals. Get rid of all that stuff please and let me rush boss. Increase boss loot table. Get better items.