After finally getting my tyreal’s I did a pit 70 with plenty of time left (but not that fast) and a slowish Infernal horde on T4.
All I can say at the moment is, I don’t recommend using mage/warrior/golem glyphs and warriors just never do damage, even mendeln proc’s from them are much much lower then mage/golem… I just have 8 of them but that is sacrificing my amulet aspect (which I know is worse) but at least I get the fantasy of lots of minions.
I won’t be playing the mendeln meta regardless, as I just can’t bring myself to sacrifising my “fantasy choices” for efficiency
I’m playing with minion count on amulet too and I view it as fine, with the +1 to skirmisher as well you can even 15 count on minions which is 45% from node and 15 minions for mendeln procs. Damage yeah it’s heavy crit scaling based so you don’t use the warrior/mage/golem glyph, you instead use ones like the crit damage scaler and others with multiple multipliers or stacking damage buffs so even warriors will actually be doing good mendeln procs, it’s just the big golem one gets ahead of that so it stands out.
Mythic wise, you get a tossup in choice adding 1 in, you can go harlequins, tyreals, OR what might be the strongest is the 2h sword, but that’s a heavy back and forth debate. Sword is a MASSIVE double multiplier boost from it hitting both a big damage booster and crit damage booster, tyreals is straight raw defense boost, and harlequins being a mix between defense boost with raw % reduction and the skills level boosting things like your curses or ulti.
yeah I went 15 minions for the RP and i will not change it EVER! its class!
I won’t be scaling crit for mendeln I will continue scaling my minions and my mendeln will get some of the bonus. I am aware this is a huge self nerf but I want to see what my minions can do using the tools they gave us. Its more of a “prove a point” move more then anything.
I even have grandfather in my stash rather then use it because I don’t want to just boost mendeln.
I am interested in trying the new passive armour at some point, but for that I will need lots of res on my gear and a very specific setup. This is season of trial and error for me, im not bothered about the mendeln meta (like usual LOL).
I guess we could have way better Minions if things like Minion Armor / All Res in the glyphs are changed to one additional damage multiplier each - at least it would be nice to see this for the Skeletons.
I also don’t understand why Warrior Mastery does have the least Bonus at all - that would suggest, they do the most damage.
I mean, they are sure fine for leveling but endgame…well…for Mendeln procs with all the buffs I can add on top right now…Mages with 6! points less in Mastery for me, do at least 2x the Mendeln procs, probably even 3x.
Also I do hope for the next Addon, that they give us 1-2 more item sockets (shoulder plates, belts + putting the Occult Dominion into Masteries like we talked about it already - > 3/3 adds +3…after that 6/3 + 4 and so on), so we can add some more aspects and one item to also using offensive aspects and tempering like the gloves. Kind of compensation for using a 2H weapon.
if im honest the damage from minions + mendeln is all wrong, mendeln needs a big nerf and minions need a big buff.
Mendeln is giving minions mythic unique level power, turning a basically non viable T4 build into viable. power needs to go back to the minions and mendeln could then be reduced.
Also I am not comparing minion necro power to spirit born which is obviously 20 times better, im just looking at the discrepancy between mendeln damage and minion auto hits.
But as long as Minions don’t big numbers with even put much effort in it, I am fine with this “workaround”, so at least we can play T3 and T4, but you are right - I would also like for example Mendeln “only” add max. a 2-3x, but stronger Minions in generell.
Btw. - Just made a small test…when you use Soulrift and the also wear fists of fate + blood moon breaches and shoot some Blight onto the targets, Reapers can proc up to 18M - I sacrificed the Mages for a better overview, so I guess with the addition Kalan’s bonus this should get up to like 20-25M. Hm…now I need to find out, if the Aspect that gives Shadow Damage to the Warriors is better than Aspect of Reanimation, but my guess is no. Too bad, we only have the juwelier there to test and the stash. I like to have the Occultist and Blacksmith as well inside the testing grounds.
Or maybe I will use Aspect of the Damned…sounds strong in theory.
Yes, I thought about testing Great Feast, but Reanimation seems to be the better solution - even with using Soulrift, you would need to have a ton of Essence and if it is not adding more to the table than Reanimation it is not worth it for me.
Hm…did they removed the aspect where Mages empower the Warriors to Deal Shadow damage? I cannot find it in my codex anymore.
Playing a bit around for now I saw up to 175M Mendeln procs for the Golem and up to 26M for the Mages.
Yes, did that…now I found the Aspect, but as I right now use a lot of unquies and two Mythics, I probably swap it to Metamorphosis again to better survive.
For now the highest damage possible for me so far is:
Using Soulrift + some shadow buffs + Fueled by Death/Blood Getters + Curse + Blight
The Golem Glyph for example is better than for example Deadraiser - at least when you wear Grandfather, because that the extra ~ 70-80% more Golem Damage results in ~1200% Golem Damage.
Highest numbers I saw when everything used to buff and Soulrift active =>
Golem up to 230M
Mages up to 37M
Flesh Eater and for Example Elite Damage and Damage overall from the Board around the Essence Glyph is missing yet, though - so I expect maybe those numbers to double or something like that - we will see.
Too bad, that Lucky Hit does not work for our Minions with the Fists giving a ton.
So I guess, it is way more constant to put on the old gloves with Frenzied Dead for I only have sub 39% Minion Attackspeed and those also give + 700 Armor (otherwise I only have 7xx @ T3) and also Metamorphosis back onto the boots, because as far as I saw, Aphotic did not increase the Warrior’s damage significantly.
Yeah I also feel like a unique shouldn’t be so impactfull in bringing the build to a competitive level of damage. No unique gives such power to skills, they just change how skills work. Minions and their aspects should bring that damage by them self, and than add mendeln that gives them the aoe and a bit of more damage. Now Mendeln went from fun meme item, to mandatory to bring the build to a useful state.
oh just to be clear, I will take this state over season 5 or season 0-3, I am just saying I would prefer minions being the bulk of our damage and the ring providing something akin to a a fair bit more then a standard aspect. But I am not saying (and with you here) that we should have the ring nerfed without any compensation to minion damage in general.
So a new 800iL MW GF gives insane amount of damage like I thought - saw Macros latest Stream.
Up to 2.78B for the Golem, but it is sad to see the downside of this not be good enough for leveling Glyphs to 100, because the rest of the Army is not making enough. While at Pit T80, he managed to clear all within around 6 minutes or so, Pit T89 was way too hard and after like 2-3 deaths it was impossible to beat in time. To beat T89 - 100, I assume the Skeletons would need to hit for like 20-50M constantly instead of 0.x to 5M on average.
So if you consider a build is S-Tier when capable of doing Pit T100+, we are still “only A-Tier” - way better than it was in S5, but still.
Probably it would be possible if our Minions would also inherit Lucky Hit and you use a nice MW Fists of Fate with 70%+ Lucky Hit Chance and 300%.
Maybe boost the % for HBC and Skeletal Masteries would help - as well like to replace the second glyph bonus with a multiplier like we see with the Golem’s glyph and also to increase the 5 point bonus as well.
It would be great if almost all content would be manageable without depending on like 1-2 items and maybe the Ring of Mendeln or GF would give you another 5-10 Tiers on top each or so - maybe one day.
Oh don’t get me wrong I don’t want the ring to be nerfed. But less of a must have to make the build do formidable damage. That means skeletons(mainly warriors) need huge buff to their base damage, mages a little bit more than now.
Here’s the actual elephant in the room about current mendeln state. Above posters think it’s too strong for a unique or build making (although plenty of uniques “make a build possible”, look at spiritborn’s requirements), but the reality is, mendeln is only making minion necro even able to attempt content, and barely scraping in A tier, that’s all. Just like everything else, spiritborn is still 10X ahead in every regard, and mendeln requires such complete focus just to scrape by and still barely be A tier.
End of the day, the solution I said in this thread is the REAL fix to this whole situation. You make mendeln look at only the damage number the minions will do on hit after all of their multipliers and such, then scale based off of that with mendeln being a higher % scale off of that. With this you fix the balance of the minions damage themselves, and that will buff and go right along with mendeln anyways. That is the fix, because with mendeln functioning like that, its balance is PURELY based off of the balance of the minions themselves because all it would look at is their on hit damage after everything and scale further off of that, nothing else.
In this setup, if mendeln output is too low, it means the minions output is too low, and if it was doing spiritborn level output, it would mean minions are doing spiritborn level output, simple as that. This setup means blizzard is doing what they should, and balancing the minions output to ensure they are always fully viable every season, as they should be, mendeln “balance” becomes irrelevant by itself at that point, because it’s just then tied to the minion balance without any further fuss.
