Another condescending topic from someone trying to feel superior. Yes, build and skills matter. But the game is severely unbalanced, and there are many bugs. People are lucking into better classes and builds and then acting like they’re good at the game. You’re not. Get over it.
The scaling is not done well"."
This game was thrown together by a skeleton crew using chatGPT after the Blizzcon Massacre.
100% agree OP. Level scaling deniers are the flat earthers of the video game world.
Really the only things in the game that are difficult are NM dungeons (50+ or of way higher level than you) and Echo of Lilith. There are a few Stronghold bosses that can be a bit tricky if you go in under leveled. The areas of the world with a minimum mob level can obviously be difficult if you go in under leveled. The Capstone dungeons can be difficult if you go in under leveled (or maybe certain classes/builds may struggle more vs. some of the content) and entering WT3 and WT4 can be a bit more difficult if you are underleveled at their minimum level (53 and 73 I believe). Everything else? Pretty easy.
Which I feel like maybe is an issue in these games on a whole, no? The monster mechanics usually aren’t that complex (if you kite around mobs it is very difficult for them to hit you) so they have to throw these more complex special abilities or affixes at you to make that difficult but in that case it can make it annoying or too difficult (things you have to dodge, things that can stun you, extra mob health, extra mob speed or one shot damage).
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Level scaling is so bad that from most of the game there is no challenge at all and playing is mind numbing AND THEN at some point depending on your class/build. You become weaker everytime you level up, in my case it was around level 70 as a WW Barb.
(And yes, i am 100 now with 13 days of playtime and have both killed lilith and completed 90ish NM’s before i uninstalled)
The endgame is unplayable for most builds (its way worse for sorcs and barbs) and a mind numbing experience during leveling BECAUSE OF SCALING. How would anyone defend this is beyond me.
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Wow you completely missed the issue of why people dont like Level Scaling, and frankly it’s kinda laughable that there’s 31 people who liked your post because you dont provide even a shred of evidence to back your claim or even really a solid argument.
Level scaling does make you weaker by comparison to the mobs at your level conditionally. It is just false to think that if you were to not add skill points, new gear, reroll gear, upgrade gear, or add paragon points that just the power level would remain constant by courtesy of a level up by both the monster and the character you’re playing. It is at least pre 70 incredibly easy to overcome the difference between series of levels if you’ve played action rpgs and understand the mechanics at even an elementary level. This however does not change the actual problem people have with level scaling.
The real problem people have with monsters scaling to their level has nothing to do with being able to clear content. Everything that scales in this game is the easy content of the game, in fact the only content that I’d venture to say even requires “skill” does not scale at all. NM dungeons, Uber Lilith, and I guess we can include World Bosses do not scale.
If there’s a problem I have with level scaling, it would be that it keeps scaling all the way through to 95… and there’s never really a part inside the open world where you can go back to and tell you’ve become stronger. It is an action role playing game a shift of power becomes necessary for the player to believe they are progressing. Diablo III did actually have level scaling to some degree by the way, the mobs do increase in level as you level up in the zone, but the difficulty of that mob will not continue to increase nor will their level passed a certain point. The way Diablo games in the past made difficulty was by tuning mobs to be harder in different difficulty settings which have been majorly over simplified and made fairly irrelevant in Diablo IV. Torment 1 - Torment XVI in Diablo III which used to be Monster Power (originally normal-nightmare-hell-inferno) is a vast array where monsters had ~138k times as much health as they did in normal by the time you get to Torment XVI. Not only that but Elite Monsters and Champion packs gained more affixes per each difficulty you climbed in early on in D3 Vanilla. This maybe more difficulties than necessary, I think most people would say it is but at least it provides a very tangible reward for when your character is improving.
In Diablo IV theres only one difficulty if were being honest with ourselves. Well maybe two. World I and World II (worthless) basically are the same thing they are 1-50, World Tier III is 50+ and has a very minimal change in monster power. World Tier IV is just 70+ (but for any decent player youre in there by 60 even in HC unless youre on a really underpowered build). There are some slight changes to World Tier IV like longer CC duration and extra damage but overall the mobs do not have a significantly stronger array of abilities or a power jump that is enormous enough to have to overcome a significant difficulty change. The level difference between the mobs and the players can provide a difficulty simply because you will take more damage and do less damage to higher level mobs.
In a sense the only difference between World Tiers is almost literally just their level - this makes it very monotonous, especially with legendary affixes being fairly bland you almost never see a major increase in power where you go from struggling to facerolling even if its just for a little bit. This in part is a good thing because the things like set bonuses in Diablo III were out of control on the amount of power but like all Devs the reaction to criticism of a subject by toning it up or down waaaaaaaay past what people will enjoy like they only have Vol 1 or 10 on their stereos. Diablo II felt amazing in how well it rewarded gear progression and Diablo IV doesnt reward it enough, Diablo III rewarded it too much. I haven’t played Diablo I in a long time but I remember it having more impactful drops than Diablo IV does.
Drops, Unchallenging mobs, Lack of Rewards for the small unscaled parts of the game that are challenging, have put Diablo IV in a spot where I as someone who had enough hours on monk alone in D3 to literally have my hour counter reset only be able to play Diablo IV in sessions of I got on my Rogue played one nightmare dungeon, swapped to my sorc played another got bored, quit. I will play Season I out of some sense of tribalism I guess, Im not quite sure.
PS… Im not totally against level scaling, I think it does have benefits, it just is way too far reaching its implications are laughable… I honestly was so disappointed when I realized mobs scaled to your level versus you even in your team leaders game at a completely different level. Can you understand why it feels weird to a level 100 fighting the same mob as a level 70 that maybe it does feel like youre not getting stronger per level when the level 70 (THAT CAN HAVE THE SAME EXACT GEAR) is killing that same monster just as fast. When I bought this game I was under the impression that the mobs would scale with me in single player but obviously if I brought someone into my game they would be fighting the same mob as I am… No we are literally fighting our own versions of that mob at different levels thats whack on the face of it. There’s no way around the fact that de-value’s leveling.
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No, you are.
Summary
more characters for the no life try hard
Level scaling doesnt ruin games, just ask world of warcraft how everyone is now interested in outdoor content its so popular !!! they also especially love going back 1 or 2 expansions and having to spend 3 minutes killing a single mob when they are farming for old stuff because going back and wrecking stuff and being OP was not fun at all, NOBODY (and we have witnesses- Facts From blizzard) liked that !
Its the bestest Ever! And Thats mostly Because you say so and what you say must be right, huh.
…Not really…that is the big problem.
Because of scaling. Design the world properly (i.e. without scaling) and balance comes naturally.
Here’s a story to help illustrate just one of many aspects of why level scaling fails. This example illustrates how it destroys immersion and sensible world design, which is only one of many aspects related to level scaling.
Farmer Joe has a problem with wolves on his farm. He’s competent enough he can go and fight a single wolf by himself because on their own they aren’t really too much to deal with. Still a bit of a challenge, mind you, but achievable for Joe by himself.
Now along comes Gigachad McGodslayer, rocking armor and weapons that let him stand toe to toe with the gods themselves. He offers to help Joe with his wolf problem. Chad swings his sword and… it doesn’t one shot the wolf.
This implies that the wolf is powerful enough to face a godslayer. How then does it make any sense that Farmer Joe would ever have even the faintest, most remote chance of ever standing against even a single wolf that can survive being hit by someone decked in gear used to fight gods? Because that’s what we’re supposed to believe is possible with level scaling.
Level scaling is dog water
Why does that even remotely matter? Who cares if you can go back and kill level 5 enemies in 1 shot. I used to fight with 5 years olds in school when i was 5 and if i went back and fought them now it wouldn’t make me feel more powerful and fulfilled with life.
Also you can literally do what you want. Go craft a level 5 sigil as a level 70+ and watch the enemies evaporate. Or put the WT to 1-3. Watch how much you’ve progressed since then. This is not a problem with the game.
Yes you do. You said it yourself. Going into WT4 at level 60 is a challenge and then when you catch up with levels and gear it becomes faceroll.
No i don’t understand because it’s not a problem. If you got lucky and found really strong items at level 70 of course the level 70 enemies will die as quick as when you’re level 100 and have full paragon. This is a loot based game.
It’s just the same as killing the same enemies from level 10 in diablo 3 at level 70 in rifts and GRs. We felt stronger then and we feel stronger now at level 100 in diablo 4.
This isn’t an issue either. It just makes it less boring for someone carrying you. Plus if you bring a level 100 into your WT3 game he will be fighting level 53s and feeling SUPER POWERFUL.
Because that’s how you convey progression to the player. It’s become obvious over the past month that there’s people who understand what RPGs are supposed to be and there are people who think ARPGs should just be hack and slash games with zero story or sense of progression.
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You can literally just turn your WT to 1-3 and watch how far you’ve progressed in power. You get more powerful with better rolled items, Paragon, Tweaking paragon boards and your player skills and passive skills. You’re constantly making yourself more powerful from 1-100.
I really don’t understand what you’re upset about.
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That’s because you don’t understand what level scaling does, what ARPGs are. You’re part of the crowd I was referring to that thinks D4 is a hack and slash game.
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I think it could be even simpler. Like how Grim Dawn did it.
Just make every area fanning out from the starting area a set range of levels. This encourages you to move on, but at the same time allows for some grinding if you want to make things a little easier for you.
One thing I like about many ARPGs is the ability to basically select your own difficulty by either grinding for ‘easy mode’ or rushing ahead for ‘hard mode’.
But basically every bethesda game has level scaling and you level up, Get skill points, Smith and upgrade items and eventually get so overpowered you have to put the difficulty up to make the enemies harder. But they still scale with your level.
No, they don’t. When you’re level 80, you go back to the area around Whiterun and the enemies are still spawning level 1-20. Just like it did when you walked into that area at the start of the game.
All you’ve done is show you don’t know what level scaling is.
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This I can agree with. I tried to do a companion build for my druid and it was a disaster. Once I switched to Earth Skill then Pulverize build, the whole game became dramatically easier.
That’s probably one of, if not my biggest, complaint about D4. They claimed it would be like D3 where you can play how you want. It’s not even remotely that. Other than when I was deep into raiding with WoW from BC - MoP, this is pretty much the first time with a game I had to research builds instead of figuring one out on my own. That’s a problem they need to address.
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