Please put on our feet

Sorry, no TLDR.

I’d like to try to show you, (some of) the newcomers who have just come here in the last months, why the reactions of us, veterans, when reading some of what you write.

Put Ploot. Add LGTBIQ+ elements. Allow host to kick players. Nerf Baal runs. Remove enigma.

Dudes, this is D2(+LoD). The point is bringing back the classic experience. Doing that kills the classic experience. You can prefer different things. That’s legit. Even some of your ideas could make the game better, but the point is not a better game, it’s getting back this game. An important part of this is the nostalgia component, and you can’t understand it. Also, many things you think that are good changes have big consequences you don’t have the experience and knowledge enough in order to evaluate (no, removing Enigma is not that easy, it won’t bring more diversity, will just make everyone run a Sorc).

This was the Blizzard response to people asking to play this game again on 27 inch monitors, modern OSs (the ones with Windows Smartscreen), and without having to issue a slash command in order to talk with a friend.

Some of us have been here forever asking for a successor to D2, battling the intruders who came with D3 treating us like intruders ourselves (LOL) who have been here forever, and finally, after 20 years, when we’re finally about to get the game that we’ve been dreaming about for 2 decades, people who suddenly came out of nowhere and will also leave as fast as they came, starts putting themselves first.

You really have no idea how infuriating, childish, and egoist is acting that way. You have no idea what’s waiting 20 years. 2 f*ing decades until you get something that you can only get through a specific company and only if having luck enough of several planets aligning, just to get hit by a stampede of people who didn’t care. And, to add salt to the wound, being this the second time in a row this happens, cause something similar happened with D3.

I say childish because of looking at a game you don’t care about, that you know that’s not what you want, buying it, and pretending to transform it in a different thing. Do you buy a motorbike and complain because it doesn’t have 4 wheels?

I say egoist because there were people who was here way before you. Blizzard targeted them (us) specifically. The goal of the project is very clear and it’s the answer to those people asking for it for ages. Lets face It, you will be soon back to your Call of Duty or whatever flavour of the month is out there. Pretending to take the game from us when we finally had it at the reach of our hands is cruel and heartbreaking. Why not going out and looking for the million videogames out there instead of trying to ruin this one. Seriously, why do you feel in the need of annoy us? Why do you enjoy making other people upset?

And I say infuriating because you all will vanish as fast as you came, and we’re the ones who will stay here to “enjoy” the wreckage that you will leave behind. How to answer to someone that says “I’ve paid the game like you, so I have the same rights to give my feedback, and we’re more”. Something like foreigner medieval age armies kicking you from your ancestral home.

All I ask you for is a little respect, put on our feet, be aware where you are, who are you talking to and what we have been to go through until getting here. Wait for release, check the game, try to enjoy it, and if you feel you’re having fun with it, congratulations and be welcome to our community.

Thanks for reading.

EDIT: phone correction trolling.

104 Likes

Good post OP, and agree with your sentiment.
Problem is, the people you’re addressing don’t care.
They don’t care what we want, how long we waited, and most likely
never even played any Diablo game but D3.
Many are selfish trolls, who’s only job is to stir things up, and
try to wreck this game, just like they have been doing with D3 since 2012.
Some of the people on this forum don’t play any Diablo game, and haven’t
in a while, but are posters with thousands of posts.
They are forum pros, and there job is splitting the community.
I would wager a guess some of these people get paid for
what they do.

33 Likes

Very well said OP, but as LocknLoad says, they don’t care, the fact that there is just one game in existence that does not have all those things really bothers them, they won’t stop until they have changed everything and filled D2R with politics Ect, as soon as they have achieved this, as you say OP, they will move onto the next game/Movie Ect and we will be left with the ‘wreckage’ as you call it.

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I agree with the sentiment here.

Argumentatively - I understand some folks desire for modernisation and change may open the game to a newer audience that has neither the time nor patience to fully appreciate things as they were a generation ago.

Not all of the change or tweak this or that ideas have been ‘bad’ (granted there have been a ton of horrendous change posts out there) - But…and this is a big but…not for this game please developers.

Lets not change for the sake of change - even if you think that change may be for the better in the long term.

Deliver on what the original vision is intended to be. Let us truly enjoy a reskinned remaster that has but minimal QoL changes. Then, Blizzard…then listen to the areas folks (as a whole) love. Listen to the views on where folks (as a whole) wish things were different; and administer those joined views to Diablo 4’s development cycle.

In short - OP has it right.

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The funny thing is that I’ve being here at these forums forever (at first at my country ones, but once they started to die, something that happened very early, switched here many years ago), and even became one of the most active posters until being bullied by some members (name Kilometer, Avalon and Beefhammer among others). Then I started posting less because of being outnumbered by them and other D3 dudes and not liking being bashed all the time, but never left.

Then the new forums replaced the old ones sth like 2 years ago (rlly can’t remember exactly), so my post count (and everyone else) resetted, but never stopped posting here. And I’m really astonished to see people who have joined just last month (checked some profiles) outnumbering my post count by 3-to-1.

I never thought this as a competition OFC, but shows me a clear pattern of abnormal and unhealthy behaviors. People who didn’t ever care, possibly in a decade, suddenly becoming the most interested people in the world, something that can only end up one way: with a new impulse making them to instantly lose interest overnight, turning them into the new number one fan of [insert new flavour of the month here].

I’ve never gone to Call of Duty forums to ask for turning that into demonic medieval fantasy theme. Never asked to remove PvP or hardcore mode from D2 despite myself not playing them, because I respect the people enjoying that, who have been doing it for ages. Never broke into a concert ticket qeue pretending to be ahead of people who has been sleeping in the street for 2 days.

I don’t get why they can’t have that same respect.

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This, truly excellent insight into it.

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Excluding 2021, when was the last time you played D2/D2:LoD?

2020, 2019, 2018, 2017, …

I believe I haven’t skipped a single year without playing it.

Could I know why the question?

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You’re probably getting trolled, and I agree with the people you mentioned,
in D3 forums.
That place had some good posters, but what is left now is a bunch of trolls.

Apt analysis of what’s going on and how most of us who played this game on crap PCs back in 2001-2002 feel. Ploot crowd and the superposters will not understand but it’s OK, as you said, they will be gone soon enough after release.

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Remaster is great way how to improve what is already good and make it even better. I think its important to keep the core of the game untouched. Rest can be improved but its required to have good game knowledge to suggest changes.

OP, an excellent heartfelt post. I too had earlier posts suggesting this and that be changed however I now regret, due to you making a lot of sense.

In reality, I suspect there will be changes, whether good or bad to accommodate the masses about to abandon ship. Your point is well taken, the masses that will jump out and leave the wreckage for the true fans made my eyes open.

At this point, I would say ‘Just upgrade the graphics’ and leave the rest alone.

3 Likes

Maybe to the first one, depends on the implementation. Hard no on the rest.

Edit: I think I missed the point of this post actually, I thought you were really asking for those :man_facepalming:
There have been so many threads asking for it that I just assumed this one was another.

I’ve always wanted to find the Constricting Ring. In 1.09, my 2 ring was duped.

Games evolve, totally agreed. You can find the gem and make it better, also agreed.

D2 evolved into D3, or rather devolved, imo.

D2 can evolve again and be done better, totes agreed.

D4 ---->

it cannot be dropped in Diablo 2 and never was.
which is a good thing considering how overpowered that ring would be.

I’m no way against evolving the franchise, but that’s the task for D4. The point of D2R is the complete opposite, and definitely not for those without that patience.

And, inherently to that lack of patience, most of the time show an absolute lack of understanding about why some things are made a certain way and shouldn’t be changed. So many requests are limited to follow the obvious “we have a problem with A => change to B”, where “A” is the trivial problem, and “B” the trivial solution. Everyone is perfectly aware of the problem “A”, nobody needs to open our eyes and explain it, and if things were that simple, then the discussion would never exist.

The thing is that the solution “B” usually brings consequences that their flat analysis is not able to realize about. So we’re in a place of “choose your poison”, none of the solutions is perfect, so in case of choosing one, logic says that’s better to keep the experience as it was, because that’s the point of bringing back a classic.

I’ve mentioned the “nerf Enigma” thing in my OP, but another common one is PLoot: I don’t need to be told about ping stuff. It’s obvious for me and obvious for everyone. I even live very far from the closest global node, and in a peripheric zone, so copper twisted pair times were rough for me. I also don’t need to be told about ranged classes, because it’s also obvious for everyone who has played the game a single time, and I’ve played all the classes through all those years (and know that 99% of the time a ranged class can get close to the mob once it’s about to die).

The thing is that all this goes well beyond this simplistic analysis, the game has many, but especially 2 things masterfully done, which are itemization and the carrot-stick system, and touching there is like touching a castle of cards, it can all suddenly collapse. The real fun isn’t getting the stuff, it’s trying to get the stuff, and anyone who has got all the gear for free from a friend or has played late D3 can understand my point. It’s there were the carrot-stick system shows off: when you’re playing a 8-man party, you see the stuff dropping, while you have just 1/8th of getting it. Applying PLoot to that situation can cause that you can’t even see the carrot, being a severe hit to the basic fundamentals of the game. Once realizing about this, it can be countered raising the drop rates, which means another huge change, so the global change can bee too much. Will the game still feel the same after that?

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I’d like to keep the original Diablo 2 experience as well.

If they are planning on making significant changes or additions, I can only hope they decide to run two different servers… One for “classic” and one for changes. Keep both camps happy.

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Totally agreed with what you’ve been saying.

I think this is where the divide of the community is, 3 main “groups”.

Those who are heavily into d2lod/vanilla.
Those who are heavily into d2 modding scene.
Those who are here from other games and want to implement things they liked from those games.

Obviously, there’s crossover. I played d2 most of my life, 3k+ hours into d3, played poe grim dawn wolcen etc etc.

In a thing like d2r, I cannot understand why Diablo 2 resurrected needs to be anything but Diablo 2.

I like plugy, dislike pd2, medianXL, and the other mods.

We basically have D2LoD + some of plugy. I’m content with that, some might not be because they see plugy as too much, and I get that too. Just like I see all other changes as too much.

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Agree.

I’m not opposed to VV attempting to improve D2 but if they want to make significant alterations to the game (new items, skills, acts, etc.) then I’d want a new branch of the game. For instance:
D2R:Classic, D2R:LoD, D2R:Modern

The only changes I’m really in favor of to the game that have not been done would be buffing of some skills that have no real use (no nerfs!) and maybe allowing stacking in the stash inventory. Even Merc rebalancing which I’m very much in favor of I’d probably put on this “3rd realm” if more was planned.

As OP mentions the biggest importance is preservation of the feel of D2. Doesn’t mean stuff cannot be improved but that the core goal on this version is bringing back greatness to life.

1 Like