Fix the bazooka please

your post ceased to make sense at this point ;/

You nailed it; that’s just your opinion. Not more, not less. As an example, I have the exact opposite view of the build at hand. Especially in alignment to S6 this is as “Wizardy” as Wizard can be. Just my opinion; not more, not less.

This is a mental projection from your end. I am pretty certain Lex doesn’t not feel like he is wasting his time and seeing that he cleared 150s, I am pretty certain he is getting “something out of it.”. Your own incapabilities and your own mental struggles with staying clean is not an issue of the legitimate players playing Bazooka. Don’t project your own culprits on people wanting to play it legitimately and succeeding with it by telling them “they are wasting their time and they get nothing” when in reality it’s you who is wasting his time.

Read the original contribution. The numbers are in there. It’s not at 10x multiplier. Firebirds already cleared 150s in prior to the LoN Buff and the rise of Bazooka.

I’ve already extensively participated in the original discussion about Bazooka and so did Lex in here: Diablo 3 Forums

No new issues nor new thoughts, mechanics or suggestions have been made in comparison to the discussion that already has been held. Besides the generic QQing there is no new information or perspectives within this very thread. Don’t get me wrong, there is new people voicing strong adversarial opinions, but there are no new perspectives being shared. This discussion was already held and you can read the results. I suggest Nev can sweep in and close this discussion, specifically because this is not a PTR specific discussion (nothing that can be tested) and hence should be held either in the Wizard Forums or in General Discussion.

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Why do you think so? What you disagree with? Bird did 150 around 11 mins i guess, “bazooka 2.0” with no lon rings do it in 6 mins on the top. Both, trash and boss killers got an upgrades. But timer cant be faster, cause of mechanics of build works and teamplay in high grs. Double-triple weaker bazooka just must do 2-3 extra meteors and thats all

Or you talking about i am no need that much nerf? I dont wanna touch party players. I dont need them to be unhappy xD
Thats their fun. And their balance. Just get a little less OP as i think would be ok

Why can’t people get this? You guys complained and moaned about twister wiz when this is about 10x as cancerous and they fixed that, why have they let bazooka and hell even thorns necro go on for this long? Laziness.

Fix these two things, tone down chants or else bring everything up to and we can finally look at a decently balanced game. Till that happens there’s like no point in theorycrafting other builds or getting new sets with juicy 1.5x multipliers because you’d need a 10x to compete with those builds, they are bad for the game, period!!

Like It’s so sad us wizards have 3 other sets and with 2 new crafted buffed ones added I should be excited right? I’m not because I know they’ll fall so behind Vyr’s/chants and LoN Starpact it’s not even funny. The mitigation of Vyrs and the damage of reverse archon Starpact just make everything else not even worth it.

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I thought about your words. Build of s6 was one of my alltime favorites. And it somewhere between bazooka and curren 2-ele chantodo. But that build wasnt based on exploit mechanics. Yes, it was stronger cause of multiplied archon stacks. But all mechanics worked as they should do. ANd that build wasnt that tanky, have some mobility. Wasnt used with macro. You know, bazooka are that ultra specialized thing. It looks like an instrument, that thrown away any functions except damage dealing. Thats why i feel it like some “piece of build”, not a whole. It feels like part of group play, not autonomous one.

Problem is that s6 build coldnt did 150 solo. Now we see the limit. And the limit is bazooka. Thats sad as for me. All we can expect now is other stuff will upgrade to be able get 150 and wizard will die as compete class

Tell me please: if it wizardly as the wizard can be, why i mainly can see great all time pushers with vyr? Almost all good solo-pushers (include youself btw) plays vyrs? Top bazooka guys are from that sort of players, who will push with anything that deals damage, or no big-ambition guys who just did it fast and not has big interest in solo ladder at all.

As i say, im not interesting in what guys do in 150s. I told mainly about solo and inside-class-balance. For me 4ppl mode are not compete anymore. All 1-150 grs is farm only. Blizz killed it and i dont know why people are happy. Imo, game became meaningless in that aspect. Became “cyrcle run” with no goal anymore in 4 ppl mode. Ppl just create fun for themselves with that condition of game instead of developers. To be honest, i’d be glad if they nerf and balanced all builds. For me gr’s number is nothing. Compete is more important. Ofc they will not do that

That is so, but… Lex has viewers. They respect him. They are know him like a fair player. They are his motivation, his pleasure. He can do his best and he will be cool anyway if it would be high or not so. He will get his pleasure. But if you just a player, nobody gives a s-t about how fair are you. If you are 100% unfair but 1st, you are the Man. If you are not, nobody cares about how you play. I mean, you cant be equal to cheaters, cause your result will be 100% less with same, ot even more time spent. That is sux, man. These days people can laugh on you for handmade bountys… ANd i can say that about myself. For me that part of game is serious, more than it should be. And i know that i spend a lot time for nothing. Nobody cares abot how fair i am.

Ofc bird do it before. Man, i no even need any calculations. Look.
Fucczang was best with 130 in solo with bird (7200 para)
Now we have 142 on 4700 para with huuuuuge margin. Rift wasnt even a half that good that it can be. i guess he easily can do 144. 144 is 9x in compare to 130. And i bet, 150 is doable in noseason with “bazooka 2.0”. So it isnt 10x only if it bigger. I agree, it can be bigger. just double fazula stacks gives 7x damage

And if game would works correct, we would have only 4x multiplier from fazula and thats all ( i mean reverse bazooka)

totally disagree. It is about build, that will be possible on live servers with new patch permanently. As i said, one-season op build is funny, permanent op build is sux. ANd also, if vyrs will got strong enough to do equals, it will be sad too

Once again, you are complaining about what “top players” are doing with 4700 paragon and cheats. You also complain about cheaters having an easier time gearing and playing the build. These are not reasons to nerf the build they are using.

Legit players are able to play this build. Your problem is with CHEATERS and infinite paragon levels. This conversation is continuing to go around and around for way too long.

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You are missing a key point. Blizzard explicitly stated that they would revisit this build if it killed build diversity. Simple inspection of the leaderboard proves that this is the case. Given this fact in combination with the widespread use of macros to run this build, this build should be nerfed. Killing build diversity should be a death blow in of itself that is exacerbated further by the frequency of cheaters who play this build.

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By the way, can you please show me any OTHER class that HAS builds diversity?

Think again do solo bazooka killed wiz diversity??

Solo bazooka : 142-143+ (havent checked whether any higher has been cleared) ofc its done with lon buff in s17. LoD next patch cost additional leg gem. Even with NS top 10k para doenst really make up for the loss.

Solo vyr: 145. Yes the clear cheesed on illusionist nightmare. But next patch vyr got buffed too with karini/squirts /crimson. It will be tankier and deals more damage at no cost to dps leg gems. No one really tested high tiers (145-150) how stable squirts proc is.

Wiz likely to have 2 builds tie at extreme tier pushings. Name another class that has this diversity. Nerfing sp solo just pigeon hole players into reverse archon vyr chantodo with double pylon necklaces.

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My problem never was cheaters and this time is it? No, thats not cheaters, that imbalance. And also it is very very cheater friendly build, cause it is most hard gearing thing wizard ever had and macro gives a lot of benefit. But first is imbalance.Similiar builds was in game but not lon, so its harder gear than twister talvyrs for example

It was perfect before. Bazooka is delicious in party, weaker in solo. Now its just no funny

Celtic, can you please share link to vid of 145? Its hard to find that China stuff -_-

Btw i no see any benefits for vyrs in upcomnig patch. Crimson against fazula = not obvious about profit. Needs to be tested well. Squirts are very unfriendly to high gr pushing cause of its mechanics. And dont forget, we already have powefull vyrs build (double element LouLou’s), that colud do +1-2 grs in compare to classic. I doubt alot about new patch benefits for vyr on high grs. And bazooka obviously will do 150 if vyrs did 145. No any doubt about it. Even with no bott

Dude, yeah the Vyr/Tal Twister Archon build back from S6 was awesome and yes it’s one of the very few builds you can actually really compare to the current Bazooka build and overall gameplay.

While the Bazooka build mechanics are not anywhere near as “intended” so wasn’t the S6 build. They both dont/didnt work as they should.
As you mentioned it had archon stacks working as separate multipliers however also not intended were:

  • twisters stacking into a corner
  • twister sword being nerfed to “up to a maximum of 8” not working (was still limitless stacking as in the previous season 5)

So in that regard there were 3 major flaws combined in the build.
However it was all nerfed / fixed right after Season 6.

The highest GR clears you cannot really compare those 2. It was now 3 years ago and back then the highest GR clears were much lower. Season 6 actually standed out for a really long time because of how “exploity” the build overall was.
If it was still around right now it would probably easily clear 150 as well (Ranslors folly being a x4 multiplier, Tal Rasha getting several dmg buffs since then,…)

Bazooka makes use of several multipliers that are not intended to work together (namely Deathwish and Etched sigil with all Archon multipliers)
All fine but to be quite honest also wouldve needed a fix before season 17 started.
That’s the only issue I have with Bazooka actually. Since it really destroys diversity.

And yeah it’s kinda cluncky to play and doesnt have the same mobility.
Anyway it’s fun for a season or two but in the grand scheme of things it shouldnt have stayed mainly for diversity reasons.
However the game is probably just too old and has not enough people taking care of it properly…

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Man, its very pleasant to know that somebody’s opinion is similiar to my. I just started to feel some doubt about if i am right or just cry like a baby. Btw your 132 is super good on your para, and such players like you is one of reasons why i want it to be nerfed. Good player should have possibility to get high with skill and patience.

Twister fix was sux, cause we got not just fixed twister, we got killed twister. Now we should use it only in open maps, or we get them disappear, cause they stack in corners anyway, and that is totally cra.p. Ability that never can be used in any goals except pulling the mobs

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If we started bringing precedents let me remind you about spirit barrage LoN WD. I believe it is more close to Bazooka than twister wiz (that according your description was clean bug abuse because the item didn’t work as intended). Like bazooka, it’s using initially unintended skills/items combination and needs complicated gameplay (or macro) to make it shine.

After some forum dramas like we have here about bazooka we got that response: Diablo 3 Forums

There’s a lot of great discussion and a ton of build sharing going on around Legacy of Nightmares builds for the Witch Doctor that focus on the interaction between Spirit Barrage (Phantasms) and several pet-oriented Legendary powers. It’s wonderful to see such constructive conversation and information sharing as various community members explore the strengths and intricacies of this emergent gameplay.

There has also been some concern that this interaction will be nerfed. We wanted to share our thoughts on this today and reassure the Witch Doctor community that, at this time, we have no intentions to make changes to Spirit Barrage (Phantasms) or its currently existing interactions with items such as Mask of Jeram, Ring of Emptiness or The Barber.
While this is somewhat inconsistent philosophically from the changes that we’ve made in the past regarding this skill and rune combination, we looked at the situation objectively and asked ourselves a couple questions:

  • Is it fun?
  • Is it balanced?

Ultimately, we’ve decided that the answer to both of these questions is yes, and there is much higher risk in adjusting the balance of this skill or the other items than there is to let the community continue to enjoy this fun and unique build. We will continue monitoring its performance, of course, and we’re prepared to make any changes if something extreme arises. In the meantime, please continue to theorycraft and Spirit Barrage to your heart’s content!

So, it’s still alive, but was overpowered by FB wd (not for long) and FB wiz.

I suppose that is more proper way fixing questionable builds instead of nerfing/killing here and there, but we probably not in position bringing other OP builds now before GR150 cap removed or added something else to apply all those possible new builds powers.

well yes, I agree on all points.
the power of bazooka as you said is at a point where the cap of 150 is just obsolete. The disparity is too big. I’m pretty sure it would be capable of 160+ so like I said before we’re at a point where also the cap plays a role.

So it doesnt matter all that much that FB Starpact did 150 even before bazooka was discovered.
How should it be possible to close the gap in buffing all other classes / sets / supporting legs to ridiculous numbers to even come close?

So the better solution this time would be to go back like it was after S6. Yes it all got nerfed and yes afterwards the highest GR clears were not as high as they used to be in S6.
What would be the problem when top 4man groups actually would struggle again to clear a GR150?

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I asked them, they answered “i dont wanna do lower grifts, are you kiddin? No fkin way! Its regress!” I dunno, people like to rotate wheel like a hamster. Somebody can say: “it still a compete”. And i say: no, its a big difference, if you try to wash the dishes fast or climb the Everest. Now 4ppl just compete in how fast they do what they can do fast. But true compete is get beyond the limit, not speedrun.

Btw, i need to remind us all. First in s6 we had good chantodo-bird. Than appears most awful ugly thing i saw - “bum bird”. And after it, twisters was like a gift, like a way to left all the “bums” behind xD

Sweet memories

I think you should keep this build as it is. But they should give us other options.
Also, I hate the idea of ​​competing for “time,” so I would like this cap of 150 removed.

You still don’t understand, that game is multidimensional. Only small part of us players really serious about leaderboards here. Some players looking for cosmetics most of the time. Some mostly compete in challenge rifts. Some just hanging around with friends. Some concentrated around getting perfect gear (and personally I’m in that camp most of the time). Some compete hard at season start and then drop the game before next season. Some just getting paragon without any prospect of using it. Some playing just story mode. And some, like you, pushing solo. I have friends in all these camps and I do understand that finding cosmic wings for some of my friends is not less important than making wiz no.1 for you, for example. I suspect that maybe you have really restricted circle of players to communicate with, so you believe that pushing solo leaderboard is all that game about.

And one more example: our group is casual, we don’t have much time to play. Note that bazooka in group needs different and really good teamplay compared to previous 4players and learning that also needs time and dedication. In that season we just got to more or less stable closing 150s, leveling main gems/ caldesanns.

And here come you, calling us hamsters and wanting throw us 10 grift levels back to old boring meta, so you can compete with your vyr, because your beliefs don’t let you play bazooka. Don’t you see how elitist and arrogant that looks like for us?

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The issue is, it scales infinately with density because Black Hole Spellsteal and Wave of Force Arcane Attunement stacks infinately. If they put a limit like max 50 stacks, then it would not be as powerful.

Worst way to change the situation.

  1. thats good, not bad. Such mechanics are fun and interesting. Limit will make them boring and stupid. They already killed fire blades.

  2. we are talkin about in class balance here. And nerf of these abilities will touch most of builds, so balance will not be changed

https://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDI0MjAyMzgyMA==.html?spm=a2h3j.8428770.3416059.1

Here you go. He used single cold element. So your double element should be stronger than his version.

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