Don’t Nerf for one basic reason: The game is fun this way. The main goal does not need to be balance. It needs to be fun. The current power of Chantodo’s is fun and compelling game play. The PTR barb is actually fun. Games are supposed to be fun.
My 2 cents.
46 Likes
Right on! I wish I had more than 1 heart to give you. Well said and well worth a nickel! 
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I think they should simply change the Chantodo dmg to 3,500dmg per stack with stacks increasing to 25. will give slight bonus increase of dmg then it is now at least.
You could be right I am not a numbers man, but at the stage this game is in it’s life span I think all classes should have a end game solo build even the poor Witch Doctors, what could it hurt, after all the game is 7 years old?
I expect there will be another Diablo sequel coming eventually, why not give all classes a shot at GR 150 solo in D3, instead of 1 or maybe 2 classes as it stands right now? Who could say no to that? Why would anyone even care?
That’s my Canadian 2 cents 
, I know it isn’t worth much but I think it would make almost everyone happy that is still playing the game in 2019.
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'We don’t like nerfing anything’.
Everyone has seen this in B&W (Or Blue on deep cyan whatever).
Most of us have the impression that every set will be raised in whatever the term ‘balance’ actually means.
So un-nerfing the wizard and leaving the barbarian alone makes sense seeing they are raising the others anyway? The rift differences between the classes across the board are not big enough for a storm in a teacup. They are both pretty close. In the Asia region, they hit 150 in the metas before Chantodo’s was changed last season anyway.
A lot of people will be disappointed (understatement) if they nerf the Barb before it is at least given the same opportunity Chantodo’s /VYR was.
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And where are the limits of such fun? If any class solo can rofl stomp 150 solo in 2-3 min will be that fun to you? Maybe not but it could be for someone else. What else to do in this game if not grinding paragon and better gear? But then what 's the purpose of that if the most valuable and hardest to achieve target in D3 atm - GR 150 would be devaluated to the level of being a pushover for any noob player? Now at least people have to get a party for 150 and you must have some brains for that believe me.
You say that nerfing barbs will remove fun from them but why? If barbs would do 137 instead of 140 will that hurt you in some way and take away the fun?
There must be at least some resemblance of balance in any game.
VyrChantodo was OP and deserved the nerfs (though maybe not that harsh).
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If the new WW Barb is as powerful as the current live Vyr/Chant Wiz, they should just use that as the benchmark and slowly tweak everything to reach that level, one set for each class at a time if they need to, starting with the lowest performing from last patch.
It’s odd to nerf something, only to make something else just as powerful as it was, all in the same patch too. lolwut?
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BOOM - Thread winner. 
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Just wanna add that its also odd of them to nerf chantodo when starpact is so much stronger than it lol
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I hope this actually holds some weight in their decision. Even if it is a little OP.
It seems like an overwhelming majority either want, or at least have nothing against keeping it as is. Around the few forums I’ve read at least.
I’m going to play it regardless next season, I’m used to playing an underdog class. So any improvements will simply be a welcomed surprise.
At the very least, every cosmetic goody next season is one I don’t have yet, so that combined with the season theme, and new toys to play with has me pumped for it.
If they leave the Barb alone…
BEST SEASON EVER!!!
Yeah, another brain fart.
It’s like when they nerfed Inarius/Mirinae shortly after the Necro’s release. Trag’Oul’s Blood Lancer was stronger, but they had to kill Bonestorm. Particularly sore about that one. Spent a rediculous amount of hoarded mats to craft and augment the full build.
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Interesting thing on the first post and the last few.
In the past as soon as something in the game was the dreaded “F-word”; FUN it was going to get nerferd.
The classic team has actually done several things that have been the opposite. LoN/LoD as a major one (Which I actually think was a bad idea, but others like it and have FUN with it). Making Chantodo not actually suck as another. Lastly recent Seasonal Themes that actually have an impact on your game play (and dare I say added FUN for most).
Pretty much none of these would have happened under the old regime.
I consider fun being able to play any class within a reasonable power range.
It sounds like you agree that the current PTR barb and pre-nerf wizard cause imbalance. I wonder how this might affect the “fun” of players who prefer the other 5 classes.
Edit to avoid bumping
@TuneOut,
You may want to check the graphs that show the era 11 balance across the top 1000 of the leaderboard. There is an outlier and you may want to double check class that had the lowest greater rift efficiency.
We don’t know each other, yet we both obviously interpreted what they meant by raising the bar of every set and not wanting to nerf.
If that is their intent, the weeks after Blizzcon will tell the tale.
Yes i hear you and my sentiments exactly.
I prefer to believe that they are onto it enough to realise that the scores by people that used their non-season characters to get the really high scores do not represent the average seasonal player.
I hear that too. A challenge is always a rewarding thing when we succeed.
Cheers
Here we go again. Man that spams numbers, not knowing anything.
Barbarian did a 140 with 10k paragon points. Let’s check non season characters.
Everyone except for monk is at 139-140.
The only classes not there are Barbarians and Monks.
Now people cry out cause Barbarians finally got up to the other classes.
Yeah I wonder how fun the other classes can have when Barbarians finally came up to their level… It sucks not having 2 other classes being underdogs huh?
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The game is what 6-7 years old now? It’s currently be run by Blizz’s ‘classic games’ division… it’s best days are well behind us, and if Diablo 4 is announces this Blizzcon like everyone seems to expect, then who gives a f*** if someone is FINALLY able to solo 150? I’m not saying anyone with 2k paragon, level 25 gems and no augments should be able to walk through it… but someone who’s invest 4-5 years have 6-7k paragon and whose gear really has no more room for improvement, at this point in the game should have a fighting chance. I don’t know why group players are so hell bent on crapping on the solo play aspect of the game… not everyone wants to bother (or doesn’t have time, or doesn’t enjoy that type of play) with meta groups
You are certainly entitled to your opinion, especially on the thread you started, but if you watched the BLUE posts over the last six months, this goes against what has been said.
The big’ determiner is exactly what ‘balance’ means because many people have different interpretations of this.
I think they mean equality in all sets, where every set is capable of achieving the same goals.
I actually disagree with you because by the time they have completed all the new sets for each class there will be 35 sets (7 classes.), so if they are not balanced, it is silly to be relegated to one or two sets out of 35.
I don’t understand the “Starpact never got nerfed so PTR barb shouldn’t either”.
WW Rend Barb is spin to win, it is easy to gear for and very easy to play and PTR version is OP.
Starpact is harder to gear for and is insane to play. Yes Necro thorns got a nerf and I imagine Starpact may get a nerf in the future but the point is people are not running Starpact Wizards just for gem ups or paragon farming.
With Vyr’s Chantodo’s everyone who wanted to compete in S17 and S18 ran one simply for paragon and gem ups even when they have no interested in a Wizard.
And if PTR WW Rend Barb goes live then every S19 player that wants to compete will do the same, roll a barb when they may never want to play barb.
Blizz’s goal should make builds balanced so they don’t force competitive play to use a build but the disparity between Vyr’s and all other builds was so big that most player ran a Vyr’s and the same will be true for S19 with a WW Rend Barb unless they slightly nerf it.
Okay let’s take it from the start shall we?
The highest Barbarian clear is from a player with 10k paragon points at 140.
Prenerf, the Wizard vyr did a 144 with 6k paragon points.
Every other class on non season is at 139-140 except for Monks.
You talk about nerf to Barbarians which was brought up to the same level as all other classes…
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Everyone says ww barb should be nerfed for balance reasons yet theres a build spawning bosses in 4 player 150s in less than 4 minutes.
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In order to maintain balance you have to have a mixture of nerfs and buffs. The endless cycle of buffing only does more harm than good. What it does is cause more power creep. Set and skill A of class X too strong just buff the rest of the skills of all classes till they are as strong as skill A of Class X. But what happens is that you will have a new skill that is buffed just a bit higher. Then rinse and repeat the cycle all over again.
Now the right way to do it would be to set a bar of performance. Then set either one skill or a group of skills that can reach that bar. Then look at the rest of the skills from all classes. Any that are over performing get nerfed and the rest get buffed. The nerfing and buffing are all based on the bar that is set.
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