⭐ DIABLO IV - Feedback Collection Thread

General Discussion
245

I think an easy way to work it out would be to go with the highest you want in Attack and Defence.

If Max End Game gear has Attack of say 2000 and we think that the current level cap is 40, than at 40 items are all in the 1950 to 2000 range, 39 - has a range of 1900 - 1950, 38 has 1850 - 1900 and so on always with just a little overlap so at level 1 we start with something like 5 - 50. I don’t think any weapon would have a 0 Attack.

Defence could be worked out at say 50% of Attack so you will always do damage.

Before anyone jumps all over this and says that’s always half my hit points or health, that’s where affixes and leganary effects come in to mixup the difference, some tanky builds will only take 20% per hit, glass cannon builds my have a chance to be one shot or 75% in one hit.

And by end game I think this is where Sets start so they should be at this Level Cap, no more than 10-20% or each of the next tier of items then as we pick up our first top end legendary items the range can go up the same 10-20% so as to keep the over all numbers as low as possible.

This is far from a perfect option but more of an idea that will be easier to work with and with proper handling with keep power creep at bay.

Yes this is what is done in D2 I’m not a fanboy but it looks like the best option at least make it so the best combinations work with white items, and keeping another item type viable.
If that means white items have 3-4 sockets and other items only have 2 all the better.
You can still make the basic Runes work as they are now with 1 of each, but in a white item it could open up more possible combinations, without the stat bonus will it be something better for your build?

Wow I think that person did a thesis on Diablo, way to much for me to take in, but a very hand thing to show the Devs.

246

Yea i also suggest, opening more sockets, down the rarities
Rare, leg: 2
Magic: 3
Normal: 4
Something like that

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247

Yes because Magic and Rare items already have stats and affixes thats what makes them good in the first place.
One think I have not noticed many people say is that the yet to be named Leg Affix item can be added to any Non Leg and below.
From what I have seen it’s always added to a Rare.

We will be introducing a new type of consumable item (which we haven’t yet named). This item would be earned by killing monsters, just like other items. It would have one random Legendary affix on it, drops only in the late endgame, and can be used to apply that affix to any non-Legendary item.

I am reading that to also mean items that are above Legendary.
So White and Blue can have this added affix, will this make multi socket White or Blue Items to powerful?

248

It is ofc, possible to add it to normals and magics but yet, they didnt say anything about, making normals and magics viable
Like with more slots or higher stat rolls (magic)
If itemization is truly balanced, this will be an awesome loot experience

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249

Would love to see whites and blues become viable again other than just crafting mats…d2 definitely did this well by making sockets and eth whites. Makes the loot hunt pool wider. Instead of searching for one or two specific item types, eth whites were important as well. Hope we aee something along these lines with d4

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250

sharing this post regarding different item types…

251

Please give us some kind of UI customization. Just something as simple as being able better track my buffs on screen. One of biggest UI gripes with D3 is trying to keep track of the chaos on screen and glance at the tiny buff bar on top of the little action buttons at the same time.

252

You should add Rhykkers feedback video to your list

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253

I enjoyed Rhykker’s feedback but one thing stuck out hard for me. When he brought up the Attack and Defense values, Rhykker mentioned weapon speed and… weapon range. I agree with the entire point he makes, but I personally really need the role playing function of the weapons and armor to be on point. Having a dagger have the same speed or range as a 2-hand mace is absurd. It dilutes the RPG aspect for an oversimplified mechanic for the action side. Daggers are usually tied to higher critical strike and even critical strike damage. Having to get closer to mobs to deal more critical damage meaning more risk more reward. Or maybe you want a larger AOE effect from skills so you equip a 2-hand mace which has huge base damage compared to a dagger conventionally speaking and is slower, but offers a larger weapon range to strike more targets.

Having weapon types be considered for character builds would add more depth and player choice, while allowing Diablo 4 devs the chance to toy with these restrictions through legendary affixes on an item. Like a dagger with added weapon range, or a 2-hand mace with increasing critical strike damage with subsequent mob kills.

I’d really love Diablo 4 to also have weight to the armor, and thus affecting the speed of the character along with defensive stats. Having some 5head shed some armor value or pieces altogether for a “speed build” (think Dark Souls) is an amazing choice of depth that could be entirely possible with weight on equipment. There doesn’t have to be a weight limit, but affecting character speed or moreover character defense for tradeoffs in either direction seems like an amazing feature. Having a set convert the weight of armor into resistances, defense or health while having boots convert weight into a minor boost to speed or something similar. Just some examples for my ideas.

4 Likes
254

It was a good video, he was on point with most all of the talking points.

255

You are right there must be differences in weapon types.
But at the sametime I don’t know if in an Arpg we can expect too much on the exact physics of items.
I would love to go all out and for the people that played Pen and Paper games, Ice Law tables had Weapon versus Armour so to put it simply a Dagger has to do less damage to someone wearing Plate as they should know how to move in it and in doing so take less damage, but Crits had ways around it. A high value Crit could say. A brilliant move, you found a gap in the Armour and puncture a Lung.
The other point is true with I think a War Mattock, it’s a short version of a halberd the spike that could puncher Plate and deal more damage.
It compounds damage by using Crit Tables and I know D100 or percentile Dice are not an option here, but Crits had Puncture, Fire, Blunt even Tiny Animal attacks and many more.
A ranging from A-E, a simple and short version here.
0-20 low added damage 29-65 medium 66 some extra and an odd effect 67-99 high damage added, with 100 almost always out right kill in some gruesome way. Each of them adding a flavor text.
The A-E range on the first table was based from your Attack versus the opponents Defence giving you a total to check on the table.
So after you rolled and got your total, the table may have a few or many 0-1 damage moving up to say 2-5 and at some point 5+A crit all the way up to say 30+E Crit.
Weapons even had Fumbles but that’s even more complex.
Maybe if I have a Point here at all it’s even though I would love to see this much complexity, I don’t see it happening here, as long as it’s not to simple just for the sake of it.

Maybe a simple way to do it is Robes have no speed debuff same for basic leather but as you add bolk and weight up to say plate there is a small 2% debuff to your movespeed.
This could add a layer of itemization, if a magical Robe had high def of some type there is a small movespeed debuff -1%, in the Plate Magical properties it cancels out the Debuff of normal Plate so you have no penalty.

256

A core strength of the loot based ARPG sub-genre is that there is no end to the interesting effects and mechanics that people can imagine and thus build and expand a game with. However, the fact that people can easily conceptualize cool ideas masks the difficultly of actually implementing them in a viable way and the pitfalls that doom an itemization to not being able to.

This leads into why one of the biggest problems Blizzard has with its design philosophy, which is that using oversimplified character scaling stats to keep things easy to understand at the cost of not keeping control over the scaling and number inflation in their games kills the mathematical viability of cool ideas. Look at what happens when you remove a piece of gear from a D3 character. How are they suppose to create interesting trade-offs that can matter when losing a source of massive scaling will never be worth it?

They need to spend less focus on trying to dictate and control the options that player have and more on controlling the scaling these options have so that it creates a healthy environment for a strong ecology of items.

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257

Just opened a thread, without seeing this one here, so I am gonna post my feedback here and hope the other one gets closed:

I just read the new “System Design in Diablo VI (Part 2)” and I have to say, it is awesome and absolutely motivating, to see, that the dev team seems to be really listening to the community! The changes are good for the game, they add depth and thus CHOICES for the player and I think this is very important for the old fans to come back and play the new Diablo title and also for new fans to have a longer motivating game experience.

That being said, I think there are still things, which could be improved in the current D4:

  1. Active skills do not provide the player with choices

  • No active Skilltree:

    • Players should make choices and if the choice was not optimal, they should regret and pay for it. One possibility is an active skill tree, similar to D2, Titan Quest, Wolcen, Grim Dawn etc… and a way to respec, like paying with a level, paying with (bind on pickup) mats, dropping from certain bosses, or similar systems.

  • Cooldowns too long:

    • Given 2-3 spells with CDs longer than 5 secs and maybe a shield/more passive skill, I am already left with only a boring ressource-free or -generating skill and one other skill for most of my playtime

    • CDs longer than a few seconds generally provide you with a perfect rotation, which you have to think about once and never again

  • Not enough active skills in skillbar:

    • This is only a personal preference I have to admit, but I don’t like being forced to play with at most 6 skills at once
  1. Diminishing Return

  • In endgame, items, levels, skills etc. should increase logarithmically (or logarithmic like) in their power, such that finding perfect endgame items will not make you 30% stronger, because then people can’t play together, if they have drastically different playtimes

  • No infinite system, because also monsters should not become exponentially stronger in the endgame. This only leads to dmg numbers in the billions and brain afk grinds

  • Low droprates for endgame items
    I have become more of a casual gamer, I feel like (might change within the first weeks after D4 release though), but when I compare the feeling, when a unique in D2 drops and when a legendary in D3 drops, I have to say, I rather don’t get all the gear I want within one ladder season, than not appreciating 99% of the drops

  1. Depth in fight mechanics

  • I don’t want D4 to be like D2, but one thing, which was really good IMO was the difficulty. And it was a hard game, not because monsters had 1bio life and dealt 100k dmg per hit, but because of mechanics like

    • Hit Recovery

    • Faster Cast Rate

    • Hit Chance

    • Blockrate

    • Immune monsters (safely replaceable by very resistant monsters IMO)

    • Freeze/Chill (luckily that’s already in D4)

    • Curses/Debuffs/Bleed that are really scary (like bleeding + vulnarability in PoE, blood mana curse in D2 [get damage when spellcasting])

  • Really challenging bosses with different mechanics/abilities, which apparently has never been part of Diablo games and thus is a chance to improve a lot at this point

  • Maybe not a gameplay mechanic, but: no flashy lights, when hitting monsters (or at least make it optional, please!). Why destroying this nice graphical atmosphere with that arcade/comic effect?

  1. Still itemization
  • The new system design sounds perfect to me, the only concerning thing I have seen in the demo is, that there were a lot of skill altering suffixes on the items. These are super cool to play, but should be dealt with very carefully in endgame, because otherwise too many builds will eventually depend on specific items
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259

An idea i always had is that monsters could become stronger when they kill players (we win xp when we kill them, so they should get xp when they kill us).

This could be an insteresting thing over all for world bosses. They could get a buff or something that make them stronger per each player they kill. But it doesn’t need to be just strongger, it could give them new skills/attacks they can use to kill even more players.

Some monsters could even be created around this idea. LIke a monster that suck the souls of the players or another that possess the character and get their body (the character would die), and if we want to go back and kill them, now we would fight against our own character, with their skills, gear, etc.

1 Like
260

I wouldn’t mind a nemesis like system. So say after a while of killing goatmen, some Huge elite goatman shows up and chases you down. You can’t out run his aggro radius and have to deal with him. These would be slightly more powerful than normal champion packs or rares. Kind of like whatever it’s called on console where a monster that killed someone on your friends list shows up in your game, but associated with enemy types you deal with. They could drop a special item for killing them too. Would make playing when you are bored a bit more interesting.

4 Likes
261

This is post is a new idea for the skill tree or an addition to it.

One thing I enjoyed about Grim Dawn is the constellation tree they have. Where you can go deeper into a tree and unlock abilities that can be put onto your skills. So when you use your skill you have a chance to proc this ability.

So the idea is, since we are Nephalem (a mix of both heave and hell), what if there was a tree that had abilities that could be put on skills. This tree or map or lore looking back round has with it, new powers, that started in the middle and you could either choose to go up to unlock heavenly abilities or go down to unlock hellish abilities that you could put onto your skills.

Here’s an example:
You have a Druid with rabid bite that has a DOT (damage over time) effect that does poison damage over 2 seconds.

You go to this new tree of abilities and you cross over Andariel and in her constellation or less evil diagram or what have you, it says “all DOT effects have a chance to release a poison nova when full damage is complete (so after 2 seconds).” You decide you like this since you’re using rabid bite and want this ability on your rabid bite and put points into Andariel to unlock the ability and equip it to your skill rabid bite skill!! Dun dun dun!

So now when you hit with rabid bite and the DOT finishes you have a chance to release a poison nova! Hell yeah!

So using the lore and all the angle’s and demon’s in the game plus even Nephalem characters, like Rathma, weapons that they had like Tyreals El Druin, Deckard Cain’s texts. There can be many different abilities.

The tree could actually go three different directions then. Like a pie chart. One area for Hell, Heaven and Sanctuary. Some people may not even know half of the angle’s and demon’s and may even want to check on the lore to find out who they are, bringing them closer to the game.

Another way to look at this is when you unlock skills for your character, that skill itself has another window that opens and it’s this new chart and just that skill can unlock certain Heave, Hell or Sanctuary abilities. And it’s different for each skill. As in only certain angle’s, demon’s and human’s show up with abilities specific to that skill.

Maybe this chart/tree or what have you doesn’t unlock till near the end of the game and the only way to get points for these is to do some end game content. Maybe you could unlock all the abilities over a long period of time playing the game? Fixed amount of points? What would you call these points? Simply Heave, Hell or Sanctuary points? Paragon points? What do you guys/gals think?

Thank you for your time.

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262

Hi

Back in the early 90s I used to enjoy playing MUD games, specifically Angband (Still active today!) One of the more interesting features this game had was that every play through was different - the dungeons you traversed were randomised, and each time you went down the level increased in difficulty.

While I do like Rifts and GRs in Diablo 3, part of the problem for me is that over time you learn the maps and generally know the lay out. I think some of the elements from those MUD games could easily translate well into D4, giving it something a few players of old have asked for - endless dungeons. I appreciate that aligning GFX may be difficult if things are random, and perhaps Angband being ASCII made it work, but I am confident that Blizz could pull that off and give players a good place to grind - Endless dungeons, randomised, increasing in difficulty the deeper you go.

263

That’s a great idea you still have the % chance if it’s low, could be the best option for an infinite progress system, if done correctly only small boost in power by changing the effect of one spell/skill and it’s lore friendly.

You can maybe work it in your powers to make it more customizable, only unlocked with the correct amount of angelic, demonic or ancestral powers?
That maybe too much people are already of the mind that things are locked to them.

Instead of the Grim Dawn constellation make it the Tomes from Deckard Cain’s Library.
Then you can even link them to quests finding out more Diablo Lore as to go.
Or if you find Tomes as you level it unlocks them, but only to be used in end game. Giving more reasons to go back to older content in search of the Lost Tomes of Deckard Cain.
Linked to the achievements and so on.

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264

I do like this idea but did they not do this in vanilla d3 with the enrage timer? I mean different to an extent but similar…i am familiar with the nemesis system from Shadow of Mordor and granted it was cool to have a mob move up in ranks and some power, i just hope they would keep a leash on it, as both games had very frustrating encounters when these mobs got super powered! I do like this idea though as i would really like to see some new and different mob systems in d4…beyond the normal trash/elites/bosses

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