You know Orrion, I’m trying to think of a reply and to the best of my memory your correct! It was well done for it’s time.
Not that I want to be stubborn about it but when I have a concern, it’s not a hard stop or a I won’t play if they do this. Just a concern to monitor though the development process, so I’ll still be concerned, I’ll also acknowledge it can be done.
I just hope we will get more than one or two expansions!
You clearly dont play many games. If you have to pay to continue to play a game and reach the end then it is pay to win. I mean what idiot pays for a game and then also rents it to play and then pays again to go up in levels and get access to another area. That is very much pay to win. If you cant see that well then I dont know what to tell you.
No, that is not what pay to win means.
Pay to win means you’re paying to purchase character power.
Expansions and such do not fall under it because that’s a universal application to the gaming world.
Paying to win is a situation like the RMAH in vanilla D3, where you could spend real life money to outfit your character in gear to give you a boost over everyone else.
Your definition is wrong. That’s what I’m going to tell you.
You’re thinking of pay to play. Pay to win is just as Orrion depicted it. When the opportunity to gain an advantage over another player is enabled with real currency (as opposed to in-game or virtual currency) If you pay for a game and there is an end, then so be it. If you pay for a game that you can then use real currency to bypass the process of getting to the end - that is pay to win.
Subscription based games like WoW are pay to play. Games that release expansions as the means to release content while still generating revenue are just that. You’re purchasing a smaller version of a sequel to the game. If you don’t purchase the expansion and aren’t able to play it, but find that people who do purchase an expansion are able to play it, you shouldn’t find that they’ve got a real life currency purchased advantage over you. Primarily because they’ll usually be playing in realm of the contents expansion, whereas you would still be playing in the original realm of the game you purchased.
Paying to purchas power? You mean like higher levels? Or how about the instant level 100 for every expansion.
Your idea is wrong so we can agree to disagree.
I have a great idea. Let’s bicker on about it so that a blurred line exists and then game developers start thinking it’s okay to have pay to win aspects in the game.
sigh
“My idea” of pay to win has been the definition for years. You can search for it on this forum and the old D3 forum and find numerous mentions of it. They will all fall under the definition I’m using, and not the one you’re trying to use.
All games are pay to play. You have to buy them to play.
Of course they have an advantage over you. When you dont buy the expansion even after paying for the gamer and then renting to use it. (still dont get that but to each their own)
And now you know why you have to rent games even after you pay full price for them.
Yes it has been then way for many years but times are changing boomer. Things are changing.
If you have to pay to get to the end game then its pay to win.
The catch up feature in WoW can be considered pay to win - but let’s not distort what it actually is. The games where you have a universal resource that can be used to do things that aren’t able to be done with the regular in game acquired resources, that can then be purchased with $ fit the pay to win model.
You’re right, all games are pay to play. Games that require internet networking infrastructure also have maintenance upkeep to keep things running smoothly, thereby permitting the idea that they need to require upkeep fees associated with the costs.
By your own definition of having to pay to get to the end of the game, pay to play is equivalent to paying to win.
Nonsense.
No, it’s not.
By your definition expansion to a game is pay to win.
These are various definitions what you find when searching the term on Google:
Pay to Win is a situation in gaming (usually MMOs or Massively Multiplayer Online games) where companies allow you to buy items or advantages with real money that cannot be obtained normally by playing the game.
‘Pay to Win’ has become an infamous term in the gaming world. Users and players willing to shell out a few extra bucks to access features that are normally unlocked as the game progresses can give some serious advantage, especially in online games
" Pay to win " games are (typically freemium) video games that offer items or other gear that give buyers advantages over non-paying players in real money or make gameplay marginally more sluggish and difficult for players who do not pay in premium currency or real-world money.
(Pay to win) games are basically impossible or result in needless grinding if you don’t fork out some cold, hard, real world cash.
Pay to win is basically ability to pay cash to get access to exclusive items or abilities, unobtainable by any other reasonable means, that give clear-cut statistical advantage. This is it entirely. And truly for once, in a nutshell. Pay -2- Win isn’t a subjective or oblique term.
As you can see, the common theme is spending RL money for advantages over other gamers.
Regular expansions or game upgrades available to everyone for a set fee are not part of it. Sorry.
There is no confusing anything. It is what it is.
Another argument why games should not be online only. Thank you for supporting the need for an off line mode.
As long as we allow things like this to happen and keep going companies are gonna run rampant with things. People are already OK with renting games they already paid for. So next all game will come with monthly subs on top of paying full price for them and then the rise of piracy will come back.
Might want to check your logic there. If you have to pay to get to the end game then it is pay to win.
So your argument is what everyone else says and not your own thoughts. Ok you are dismissed.
Everything is a subjective term. You should learn that. Millions of people think some magic person lives in the sky and judges people. For many this is the absolute truth and for some laugh at them for praying to a comic book character. It is all how one sees it.
My own thoughts? Okay, how about… you’re being incredibly silly?
You don’t get to change definitions just because you’re in the wrong. What’s next, you gonna try and change the definition what an MMO or RPG is?
What are you trying to start a #MeToo movement?
I see what you did there. This gripe is really about the dead horse of an offline mode for d4 not happening, taint it?
No not really. Being off line or on line doesnt matter to me either way. If it has it or doesnt wont change how I play the game.
Nice try though.
The fact that you even said that has proven to me that there is no point in talking to you. Welcome to the block list.
Adding level cap and more powerful items makes sense if itemisation is flat like in wow. This is diablo, arpg game, and everytime you rise cap and add more powerful items, you trivialise everything else.
Key is to add value to the game, without destroying it too much. More powerful items ? Sure, but specifically buffing stuff that didn’t work, or something for your build that makes it better than before, but not like you suddenly gotta replace whole eq.
I was playing diablo 3 since release and i’ve had played over 500 hours on my first character (i though i’ve had more, but that’s what it says, maybe timer got bugged, whatever). It is lvl 60, it has almost the best items i could get at the time, very expensive. I didn’t touch it to this day as it brings kinda good memories.
I’ve started same class again after expansion and some seasons in.
After 30 hours I’ve had doubled the defensive and offensive abilities of my previous character, getting the free set from season.
It is very pathological situation for a diablo game, how could it get 30 times easier now ? This type of game is not designed to get everything right away, the chase for items kinda never ends really, if executed well. If that part is bad and you need to rise caps and everything to keep people attention, then it is bad designed arpg, and it is only postponing it’s death.
That’s funny. You’re the guy who’s been obstinate and insulting, yet the first time I do more than give you a definition and explanation you block me.
What a child.