Comment in Favor of Instancing loot and Removing Stamina Bar

Diablo II: Resurrected General Discussion
85

Personally, I am more worried about equity (ranged vs. melee) and server ping on a global server.

I rather strive for an equitable percentage. Players do not control RNG so there never a guarantee in equitable drops irrespectve of personal versus global loot.

Really. Do you play seasons and/or non-seasons? This splits the playerbase.

Clearly not to many. You may not agree with me, but many do not want global loot. The reason is valid and not “needless”.

If Blizzard decided to only have personal loot, would you be happy? I assume the answer is no. This show why having 2 options is better than 1.

86

Thank you for spending your precious time repeating to these people for the 999th time the obvious, but I’m sorry to tell you that it’s no use. I swear I’ve seen that “8*10” kid calculus everywhere on this forum, and I thought variance was taught in statistics classes after introducing the mean but it seems these people have skipped classes, unfortunately.

87

Don’t lump everyone together like that bub. I’ve been playing Diablo games since 1998 with D1. Shared loot was a fine enough concept in early D2 and LoD. You had limited space, and the concept of mules I don’t remember being as wide until LoD. You also did not have as epic uniques, sets and the 1.10 runewords. Rare items either found, gambled for, or received at quest rewards had a lot more potential than what sets, uniques, and runewords that were in the game at the time. However, with many of these additions, the concept of “shared loot” became free for all loot, and created a greed mentality rather than an actual party split mentality.

I remember actually in early LoD days getting a freaking wicked warsword somewhere in act 5. Rare, repair durability, enhanced damage, massive lightning dmg, and socketed. Took that puppy through a good portion of Hell.

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88

I did not want to discuss binomial probabilities and the like. For the forum, I did not want to get into probability theory or statistics. If you want a more sophisticated description, I can provide it.

You will notice that I wrote:

I intentionally have kept it simple and ignored the probability distribution and the variance (i.e. standard deviation) around the average. These are unnecessary complications to describe.

89

No because I want the Diablo 2 Lord of Destruction expeirence. Not some watered down baby formula version that gives everyone their own participation trophy.

and Two options is again worse because you are needlessly separating the player base.

The Game already has Three Player base splits, Ladder, Non Ladder, and Hardcore.

What you suggest would split it into 6 different games.

Ladder Global

Ladder single

Non Ladder global

Non Ladder Single

Hardcore Global

Hardcore Single

3 different separation is already a lot, 6 separations is ludicrous.

Which is again why I said Two Options is worse then one.

And Single Player loot is not acceptable because it alienates the people who want a unmolsested diablo 2 experience.

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90

Yup. The only thing I’d argue is that the game needs a good skill balance to bring up the non cookie cutter builds, but not actually change the skill’s purpose or remove/add new skills.

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91

Good thing he isn’t in charge of D2R then.

Sounds like Brevik has lost his way.

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92

It’s never pointless to discuss this stuff, the Developers believe it or not read forums, and comb over this stuff. If you let a stupid opinion go unchallenged a lot of the time the devs will think it’s a good one. If you provide logical and real reasons why the idea isn’t a good one they will take that into consideration as well.

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93

And you would still have it. Simple question: If players upon character creation were given the choice of global versus personal loot, what percentage would favor global? Is it 95%? 90% 75% 50% 25% 10% 5%?

I know that we do not know, but a guess is fine. For example, there are way more players that play softcore than hardcore. For this , my guess is 90-95% softcore.

94

It doesn’t matter if 99.99999% of the players want a single player loot system. Diablo 2 has a magic about that can’t be recaptured. Game Studios have been trying for literally two decades to capture the magic that was diablo 2. You have a magic formula you can’t explain you don’t change it.

Believe it or not games actually need things you don’t like about them sometimes. It can be the very thing that makes something unique.

If you want personal loot go play a game by yourself with a password on it.

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95

Exactly, as long as these conversations remain civil, they are good to have. It also shows the devs just how passionate and diverse the D2 fan community is (diverse as in Classic OG, LoD OG, and 1.10+ers).

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96

Actually, if the percent was that high it would matter. Blizzard would not want to disenfranchise 99.99999% of your customers to placate the 0.00001%.

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97

yes they would if they wanted to keep the magic of diablo 2 intact.

because there is a very good chance removing the global loot system would in fact make the game into something people wouldn’t want to play.

Think about it like the matrix, the robots thought that if they gave humans everything they ever wanted they would be content and happy.

But they weren’t content or happy. They were miserable and revolted against the construct. Because at the end of the day life needs some misery so you can realize just how good you have it.

“Did you know that the first Matrix was designed to be a perfect human world where none suffered, where everyone would be happy? It was a disaster. No one would accept the program. Entire crops were lost. Some believed that we lacked the programming language to describe your “perfect world”. But I believe that, as a species, human beings define their reality through misery and suffering. So the perfect world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from.”

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98

Let me ask this. With your method of either having shared loot, or personal loot optional would the same amount of drops occur if it were only one, or the other?

Example:
8 player game. All have checked shared loot. Each of you kill each end boss on every act(Andariel, Duriel, Mephisto, Diablo, Baal).
Example of drops that have value that dropped in this particular game:
Andariel - SoJ
Duriel - SoJ, Shako
Mephisto - Um Rune, Occy
Diablo - Ist Rune, Ormus’, Shako
Baal - Tyrael’s Might, Um Rune
In this example there is a total of 2xSoJ, 2xShako, 2xUm Rune, Ist Rune, Occy, Ormus’, and Tyrael’s Might. That’s a total of 10 items of value that dropped during this shared loot game.

Now, let’s try to input same 8 player game, but say instead they have checked personal loot. Would there still be the same 10 items of value that drop, but it depends on who gets it, or would each person have a chance at getting more items of value since it is personal loot?

If the shared loot, and personal loot of this example still get the same amount of items per game then it would be reasonable to have either as optional, but if personal loot allows for more loot to be dropped in total then there would be advantages for more loot if personal loot is checked. Also, it would make it to where there would be too many items of the same for trading, and nothing would be rare because everyone would have the same thing. D3’s personal loot makes it to where you find everything in the game just about within the first day of playing. D2’s shared loot makes it to where sometimes you can’t find a certain item for days, or weeks, or months, or even years. That’s what makes it fun, and unique.

So, conclusion is that in my personal opinion is to keep the loot in D2: R the same as original D2, shared loot. Although personal loot seems like a nice QoL, it strays from the preserved part of D2 looting.

99

No. Blizzard is a business. They want to sell games. Selling a fraction of the games to placate the few is bad business.

100

I wouldn’t say the “magic” about Diablo 2 was about it’s loot distribution system. Sure, you may come out with some stories about the “drop that got away” but I feel the magic of Diablo 2 is the combination of it’s atmosphere, player customizable level based skill system, customizable stat system, and the randomized items themselves with the varied affixes and randomized map layouts.

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101

Which is exactly the part you are not understanding, If diablo 2 loses it’s magic because of game breaking changes like removing Global loot it will fail.

If Diablo 2 has lost it’s magic and fails blizzard will not make money.

The Developers have finally after all these years realized that Diablo 2 had a magic about it that can’t be reproduced. Do you really think they are going to make such swathing changes as removing such a key feature as the global loot system?

They basically said in the Q&A that they are only making changes that were already possible. Shared stash is a change because we all used mules anyway. In Fact every change they have proposed so far is something that is merely a QoL change. Because they know they have to be careful not to break the magic that diablo 2 has.

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102

exactly, its how the skill tree works that is amazing imo.

id like to see a rebalancing eventually. going around vengeancing some monsters.

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103

I tried vengeance myself, but it is hard for me not to use zeal/fana as a pally. I think one of the more fun builds I played since 1.10 was a sword and board Barb using Zeal with a Passion Phase Blade. Couldn’t keep up in Hell, but was still fun in Nightmare.

104

First, all players in a game are either global loot or personal loot. You will never have the characters that differ in the loot selection (global versus personal in the same game).

In the personal loot case, the same 10 items of value would drop (assuming the same RNG). On average, personal loot players would average 1.25 good items.

This is exactly the same as global loot 10 total items where now 8 players are trying to click as quickly as possible to get more of the 10.

Lets say you have a leecher/ninja looter in a global loot game. They might on average get 4 drops, leaving only 6 drops for the other seven players. So at least one player if not more will receive no drops whatsoever.

A leecher/ninja looter in a personal loot game would not get 4 drops but average 1.25 drops, allowing those players who have integrity to have a greater share of the total drops, thereby rewarding integrity.