Alright, I’ll look forward to seeing it.
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At GR 115 if you fill up a screen with trash even at low Paragon / Gem levels, WW will kill small trash simply because 115 is not a high tier and the AD will start to work on trash. WW has the damage to chunk down low HP trash in the 110s range, regardless of your paragon.
Monster HP does matter to an extent because the D3 servers and/or their code seem very unoptimized when it comes to bleeds plus AD calculations. There are instances in the past where a PE reliant trash killer (WD and Wizard when Archon used PE) would lag in 150 but not in 140s. So monster HP totals do play a role.
So yeah the GR level and monster HP does matter. Testing on a GR 100 or even 115 is not the same.
Do your test on a GR 124 or higher and record a video then I’ll believe you. You need AD, PE, Bloodshed, and Dust Devils. Also your Rampage stacks can’t be picking anything significant up (meaning if you reach 25 Rampage stacks it means you’re killing too much trash at that tier to lock up the server).
A 115 is not a push tier for anyone. It is hard for a FB WD to create game killing lag on a 115 but they can lock up the game completely on 140.
The problem is not fixed for you or for anyone else because it is a server side issue. It currently exists for any class that uses PE and AD. DH can trigger it, WD can trigger it, and Wizard can trigger it. And Barb can just completely break game instances due to Dust Devil mechanics.
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Most players don’t experience the lag because they are not attempting a true push for there lvl or using pain enhancer+bloodshed+high area dmage and using spear to group enemies on a lvl that will get you top clear. I for one enjoy speed clears and use gogok due to lower amount of trash pulls I encounter so there is no lag ever. Go and play in any 4man group at any lvl or go and pull 3-4 screens worth of trash on a good map and your game will lock up. I guarentee it.
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I mean, if I can’t clear a 115, then it is clearly at my level for my stats/gear. If the monsters aren’t dying, I don’t know what else you expect me to do.
And I already said playing in 4 man will cause me to lag.
But I haven’t lagged in solo in a good bit.
Just because you can’t clear it doesn’t mean your damage is not enough to kill off small units of trash which is a huge part of what stresses the server; accumulating screens of trash that don’t die and add up to calculations.
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The small units of trash don’t even die.
What part of “the screen is full of monsters and density” is not making sense?
It stays full for minutes.
I understand but like I said there’s instances of PE trash killing roles that can’t lock up the server at lower tiers yet once you crank up the monster HP the problem manifests.
Examples of this are WD, Wizard, and Rapid Fire DH. Firebats WD won’t lock up at 115 4p but can crash the game at 4p 140.
Monster HP does matter, not just your damage.
Crank it up to 120-124 and see if you still don’t lag. If you have 0 stutter or server pauses at 124, then for some inexplicable reason WW performance issues don’t affect you which is what people are trying to investigate.
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Personally, I experienced the same amount of lag in the GR 100 as in the GR 124 (i.e. completely unplayable).
GR 124, btw, is the highest I can open.
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That is also my experience and that of every single other person I know who has ever pushed with WW using Dust Devils with Pain Enchancer and Area Damage enabled. That is why I’m curious because having no lock ups with WW on a push tier is completely out of the norm AFAIK.
I can’t open past 115 in case that wasn’t clear haha
Gotta remember I’m a casual solo player with low stats and what not.
Easy way around that: Hop in a game with me (when I finish building my new comp) or Arch. You roll a Zodiac WW Barb, and I’ll roll a zDPS Barb and do nothing except tank. Make sure you have PE, AD, everything enabled–including in Paragon. We’ll gather 3+ screens of density and see what happens.
I’m really curious if there’s something else going on in this scenario.
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Jako may hold the keys to running WW without lag.
No, it’s more likely that he hasn’t tested it in true push situations–proper density, proper setup, etc. I suspect he’s not pulling enough density, and if you’re not practiced with the build, you may not realize that it takes multiple screens on the right map with the right mob types to lock the game.
Remember, you can’t do it on any map, because there are only 2 maps WW can push, Festering and Battlefield, and only a select few mob types worth fighting. If you don’t get those when pushing high GRs, you won’t spawn the RG with enough time to kill it. On the other hand, if you do get those conditions, you run the risk–the guarantee–of locking the game with lag when enough density is pulled together (usually 3+ very dense screens).
@Rage,
Actual DPS = Base Stat Factor * Base Damage Factor * Crit Factor * Damage Inc. by Skills Factor * Speed Factor * Native Skill Weapon Damage % * (100% +Specific Skill %) * (100%+Elemental Damage %) *Damage to Elites Factor
So if you increase skill damage by 2X through a 6 piece class set or 2X through supporting legendaries or 2X through a base stat modifier, these are mathematically and functionally equivalent.
(1x2)x10x3=1x(10x2)x3=1x10x(3x2)=60 since commutative property of multiplication
Given this, why is it your preference to buff the “numbers” of supporting legendaries in proposal list 1 rather than the numbers in the 6-piece class sets versus the base stats? Lets assume that we are not discussing a wall-charging bug build.
Are you comfortable with the 6-piece set modifiers as is and wanted to buff supporting legendaries. This would also raise the possibility that a LoN set could replace a 6-piece set for a build (or 2). A global base stat modifier would buff all builds/skills.
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Ok so no Barb anytime soon. Understood.
while barbs are still a theme it seems noone is interested in any monk theme, even after my suggestions about it which we diskussed in german monk forum. pity. would be oh so great if at least some things could be discussed. but the only response were two troll posts of players that seem to never play monk. hopefully some of you blizz guys is at least reading it. in german forum there is still a group of monk players of first days that still continue their talk about the game and other stuff. so i’d like to hear that you read some stuff 
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I would not let it get you down. If Blizzard is introducing a new 6 piece set for each class that likely means the addition (or modification) of new supporting legendaries for the new build. They likely already have their own ideas in mind for thses sets so we will just have to wait.
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I read through it and really dig the work. The problem is that I know nothing about Monk, so I’m afraid I can’t be of assistance. I’m not sure how much Monk activity there is on these forums, but if you ask around, you might dig up some contributors.
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its absolutely welcome to see your support. for me its the other way around, i have no idea about barb play, last time i played it was a ww build most probably when lvl 60 was cap but i do play with someone who played barb (never as a supp) long time but he swapped first to crus, now he plays sorc simply because he can do 5 lvl higher with crap geat with her. i play monk solo on 120 niveau, where 118 is kind of secure sub 15 mins, for my sorc 120 is a joke and i even have bad gear on her, but max lvl is “only” a 124, which is about double dmg and massive more defense. if i’d have good gear a 127 seems to be easy.
so i hope you get some good things up and me too of course. it could be so easy, kibd of make 2 h playable, remove silly restrictions on gear and gimme the freakin dmg reduction looks like all the folks mean monk and varb is tanky, but they seem never played it solo since i feel these classes are simply bad defensive. every crift of monk so many people die so often. i even thought about playin half naked a few 45 grifts to show how easy it can be done - crifts are most of the time 45ish rsnge in about 5-7 mins, so maybe i only equip one weapon and just a ring or so 
Unfortunately since most of us don’t push Monk we don’t know its limitations as well. I think we know the general builds but not a fix for each build. So our input is limited.
I’ll keep an eye on your thread and help with the discussion as much as I can though. But the ideas will and proposals will need to come from Monk community.
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