Crescent gives you -35lr, spirit gives you +2skill, fcr, life, mana. This combo is superior to a single infinity.
If you have an ES sorc, you anyway put any extra points into mana after getting the strength you need. You will quite easily have a 3300+ mana pool. You do not need insight because your regen will be sky high with that much mana. Using insight with that is simply overkill and not needed. You do more damage with spirit+crescent.
200fcr is also just a novelty… it’s fun, sure, but the amount of damage you need to drop in favor of fcr gives you an overall similar damage output, but you have lost a lot of mana as well doing so (2x soj).
If you don’t believe me, go do different setups on maxroll gg and see for yourself.
You lose life/mana because of the high str requirement. Infinity gives you more -lr and you always have conviction where you need it. The fcr doesn’t get you a new bp. So only win are the +2, while losing the other stats.
But now you can freely choose any merc that benefits you the most. Insight a2 or plague a5. And if your merc dies, you still have conviction.
Cm is great on a Lightning sorc but just second on nova
Not crescent moon specifically but non-self infi nova sorcs in general. You can reach 200% FCR with eschuter’s or obsession. Or just stick to having 8 frame cast with greater +skills than what self infi can ever get. Which leads me onto to:
Self infi nova sorcs are going to take a long time against act bosses and to a lesser extent tanky non-lightning immunes in general. Self infi allows you to more easily sleep walk through your runs but it is slower.
That’s the safety vs DPS trade-off I’m talking about.
Another plus for self infi though is you get +FRW from it which is handy while moving about town.
Lidless is another option. The mana you get from spirit is pretty much offset against the strength requirement from spirit, except you also get +5 mana after each kill and a socket option for a facet with lidless.
Actually the op wanted to know which base for infy overall and not only for nova. Prog started the sub discussion cm vs infy. Now you are trying to undermine the statements with 200 fcr which can’t be achieved with either.
Exactly. It’s a moot discussion to be fair, but still an important one if the specific use case the OP is after is for making it for a nova sorc.
It is a factor that would lead towards deciding whether to make an infi for your merc or as a self-wield. Just trying to make this a balanced discussion so that the OP could make an informed decision. Excluding specific use cases doesn’t go towards being informative.
Using problems of the build only on a specific gear option isn’t informative too.
Example:
All nova sorcs are comparable slow on beefy single target mobs. You tried to tie it to the self infy only, while this allows you to equip your merc to be an even better tankkiller.
I like build discussions, because it allows new views and options to consider, but playing dirty to be „right“ is a waste of time.
I will say that does depend a bit on what you define as a “Nova Sorc.”
If you are doing self infinity + insight you can honestly get away with not having ES/Telekinesis and vita stack and still max Lighting/CL without CB and still have a decent single target.
Not a terrible options if you have the all resist charms and CTA for it, and want to do things like solo Baal runs mixed in with your cow/chaos farming.
Mind you TBH I’m just about tempted to just rock Infinity on Merc, and Crecent Moon + Phoenix on the sorc for redemption so I can be lazy.
Actually, it’s very responses like these I would categorise as “playing dirty” or “intellectually dishonest”.
And it’s not rocket science: self infi, while having very good -enemy light res, is a 2 hander that lacks both FCR and +skills. Notwithstanding that your Merc gets to use insight in its place, you still are going to kill slower unless you’re killing lightning immunes. Hence the survivability vs DPS tradeoff.
I really don’t understand the refusal to admit this.
Using infinity on your sorc main instead of merc is an off meta thing just for fun of it… it’s not superior in any way if you go for true min-max. You lose resistance, +skills, +life/mana. You don’t gain the strength back from not having a monach shield because in your swap you either need to carry a spirit next to your cta anyway or, you drop that for a lidless to keep the low strength and miss +1 skill to your BO.
If I go build a nova sorc based on infinity I end up on
1340 life
2975 mana
63/13/13/13 fr/cr/lr/pr
0% dr
0% fhr (can use skillers with12%, but then lose life…)
106 mana/sec (natural) 278.9 (insight)
105 fcr
-85% to light res + conviction
DPS against Diablo: 28,276
If I use CM+Spirit build I get
1329 life
3121 mana
75 on all res
8% dr from coh
55% fhr
130.1 mana/sec
110 fcr (105 bp)
-60% to light res + conviction
DPS against Diablo: 31,586
Higher damage, much better survivability.
You can of course argue using 20/5s instead of 20/17 small charms to get resistance on the Infinity build, or use Um runes/15@ jewels in the griffon/vipermagi that you need to use to get your fcr BP of 105. But that comes at a cost of damage or life. Or argue to go for fcr on rings and amu instead but man that will be expensive skill/mana wise.
Both these builds assume 85% ES, you can go for a 95% ES as well and argue you don’t need resistance, but overall difference will still be the same if either build go for 95% ES and mostly drop resistance, so it doesn’t really matter.
If you go for infinity based Nova sorc, you simply go for the looks of it. The additional ~150 mana/sec really worth it given the loss of survivability?
It’s really not rocket science to know about fcr breakpoints and that any fcr between bps is wasted. It’s also not rocket science that 2 skill points won’t make a lot of difference damage wise. It’s also not rocket science that raw damage numbers are not the same as dps when talking about clearing areas.
How is it playing dirty to call you out on a wrong statement? My guess is that you don’t play nova sorc and try to argument with theoretical numbers. But you just can’t admit that you don’t know as much as you think you do on that build
You go ahead and use enigma when you carry a 2h weapon with max strength req of 41 without any resist. Only other armor next to coh that makes a case is a vipermagi to get the fcr breakpoint.
If you use a spirit, you don’t need the fcr breakpoint from viper, coh is the better option there by far.
It’s hilarious you put enigma on a light sorc, or even consider ormus good at all on anything but a cold sorc (the % damage does nothing much, so what, +3 single skill instead of +2 all skill and extra’s?).
But, you do you. I suppose you also run around with an eschuta over hoto/CM when you go for a shield
So let me get this straight, I say something that you disagree with, and you claim that is “playing dirty”. What are you, in primary school?
If I am wrong, then prove it rather than accusing people of playing dirty. Adult 101 dude.
It’s all relative though. +2 skills matters more than -enemy lightning resists when you fight monsters that already have low lightning resistance to begin with. The opposite is true for monsters that have higher lightning resistances.
Crescent moon isn’t far off on its -enemy lightning resistance values, only 15% difference while having +2 skills more. Which is better? Depends on which mobs you are fighting.
Obsession can have up to +8 more skills than self infi, or +5 more with a 4 faceted armour. Which is better? Again, depends on which mobs you are fighting.
Not one nova sorc build is universally better than the other as you’re claiming there to be.
You won’t be disappointed if you use mancatcher and it does open some options for you.
I’d recommend use a giant thresher if you can get one but otherwise thresher or mancatcher pick what is fun. Mancatcher is fast
