In hell, there’s very little reason to pick up green set rings. To gain utility without being overpowered, I propose a set either to be changed to include a plus one to all skills on a ring set or entirely new set with drop rates similar to SoJ, BK, and Wisp Protector. By doing so, creating a set ring with plus one to all skills, it gives new purpose and changes the game to incentivize players to pick up green rings in the late game. Be honest, how often to you pick up green amulets hoping it will be the Tal’s set amulet?
2 Likes
Lol in general there are very few set pieces worth ever picking up in NL or after a month on ladder…think the only ones are tal ammy/armor early on in a season and after that maybe only gris weap and thats only worth keeping if it gets 4 soc… the real problem is besides tals and a few random pieces like trang belt or aldurs boots, the sets nearly all suck, it is way beyond just set rings. 2.4’s marginal set buffs and set upgrade recipes were a slap in the face, it changed nothing lol. Set items need to be ethereal, that would shake things up a lot more but most sets just need total rework. A ssf player would find it harder to complete their class set items than completing most half decent runewords and we all know there is no contest between the two.
I vote for a Set ring for Bulkathos 2 swords set.
And ring getting some melee stats like Deadly strike or Crushing blow or IAS.
2 Likes
No please. That would be a nerf of the Bul-Kathos set.
I have a comprehensive thread on the needed changes to sets.
Currently there are only two sets that have rings. The Angelic set, and Cathan’s Traps. I don’t have the Angelic set in my list because it’s already in a good place (and I do pick up set rings in the hopes of it being Angelic). Here is what I have for Cathan’s:
Cathan’s Traps:
One of many sets that suffer from a lack of staff mods, making the set clearly worse than using a staff you can buy from a shop. It also suffers the way many caster sets do by having stats for melee instead of actually supporting casting.
Cathan’s Traps grants +1 to Fire Skills, so it should be targeted not only at a Fire Sorceress, but also potentially a Fire Druid, or even a Fire Trap Assassin (mainly because it fits the name of the set). Because of that I think O-skills instead of Class Only Skills are the way to go. Since it’s a Level 11 set I think we should avoid any skills higher than level 12. And that means it’s not going to be overpowered to grant these O-skills. Powerwise we should be looking to make this work through Normal and very early Nightmare (though with the understanding that Fire Immunes are probably going to need to be dealt with some other way).
1: Add +3 to Blaze to Cathan’s Rule (the staff).
2: Add +3 to Warmth to Cathan’s Rule.
3: Add +3 to Fireball to Cathan’s Rule.
4: Replace +10 to Maximum Fire Damage on Cathan’s Rule with -10% Enemy Fire Resistance (This set is for Casters, you are not whacking stuff with this set).
5: Add a partial set bonus for four items to Cathan’s Rule of 10% Faster Cast.
6: Add a partial set bonus for three items to Cathan’s Visage (the helm) of +3 to Fissure.
7: Add a partial set bonus for four items to Cathan’s Visage of +3 to Cyclone armor.
8: Replace the partial set bonus for two items on Cathan’s Sigil (the amulet) with +3 to Fire Blast. (You don’t need AR since you should not be hitting stuff)
9: Add a partial set bonus for four items to Cathan’s Sigil of +3 to Shock Web. (The token non-Fire Damage).
10: Replace the 6% Life Steal on Cathan’s Seal (the ring) with +5 to Life per a kill. (Caster set, you are not hitting things).
11: Add a partial set bonus for three items to Cathan’s Seal of 10% Faster Cast. (Get us to 30% Faster Cast, an important breakpoint for a Druid).
12: Add a partial set bonus for four items to Cathan’s Seal of +3 to Wake of Fire.
13: Add a partial set bonus for four items to Cathan’s Mesh (the Body Armor) of +25% Poison Resistance.
14: Replace the Set bonus of Add 15-20 Fire Damage with +15% to Fire Skill Damage. (Again, this a Caster set, you do damage with spells).
15: Replace the Set bonus of +60 to Attack Rating with 30% Faster Attack Speed (helps with the Assassin Traps).
With this the set should be useful for Fire Sorceresses, Fire Druids, and to a lesser extent Fire Trap Assassins. However, once you get halfway through nightmare, you start having better options (even a Lore Druid Pelt is better for the Fire Druid, not to mention Flickering Flame). Tal Rasha’s set is significantly better for a Fire Sorceress than this. 15% to Fire Skill Damage sounds like a lot, but 2 points in Fire Mastery equals it, and you lose too many important slots for a Druid or a Trap Assassin to make use of it past early Nightmare. I suppose a Fire Sorceress might use this all the way through Nightmare, but Hell difficulty it’s not really viable. Blaze and Warmth are useful as utility skills, but not really for damage if you aren’t a Sorceress. Fireball, Fissure, and Wake of Fire all have the same issue of dropping off in damage without synergies. So it’s a fun way for a Druid or Sorceress to have access to other character’s Fire spells in early game play, but nothing game breaking later on.
.
This still leaves Cathan’s Traps as a set for late Normal and early Nightmare. Definitely not an end game set.
I would not object to a new set with rings aimed more at endgame. Maybe a set that contains two rings? Perhaps a three piece set that is made of two rings and a helm? Perhaps an Armet or Hydraskull? (Neither of those types of helms have a set item yet).
1 Like
Isn’t angelics rings really good early ladder?
Not that I don’t think we should buff underused sets. We should buff underused uniques and RW’s too. Hopefully buff the set/setbonuses and uniques to where they actually compete with runewords too.
1 Like
Oh god please do not buff sets to be on par with uniques. Dont let this game be anything like diablo 3.
Low Sets could use a buff to be viable Mid normal mode to late nightmare along with early runewords.
Runewords and mid stes should be a viable for mid nightmare to mid hell.
Late game runewords should stay viable but Uniques should be BIS for endgame.
I can see your point, but that wasn’t my point was for sets to beat uniques or runewords. Just that the sets in the game that aren’t used should all have some value. Sort of like how a 3piece or full tal set are both builds that people use, but they’re not BiS, just decent gear ups.
As for uniques/RWs in late game their worth should reflect their rarity IMO. But the mid/low uniques and RWs that aren’t used should be reworked to have at least some value as temps instead of everyone funneling into a few cookie cutter builds.
1 Like
Yes, early game the Angelic’s rings are good. The intent for this proposed change, is to discuss the benefits toward the end game. We should discuss how to make unidentified green rings potentially more valuable in the late game. Currently we can confidently skip green rings in the current patch because there’s no equivalent to a Tal Rasha ring. Most people pick up green Amulets because there’s a potential for it being the Tal’s amulet, we can’t say the same for set rings. That needs to change.
Errr… most best in slot endgame gear are not uniques but are runewords.
Frankly, I think perfect Rares ought to be the generic best in slot. And that should be the measure used to judge uniques and sets.
Unique items ought to be roughly the same power level as an almost perfect rare, plus at least one mod that cannot be rolled on a rare item. Basically, something you usually can’t get on that type of equipment, that’s why it’s “unique.” Sometimes that puts a unique over the top to become best in slot, sometimes it makes it a niche use item, sometimes that means it’s just a good item for your level but is later going to be replaced. Always, it should be viable and better than you can get when buying something at the shop at the same level.
Set items ought to be weaker as individual items, but when fully equipped ought to be powerful enough that you’d want to wear them for a good chunk of the game. So sets you can wear at level 2-5 should be best overall until the end of Act 2 Normal. Sets that you can put on in the teens should last till end of Normal at least, and maybe into early Nightmare. End game sets ought to be viable all the way through Hell Baal but should not be best in slot.
2 Likes
It’s true Set rings for casters suck but Angelic’s is actually really good for Physical builds due to it’s Attack rating bonus. Therefore finding one along with its Amulet(hence another Set Amulet to grab besides Tal Rasha’s), is enough to pick up Set rings. Cathan’s and the Cathan Set in general could use some rework but that would be overhauling a Set available on Classic(hence any changes you make must take that into consideration). Meaning Sackett’s suggestion of adding OSkills only works if those Skills actually exist(Druid’s/Assassins don’t exist on Classic).
If you want to look at something original/new, then the following I came up with in a different, but similar topic, may interest you. It’s an Amulet plus two rings or full Jewelry Set:
Amulet: Name TBD but I thought of Taranis’ Fury
Required Level: 70
+1 to All Skills
+20% Increased Attack Speed
Add 80-320 Lightning Damage To Attack
-20% Enemy Lightning Resistance(2 Items)
+20% Lightning Skill Damage(Full Set)
Ring#1: Name TBD but I was thinking Prometheus’ Defiance
Required Level: 70
+3-297 to Attack Rating(Based on Character level)
Adds 185-350 Fire Damage To Attack
+20% Faster Cast Rate
-20% Enemy Fire Resistance(2 Items)
+20% Fire Skill Damage(Complete Set)
Ring#2: Name TBD but perhaps Boreas’ Touch
Required Level: 70
Adds 100-250 Cold Damage To Attack
Can Not Be Frozen
Slow Target By 30%
-20% Enemy Cold Resistance(2 Items)
+20% Cold Skill Damage(3 Items)
Partial Set Bonus:
+10 to Strength(2 Items)
Complete Set Bonus:
+2 To All Skills
+10 to Strength
+30% Faster Run/Walk
All Resistance +20
All told the set yields +3 to All Skills, which is pretty competitive to Maras + 2 x SOJ/BK setup. Grants +20 to Strength with full Set(nice stat boost to any class), 20% IAS(comparable to Highlords), 20% Faster Cast Rate(2/20 Ammy + 10 FCR rings = 40 so extremely competitive), 30% Faster Run/Walk(really nice for any class), All Resistance +20(low end of Maras), CBF(which is a Ravenfrost alternative), +Attack Rating(Angelic alternative, albeit not as strong), -20% to Enemy Resistance(-40% if you dual wield one of the rings with the Amulet. Fire/Frost Maidens and Fire builds would love this) and +20% to Elemental Damage(which is approaching Griffons Territory but this is an Elite Jewelry set focused on Elemental Damage).
1 Like
You basicIcally echoed what i said. I did say rws ARE endgame but should NOT be. Uniques most def SHOULD be bis.
A GG rare is still bis for some pvp tourneys with speciific rules. Grief being banned for obvious reasons.
I think people underestimate cathans ring x2 for early melee builds as its got life steal.
Their really isnt anything to add as its low level too.
I would argue that it shouldn’t just be limited to rings. 80% of set items are awful, and on top of that the bonuses from the set are weak. And early game sets sounds nice, but in reality most of your gear will be better than sigons by the time you complete the set. Though maybe some of the lower tier sets are used for LLD or MLD? So maybe changing them isn’t the best, but the late game ones that aren’t used at all I see no reason not to buff the items or the set bonuses to at least make them a viable option.