i think it’s insane you guys are still theorycrafting… like what is going to come of all this?
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for BK adding 20-30 on a ring is wild. currently the highest affixes on rares is 9 and 4. min damage is hard to stat for so suddenly putting 20 min and 3 grand charms into a ring that already provides +1, life leech and life is insane. it would automatically become the defacto ring on melee characters, no need to bother with rares and crafting anymore.
same with CoA, already one of the best well rounded options in the game. giving it an extra socket just further pushes it as BiS for more stuff, forget 3os magic tiaras, everyone using CoA now.
same with Leviathan, its already the best dr armor in the game next to shaftstop. lets go ahead and give it crushing blow, big fire res, and even more strength and defense?
i just noticed the runeword proposals on the other page. I still think +2 on a generic shield should keep the 156 STR cost, spirit shield already balances itself that way even with the cheap runes.
giving that power to viscerataunt which is already a great mb sorc shield (72% ctb upped) and can be socketed, and making lidless wall an arguably better spirit for much lower STR req is pretty busted.
steelrends getting 100%ED and cleave is wild, they are still the goto option for people with the strength req who dont need the IAS. they don’t need that god boost.
my problem with the cube recipes is that getting 2os on rares already exists in the game and is a very sought after affix that takes up an affix roll, not a willy-nilly thing people should just be able to automatically spawn on top of a fully rolled item.
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This is good feedback and nothing is set in stone. What do you suggest we propose for the uniques you listed above if any? 
As for your other suggestions, we’re open to removing proposals if its not good. For example, I agree no to having zod grant eth flag and toning down buff to base damage for elite weapons, but argue they need a little. How about this, seems reasonable to me?..
| Weapon | Base Damage | Base Durability |
|---|---|---|
| Normal | No change | No change |
| Exceptional | +10-15% | +25% |
| Elite | +15-25% | +50% |
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I’m of the mindset to not nerf something unless we absolutely have to. In regards to Paladin Shields, they’ve had 4 Sockets for years now and nerfing them to 3 has some logic to it but the more practical thing would be to increase normal Shields(at least some of them) to have at least 4 sockets. In fact, I wouldn’t mind seeing some Shield bases, including Paladin Shields, get 5 or even 6 sockets. That way we could expand certain runewords to Shields so that they could see more use. Doom is a prime example here given Holy Freeze can only be obtained via Weapon(via Doom or Ice) and not elsewhere like Holy Fire and Holy Shock can. This means they can tap into the pulse damage “bug” that multiplies the pulse damage based on how many items yielding the aura you have equipped(hence Holy Shock doubles it while Holy Fire can triple it with HoJ + Dragon(x2)). I’m not aware of it being fixed yet so that makes Auradins quite “broken” but Holy Freeze was always the odd aura out among the three and frankly I’d love to make one but with a stronger aura(level 24 HF with effectively -80 to -120 Enemy Resistance would be dope ngl).
Other runewords that potentially could be ported to Shields would be following:
Bramble ← interesting dilemma for Poison Necro’s(use Trang’s or this?)
BotD ← odd I know but Ethereal Shields?
Call to Arms ← do we really need Weapons for it?
Eternity ← unique perks from an Ethereal Shield
Death ← CB + DS on an Ethereal Sheild…
Destruction ← all those procs + rune perks
Harmony ← Avengers anyone? Vigor doesn’t hurt either.
Obedience ← Alternative to Phoenix anyone?
Wrath ← Life Tap via Shield for non-Paladins?
2 Likes
yeah, id be pretty good with that. I feel like they aren’t currently in that much of a bad spot but with new hacked items like mosaic i guess they could use a bit of catching up.
for the uniques i think most of them are in an ok spot since rares, crafts and runewords should be the end goal for the most part and making these too strong would encroach on that. If i had to change them it would be pretty small.
BK could do ~50AR instead of stamina and it would be in a nice spot of being more usable but not BiS
ormus robes could go to 30% FCR because 20% actually is kind of clunky
leviathan would get out of hand very quickly but adding 20% FHR would be good
steelrends would be nice with 10% IAS
coa and mosers are already really good items.
i think lidless is already a good shield for what it is, an entry level caster shield with +1 that is usable on all chars. wouldn’t change it.
viscerataunt it is already good at what it is, i’m going max block and foregoing +2 but also saving STR points. changing this item and spirit just makes that an automatic easy choice every time.
gbane although niche is already a well stat’d item. it has high PLR and FHR for an armor and comes with CBF. giving it anything else kind of over does it. even with poison damage would basically give it prevent monster heal too. adding %dr or all res seems counter productive to what the armor is. i wouldn’t do anything with it. maybe some fr/w could make it more interesting without making it too strong
2 Likes
Seems fair to me, flat AR is valuable…
Bul-Kathos’ Wedding Band
Ring
Req Level: 58
+1 To All Skills
0-49 To Life (Based On Character Level)
3-5% Life Stolen Per Hit
+50 Maximum Stamina
- Buffs:
- Add +50 To Attack Rating
- Remove +50 Maximum Stamina
Seems reasonable to me…
Ormus’ Robes
Defense: 371-487
Req Level: 75
Req Strength: 77
+10-20 Defense
+20% Faster Cast Rate
+10-15% To Cold Skill Damage
+10-15% To Fire Skill Damage
+10-15% To Lightning Skill Damage
+3 To Random Sorceress Skill (Sorceress Only)
Regenerate Mana 10-15%
- Buffs:
- Change FCR to +30%
Agree we probably went overboard with Leviathan, but would still like to buff ED in addition to your 20% FHR…
Leviathan
Defense: 1514-1722
Req Level: 65
Req Strength: 174
+170-200% Enhanced Defense
+100-150 Defense
+40-50 To Strength
Damage Reduced By 15-25%
Indestructible
- Buffs:
- Add +20% Faster Hit Recovery
- Change E. Defense to +190-220%
Agree splash on Steelrend won’t work anyways, so adding 10% IAS is reasonable, but would also like a small buff to ED…
Steelrend
Defense: 232-281
Req Level: 70
Req Strength: 185
+170-210 Defense
+30-60% Enhanced Damage
+10% Chance of Crushing Blow
+15-20 To Strength
- Buffs:
- Add +10% Increased Attack Speed
- Change E. Damage to +60-90%
I see your point and we could remove these from OP. What do other people think?
For Gbane, I still think buffing +50 defense is justified while lowering required level…
The Gladiator’s Bane
Defense: 1255-1496
Req Level: 85
Req Strength: 111
+150-200% Enhanced Defense
+50 Defense
Cannot Be Frozen
30% Faster Hit Recovery
Poison Length Reduced By 50%
Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
Damage Reduced By 15-20
Magic Damage Reduced By 15-20
- Buffs:
- Change Defense to +5-495 (5 Per Clvl)
- Change Required Lvl to 75
1 Like
Now, thats the feedback we need! Thank you and welcome to the club! 
I´m with you. I think adding flat dmg was very much, but asked from some after extensive discussion. I tend to think that BK could need a little buff, it is as rare as a SOJ but not to the same extend usefull. So I would support a modest buff in exchange for the useless stamina affix. Rares and craftes rings fullfill other purposes.
I think that is really solid, not OP or displace anything! 
Think that as well. Sockets would be too much. Still it is a niche for HC now. Would support some modest buffs to increase utility.
However I would really welcome a lower lvl req. of 77 simply to make it SSF viable and provide the opportunity to use it at a normal playthrough (like with all lvl 80+ itemes).
Any idea how your would tweak it a tiny bit? Or only lowerd lvl req.?
With you, the current proposal was kind of wild. But as well I would add something here. It is as well kind of a niche item.
Could see that! Since it has an already high strength req what you can lower only a bit with a jewel and since strength is only important for melee. I could support a modest buff of the strength roll. Maybe 60-70? The +80-100 was really high. But since melee can need some love (even with the other changes) I could see this on L and thus make it more desireable and less niche?
Better option I guess. I thought 1-2 OS is not super crazy (yet strong and we discussed crazy 3 OS 
), but this would be the better choice for me as well!
For Mosers I would agree. But on PVE I think this is not showing its full potential since a lot of alternatives are really good. I would like to see something additional on this one and would preffere +1 to skills here (only AR doesn´t cut it for me tbh).
The lvl req. of 31 should not disturb pvp too much, so what do you think?
I slightly disagree. I think the current proposal is super strong, yet only for barbs an alternative (class specific would be ok for me). Beeing iconic and super cool lookinig I would like to add something to bringt it out of the HC/energy shield niche for PVE. And lower lvl req. for sure (as discribed above already).
What would you do to make it more appealing? Would be +2 to combat skills really too wild? Would it displace many other options? Cant imaginge that tbh. FRW would work I guess, but thats offered on other options so seems boring to me.
Not sure if defense is enough for me… 
Here I would like to disagree! It might be, that we need more discussion about that. But spirit now dominates too much. Both uniques have utility but are much more rare. To balance that out should be the objective to increase build diversity. Now there is only one BIS option really (Lidless is aside mid-lvl now the inferior choice even condisdered lower strength req.).
I really like the idea of haveing an important roll (skills) on this one. So +2 is a must to be found (with +1 nobodys is even bothers). I really do like the idea of adding and solving a lot of you mana issues. Even for maybe end game (would really love to test the combo of new lidless and new Que-Hegan’s Wisdom)!
Would agree if we keep the FCR at +20 that would be good (considered a nerfed Spirit RW even with a lower req. Hyperion with 4 OS alternative)?
I could agree on keeping +1 all skills. But would like to see something else here. The +5-10% lightning skill dmg (option of an additional 5/5 facett) could be used by other chars as well. Rest is not crazy for lvl 28 (compared to spirit and lidless).
But lets dicuss. What do others think?
Support this. Only IAS doesn´t cut it (although not super bad already, still very niche, especially with the very high req.). Pairs nicely with a new Leviathan (but not OP in my opinion).
I´m kind of in the same boot but spirit is just too good for too little. Offering a 4 OS Hyperion as an alternativ brings it closer to what pallys can do, but still it washes away soooooo many other uniques, that it just would need to buff soo much that the games getting even more and too easy.
If we erase the option to use the normal and exceptional pally shields and starting with a Sacred Targe just lifts the lvl req. sucessfully to lvl 47 for the ST (that is still really early for the power lvl it provides).
For everything below 4 OS we buffed Splendor to fill the gap better without beeing wild (even if we primarily had a necro head focus tbh):
For all your other proposal I would need more time to evaluate but think that this would be complex and a lot of work with a high risk to mess up. Gimme some more time for this please!
Agree here. The Zod receipt would be broken maybe in not only a few cases unfortunately. But I support the increase of the base dmg as discussed extensively in the past here. We just might to discuss where the right spot would be! But I think your proposal is good!
Just for the fun of it (worst case). Maybe as some inspiration for mods or maybe we see some changes in a rondom patch (best case). I don´t mind anymore. But Blizz can´t say that the wont have a proposal ready!
2 Likes
“for the fun of it” i guess we have different ways to have fun.
i would HAVE to be putting this stuff into a mod and actually trying it out. but theorycrafting for ages on end, what is fun about that?
if there was actually that many people interested in such changes. making a bunch of them and showcasing them on YT or twitch would be sort of interesting, then we could decide if the changes are too OP and need to be toned down or what the case is. but theorycrafting for the sake of theorycrafting… i could not.
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That´s the beauty of having free choices! 
I now will have a pizza for dinner with my girlfriend while sitting in the evening sun and enjoying a cold drink too. 
omg u get to have segs too? that’s great.
for gbane i think the only other thing that could be done with it is changing ATD for 2 sockets, im kind of ok with it here since most of its defensiveness is in statuses and integer reduction. it prob ends up being a IAS/x armor but still not the BiS option.
changing spirit to +1 and keeping it as the FCR option while giving lidless the +2 but lower FCR seems pretty good.
mosers getting +1 basically makes it a viscerataunt on steriods, so i can see the reasoning for bumping viscerataunt to +2. I wouldn’t hate this actually since mosers does deserve more usage and viscerataunt would still have a place with higher block and skill point
2 Likes
Now we’re talking! 
But G-Bane. 2 OS is super great. What do you think about adding combat skills as currently proposed?
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yeah i wouldn’t mind it having some + to combat. its specific enough to not really throw it off too much
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How about FHR and buff of strength roll?..
Leviathan
Defense: 1514-1722
Req Level: 65
Req Strength: 174
+170-200% Enhanced Defense
+100-150 Defense
+40-50 To Strength
Damage Reduced By 15-25%
Indestructible
- Buffs:
- Add +20% Faster Hit Recovery
- Change Strength to +50-70
Instead of adding combat skills, how about replace ATD with 2 OS and drop req. level?..
The Gladiator’s Bane
Defense: 1255-1496
Req Level: 85
Req Strength: 111
+150-200% Enhanced Defense
+50 Defense
Cannot Be Frozen
30% Faster Hit Recovery
Poison Length Reduced By 50%
Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
Damage Reduced By 15-20
Magic Damage Reduced By 15-20
- Buffs:
- Add 2 Open Sockets
- Remove Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
- Change Required Lvl to 75
1 Like
Not sure if that makes it less niche over all. But would try that. Definitely provides more utility than now without beeing OP!
Although much more useful on paper I would prefer +3 to combat skills. That would make it useful for new barb-builds and not only foster the niche (energy shield Sorc would love it even more but does not help build diversity).
How about adding a little FRW? 10% maybe? Useful for all builds, but lowers the need for enigma a bit further?
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I think having 2 OS is more versatile for the armor and would make it customizable, such as using 40/15 jewels. This and lowering req. level is all that it really needed IMHO. Adding combat skills makes it good for only barbs.
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But then you accept that energy shield sorcs put two facets in here or two sol runes.
Ok with me! But less “unique” imho.
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Instead of combat skills, what about adding Burst of Speed as an oskill, feels thematic increasing attack and movement speed as a gladiator? This is better than CtC BoS on Hustle (level 39 RW)…
The Gladiator’s Bane
Defense: 1255-1496
Req Level: 85
Req Strength: 111
+150-200% Enhanced Defense
+50 Defense
Cannot Be Frozen
30% Faster Hit Recovery
Poison Length Reduced By 50%
Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
Damage Reduced By 15-20
Magic Damage Reduced By 15-20
- Buffs:
- Add +1-3 To Burst of Speed
- Remove Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
- Change Required Lvl to 75
1 Like
Lvl req to 75 is a stable.
So we have three variant:
- As proposed. With +3 to combat skills (barb only), but without the attacker takes p-dmg.
- 2 OS
- Burst of speed or you started with battle cry as O-skills
I think 2 OS is not helping too much in terms of build diversity so we should leave that. No 3 should be allways capped at +1 to the skill I guess. Both thematic.
Personally I´m still ok with our first proposal (we have some char bound armors like Crow Caw for Druids, Guardian Angel for pallys, Ormus for Sorcs). Provide another solid options for Barbs would be my favorite. We should remove +Def and attacker takes p-dmg. After that I would opt for battle cry. Burst of speed is good and very usefull. But we have plenty of mobility options.
Whot does others think?
?
2 Likes
Agreed. How about +1 Battle Cry as oskill and remove silly +50 Defense while lowering required level?..
The Gladiator’s Bane
Defense: 1255-1496
Req Level: 85
Req Strength: 111
+150-200% Enhanced Defense
+50 Defense
Cannot Be Frozen
30% Faster Hit Recovery
Poison Length Reduced By 50%
Attacker Takes Damage Of 20
Damage Reduced By 15-20
Magic Damage Reduced By 15-20
- Buffs:
- Add +1 To Battle Cry
- Remove +50 Defense
- Change Required Lvl to 75
2 Likes